"Shapton Glass" In Search of the Perfect Edge

Oh crap! I went and looked at this thread. Now I am jonesin' for Shapton glass stones (and I just dropped a buck and a quarter on Belgian stones). I am a nut for precision.

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Originally Posted by icedog

Oh crap! I went and looked at this thread. Now I am jonesin' for Shapton glass stones (and I just dropped a buck and a quarter on Belgian stones). I am a nut for precision.

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To keep your HAD in check and keep some money in your wallet, I'd recommend you go for the Shapton 16K Ceramic on Glass and work backward in acquiring other grits in that line. Why? It's given me buttery smooth edges on my razors and provides very comfortable shaves for me. For the money at around $100, I think it's actually a good deal for what it does. For me it puts a better, sharper and more comfortable edge on my razors than my coticules, my Chinese 12K, and two vintage Thuringian stones. So, aside from the Chinese 12K, the other stones I mentioned if found even close to the same size as the Shapton 16K ceramic would cost way more than the Shapton.

Other new observations I've had with my Shaptons now that I've had the time to use them a little bit more:

Shapton 8000 grit ceramic on glass: Like the Norton 8000, you COULD shave with the edge off a Shapton 8000. I took a razor that was popping arm hairs and passing the HHT and shaved my cheeks and WTG pass on my neck and the razor was fine. I didn't do my chin since that's a challenge for even my sharpest razors. I thought the Shapton 8000 got the edge to that level quicker than the Norton 8000.

Shapton 16000 grit ceramic on glass: I can't say enough about how I feel about this stone. I'm tempted to get the Shapton 30K ceramic just because I have HAD and like to experiment, but I haven't explored the 16K nearly enough yet. The way I feel about the Shapton 16K is bittersweet in the sense that the edges it gives me are awesome and they seem to last a long time before needing touch ups on the 16K, but.....because I like the edges that stone has been giving me so far.....it's meant that stopping at the Chinese 12K, yellow coticule or Thuringian like before has been leaving me wanting something more. Is that a problem? For my natural polishing stones it has been! Actually, I've been going from the Shapton 8000 to the Chinese 12K mostly before finishing on the Shapton 16K (and sometimes a chromed paddle after that but not always). I've felt like I've had to do 100+ passes on the Chinese 12K. I'll be experimenting with going right from the Shapton 8000 to the 16K even though this seems like quite a jump and see what happens with that.

Shapton 4000: No soaking, harder material than the Norton 4000, no potential that I can see for the illusive and possibly overinflated "imbedded grit" problem that can seemingly affect some Norton stones, fast cutter!

I'll give reports on the lower grits later.

Chris L

My 16k is on the way. Is 5 hones Had?

- Bob

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Originally Posted by RobertFontaine

My 16k is on the way. Is 5 hones Had?

- Bob

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God help us all if it is.....

James.

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Originally Posted by RobertFontaine

My 16k is on the way. Is 5 hones Had?

- Bob

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Bob, you're on your way. You can't resist the pull of HAD! Ask Randy Tuttle what he considers to constitute HAD, he's mentioned in a post that he has over...........200 stones!

Chris L

I teach part time at the Woodworker's Club in Norwalk, CT. The shop is upstairs and down stairs is a full Woodcraft store. Well I stopped in there today for the first time in a few months (I've been having and recovering from three abdominal surgeries). I found that they now carry Shapton stones!!! I love my employee discount and I plan on using it too!

Crisl, 2Sharp, do you have the Shapton "Pond" or a holder for your stones or do you just lay them on a table? Also, do you use the stones wet or dry? Water or oil? Do you use the coarse or fine compound for lapping the stones. Last question (until the next one), I have just purchased a Belgian blue/coticule set. I don't want to have dropped that buck and a quarter for nothing so does it make sense for me to use the Belgian stones then go to Shapton 16k and up? Oh, one more last question, are you stropping after a superfine stone like 30k or 60k?

Thanks,

Brad

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Originally Posted by icedog

I teach part time at the Woodworker's Club in Norwalk, CT. The shop is upstairs and down stairs is a full Woodcraft store. Well I stopped in there today for the first time in a few months (I've been having and recovering from three abdominal surgeries). I found that they now carry Shapton stones!!! I love my employee discount and I plan on using it too!

Crisl, 2Sharp, do you have the Shapton "Pond" or a holder for your stones or do you just lay them on a table? Also, do you use the stones wet or dry? Water or oil? Do you use the coarse or fine compound for lapping the stones. Last question (until the next one), I have just purchased a Belgian blue/coticule set. I don't want to have dropped that buck and a quarter for nothing so does it make sense for me to use the Belgian stones then go to Shapton 16k and up? Oh, one more last question, are you stropping after a superfine stone like 30k or 60k?

Thanks,

Brad

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Hello Brad. I don't have the Pond but do have the stone holder. I have an aluminum tray that keeps the water confined and set the holder inside. The holder is real heavy plus is about 2" tall which keeps the stone at a good level. Always use the Shapton wet with water only. I have a small spray bottle that I use. Chris mentioned about going from 8K to 12K. I have no problem making that step. To me the Chinese 12K is a pain because it takes so many strokes and has little feedback. The 30K takes the razor one more step towards the perfect edge and I am glad I got it. Many stones in the mid and lower range can get your edge to where you want to go but I don't think any can do as well as the Shapton 16K and the 30K in the higher grit range. I do use the .5 Chromium Oxide after the 30K for the final polish. I always strop on a plain leather hanging strop before shaving.

bj

So I have been using the shapton 15k and like it alot... the question becomes how does the 16k compare to the 15k? They cost the same for the most part so is there a noticible difference in performance?

and I am at 8 stones so I guess by the 6 stone definition I would be HAD'd but man I hope not.

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Originally Posted by icedog

Crisl, 2Sharp, do you have the Shapton "Pond" or a holder for your stones or do you just lay them on a table? What a coincidence that you mention Woodcraft. I use the inexpensive stone holder they sell and it works just wonderfully. Since it's adjustable, it works for any stone I have. The one I'm referring to is HERE Also, do you use the stones wet or dry? Water or oil? I use the stone wet like BJ. I have talked quite a bit with an Australian woodworker who has also been a straight razor shaver for 20 years +. He swears by using his Shapton ceramic on glass stones to hone his razors DRY. I have not tried this. Do you use the coarse or fine compound for lapping the stones. I use the Shapton GDLP (Glass Diamond Lapping Plate) to lap all my stones to .5 micron flat. Expensive lapping plate at $280, but I wouldn't give it up for anything. It's awesome. Last question (until the next one), I have just purchased a Belgian blue/coticule set. I don't want to have dropped that buck and a quarter for nothing so does it make sense for me to use the Belgian stones then go to Shapton 16k and up? Definitely you can use the Belgian Blue and yellow coticule before going to the 16K and up. Oh, one more last question, are you stropping after a superfine stone like 30k or 60k? I do my final strop on plain smooth leather. I would say it's pretty much required; I say this because oftentimes my edges even though keen off the high grit polish stones, feel and sound a bit different after the stropping is done.

One question to you: What stone would you be referring to when you mention a 60K stone?:thinking:

Thanks,

Brad

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Originally Posted by The Topher

So I have been using the shapton 15k and like it alot... the question becomes how does the 16k compare to the 15k? They cost the same for the most part so is there a noticible difference in performance? Chris, you must be referring to the Shapton Pro Series 15K? I've never used the Pro Series stones. It looks to me like that stone is about $30 more than the ceramic on glass 16K. The common advantage touted by the Japanese style woodworkers that belong to the forum at Shaptonstones.com that I've chatted with have told me that the ceramic on glass stones are less prone to stiction. These guys when they hone their plane irons and chisels on stones they DON'T hone perpendicular/at a right angle to the stone like most razor honers do, they skew the edges at approx 45 degrees which also helps reduce stiction. I hone my razors this way, as I believe AFDavis (Alan) does. That is, I tilt the razor usually toe leading by approx 45 degrees on my stones. I have no problems with stiction on my Shapton 8K & 16K. I have tried the head on approach now and again and I find that the razor is prone to wanting to chatter a bit on the hone's surface.

and I am at 8 stones so I guess by the 6 stone definition I would be HAD'd but man I hope not.

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I'm on the fence about the 30K, but it's more of a funding issue.

Chris L

Thanks for the great answers. I had to order the Shapton 16k because the store was down to one 1000. I guess I am the last one on my block to hear about these stones. :shrug: I hve no idea what I was talking about when referring to a 60k stone.