Rating razor quality poll

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Originally Posted by gssixgun

Time is simply not the issue,,, doesn't really matter whether you are honing your razor or somebody else's it takes what it takes to get it right ..

I was more thinking Quality Build vs Sloppy Build..


A well designed, well ground, and tempered razor is a pleasure to hone and shave, where as an abortion on the hones might shave well, but it is still a sloppy build...

Note: that I am not saying anything about bad honing in the past, as that is not the razor's fault that was the loose nut behind the stone :p

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All this makes me even more amazed when you find a 19th century razor in your hand that has not been infected by a zombie honer or limped out of the factory with some issues. The improbably level seems high. Further, I wonder how the 'professional' (barbers and surgeons) handled the task of honing in the past, not to mention the Average Joe who tended his own blades.

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Originally Posted by gssixgun

I knew it was going to be hard to explain and separate the shave from the razor build :)


Here is a for instance to try and help

A certain Custom razor crossed my hones a few months back (no names but not one of the regulars on here)

The build was so far off that it took multiple layers of tape to bring the angle anywhere near 16° the spine had thickness issues besides that along with the face grind itself being uneven in thickness..

Now when I was done futzing with the whole thing it shaved like a champ :)

So if I went by the shave alone it was a good razor,,, but my adventures on the hones getting it there told me the maker was an amateur that had no clue what a true SR really was

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There you go right there, as any maker will have those corrected before shipping to a customer. Setting that first bevel is all about correcting all your errors in the final grind & my razor making skill level still has a bit of correcting...BUT if I sell a razor it is truly shave ready. It's like a badge of honor for me.

Again though, I stick with my original statement. Once you were done with all the correcting, you knew if the razor would offer a good shave or not by time you were done with it on the stones. PRoblem is that a custom razor is a whole other animal with all the different issues of "feeling right" whether it's honing, stropping, or shaving...much less the grind and HT.

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Originally Posted by WW243

All this makes me even more amazed when you find a 19th century razor in your hand that has not been infected by a zombie honer or limped out of the factory with some issues. The improbably level seems high. Further, I wonder how the 'professional' (barbers and surgeons) handled the task of honing in the past, not to mention the Average Joe who tended his own blades.

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Hone a few NOS Heavy grinds and it becomes apparent that most of the honing issues came from bad honing over the years :( They are no harder to hone and they have tiny little even bevels..


As to Honing back in the day :(

From my research

Most razors came "Proudly" honed from the factory some even claimed hair tested so the average barber and user simply was doing a re-freshen

There was an entire profession "Cutlers" that did the work of the "Pro-Honer" today they did other sharpening also

Other then that I do not have a clue :p

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Originally Posted by gssixgun

Hone a few NOS Heavy grinds and it becomes apparent that most of the honing issues came from bad honing over the years :( They are no harder to hone and they have tiny little even bevels..

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Does that mean I only have to hone a few NOS Heavy grinds to validate the truth of most honing issues have come from bad honing? Or does it mean that I need to hone thousands of NOS heavy grinds like the 4 guys on the planet at this point in time have done?

I don't think it would take that many at all. in fact you can also see it from the ones that have very little hone wear..

But of course the larger the sample the more confident you feel about the theory

I'll use my Greaves as support for your theory. Even a caveman could end up with a small, even bevel. OT, I was shaving with it a couple of days ago and was thinking, 'you know, if I drop this razor or bang it into the faucet, it cannot be replaced!'
I quickly shooed that idea out of my head. Post shave I was reaching into the cabinet behind the sink and knocked my mustache scissors off the shelf and they fell on the ceramic shaving soap dish on the back of the sink and took out a big chip....whoa

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Originally Posted by WW243

I'll use my Greaves as support for your theory. Even a caveman could end up with a small, even bevel. OT, I was shaving with it a couple of days ago and was thinking, 'you know, if I drop this razor or bang it into the faucet, it cannot be replaced!'
I quickly shooed that idea out of my head. Post shave I was reaching into the cabinet behind the sink and knocked my mustache scissors off the shelf and they fell on the ceramic shaving soap dish on the back of the sink and took out a big chip....whoa

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Whoa the bad karma effect.
I believe that I am a average hobbyist honer.
I have come to the conclusion that attention to detail, plus following the library's advise,plus asking for help and input,going to meets, has made me a better honer. Some blades I struggle to hone.
I know that this site and the people I have (met online) increased my skill set.
Listening and applying have help me tremendously.
Lest we forget the original question "Shave only vs. The Hone"
Can you take lemons and make lemonade?? I make key-lime pie.
I am sure there are other members who do the same.
Make the best of the razor,hone,and your ability.

Quite honestly if given you are doing it right and it shaves like a dream and "properly" who cares about the reaction to stones. The bottom denominator is quality of shave you are after personally. I could care less if the razor looks like junk and not picture perfect as long as it shaves like it is suppose to.

But then again, I am a total utilitarian. That is why when I see yuppies in their BMW or Lexus large 4WD SUV without one spot of dirt on it I laugh! The word that comes to mind is "posers"!

YMMV of course. But I think all are after that shave rather than how it got there for the most part. Only a few enjoy the journey to get there while the majority like the spoils of war.

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Originally Posted by Michael70

Quite honestly if given you are doing it right and it shaves like a dream and "properly" who cares about the reaction to stones. The bottom denominator is quality of shave you are after personally. I could care less if the razor looks like junk and not picture perfect as long as it shaves like it is suppose to.

But then again, I am a total utilitarian. That is why when I see yuppies in their BMW or Lexus large 4WD SUV without one spot of dirt on it I laugh! The word that comes to mind is "posers"!

YMMV of course. But I think all are after that shave rather than how it got there for the most part. Only a few enjoy the journey to get there while the majority like the spoils of war.

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I don't find the two mutually exclusive. If you want a good shave, it will need a good edge. The better the edge, the better it shaves. Case in point, I just acquired a vintage Boker. It appears to be NOS. The edge honed absolutely beautifully. It came around easily and took an extraordinary polish. As a result, it shaves like a dream. Super sharp that goes through my beard like a hot knife through butter. And is there any irritation? Not a bit. Now I have another razor that is problematic on the hones. It struggles to hold an edge, chips, and is finicky as hell. And how does it shave? Terrible.

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Originally Posted by OCDshaver

I don't find the two mutually exclusive. If you want a good shave, it will need a good edge. The better the edge, the better it shaves. Case in point, I just acquired a vintage Boker. It appears to be NOS. The edge honed absolutely beautifully. It came around easily and took an extraordinary polish. As a result, it shaves like a dream. Super sharp that goes through my beard like a hot knife through butter. And is there any irritation? Not a bit. Now I have another razor that is problematic on the hones. It struggles to hold an edge, chips, and is finicky as hell. And how does it shave? Terrible.

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And there is your answer.

If you are experienced on the hones, you will know by the end of the honing process if a razor will shave well or not. You will also know what would be the best finisher.