Lacquer Over Thuringian Labels?

I have a few Thuringian stones with labels on their backs that I always worry about getting wet when I hone with them. I was just wondering what you guys thought of maybe putting a layer of lacquer over the label to seal it to the stone and eliminate the chance that it could get damaged any further.

My usual procedure is to be conscious of how much water is on the stone, as well as where it might run over the edge, but I'm just scared that a few slip ups over my lifetime might do unnecessary damage to the labels.

Do you think it would devalue the stone to have the back lacquered? Be frowned upon? Be embraced?

I believe Randy uses protection over the labels. But then I don't think he plans to ever be selling them :)
I would think a lacqueered label would be less desirable than a damaged original one, but that's pure specilation. My escher has damage on the label already, so I don't worry too much about it (well I'm not careless, just being more mindful with the water flowing around than I'm with say the nortons or the dmts)

Personally, I wouldn't buy one if someone lacquered the label.

The ink might smear with the use of lacquer, so I would be hesitant.

YMMV

steam the label off and store it.

PuFF

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Originally Posted by OLD_SCHOOL

Personally, I wouldn't buy one if someone lacquered the label.

The ink might smear with the use of lacquer, so I would be hesitant.

YMMV

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I hadn't thought of that, good point.

I'll probably wait it out for a while anyway, just to be sure it's something I want or don't want to do, before doing it.

Thanks for the input!

I used Randy's clear nail polish trick to laquer a paper label on a barber hone known as a "Perfect" hone. It's on par or even higher in grit than a 3 line Swaty (sorry, a Swaty with 3 lines of text). I think they were manufactured to look like a blue green Escher. I took a chance on it on Ebay and it actually fooled me. So....I paid too much for a barber hone, even though it's probably the ultimate barber hone.

Anyway, since it's only a barber hone, I laquered the label. I also laquered the label of the Tam O' Shanter I use. No worries now on either stone with water trouble.

BUT....I don't currently own a labeled Thuringian or Escher Thuringian. I've thought about this and decided IF it was a high dollar stone, I really don't think I'd laquer the label as much as I'm sure I'd love to. Tip toeing around a paper label is really lame and annoying and takes some of the fun out of honing for me.

Chris L

That's good info Chris, I have begun picking up barber hones here and there, I'll have to keep an eye out for a "perfect".

The funny thing is that the labels on the general Thuringians are the ones I'm most worried about as the Escher is glued very securely. The others are kinda loose in a few spots so any water that gets on them only makes it worse.

I usually don't use lots of water anyway because I like to see how the blade undercuts the small puddle in front of it, but I still worry about it when I use them. It's Kind of annoying but I'd rather be careful than careless with a razor anyhow.

I used clear nail polish on the label on a Tam with good results so far. I have thought about using Permanent Fixative on an Escher. It is a spray sold in art supply stores that protects pastel, charcoal, and pencil drawings. I am not sure how waterproof it is though. You can see varieties here.

I have 2 kinds of hones. Collectables that are not used and those that will be used. The collectables are not tampered with in any way and are stored. I have one of those. A Belgian 'Deep Rock" natural with a perfect label and box.
The others are all to be used so on them I use clear nail polish to fix the labels.
Ya gotta decide what your gonna do with'em.:)

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Originally Posted by randydance062449

Ya gotta decide what your gonna do with'em.:)

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I was relieved that the label on my blue green escher became so loose over time that I managed to get it off in one piece. That way, I don't have to decide anything. I stored away the label and the original box for safekeeping and I can use the stone without worrying about a little slip of paper that likely is responsible for doubling the value of the rock. Now I can use the hone to my heart's content and if I ever wanted to sell the it, I can re-attach the label. This might be sacrilege for glue purists (you know they're out there!:rant:) but for now I like being able to not have to decide how to use the stone.

Oh, I definitely use them. :)

I've used the Escher in question on razors, chisels, plane irons and on a few knives (it's one of the bigger ones:D).

The smaller thuringians don't get used as often because they are mostly duplicates of one another and will most likely get stored away pretty soon. This particular Escher, on the other hand, gets used frequently because it's a very fast cutter for the grit level, as far as thuringers go. I'd like to preserve the label somehow, but I'm not planning on it being an investment piece or anything, just a well kept user.

Thanks for all the input!

Concerning saving the labels on vintage hones, I have had good results using a polyurethane abrasion resistant tape. This product is used in Aviation as well as Motorsports. I is commonly referred to as "Helicopter tape" or "Leading Edge tape". I personally have used it in Professional auto racing to protect the leading edges of airfoils from track abrasion. It can be purchased through many sources-but here is one:ISC Helicopter Tape - UPR Racing Supply

I use the .008" thickness. It is VERY sticky and is similar to the laminating films for documents but MUCH heavier. I used it to protect the label on my Vintage Eschers as well as other Thuringian hones.

I generally trim approx. 1/8" off the label if it reaches the edge of the rock.Doing so will allow a strong seal and will prevent water from seeping into the label. It can also be used to cover a damaged label or to actually remove a label without destroying it and by adding an additional layer it is possible to laminate the label for safe keeping.

Since the film is so abrasion resistant it is VERY useful when honing razors-it WILL NOT abrade like ordinary electrical tape.Here is a photo of a Vintage thuringian hone that I received NOS and used the tape to preserve the label.http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b3...ht338/3015.jpg

I wonder if it would work to steam off the label and scan and reprint it out on a more waterproof paper? Or at least seal the copy on the stone so you can always go back and correct any mistake without ruining the resale value by destroying the original label.

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Originally Posted by GreeneyedGecko

I wonder if it would work to steam off the label and scan and reprint it out on a more waterproof paper? Or at least seal the copy on the stone so you can always go back and correct any mistake without ruining the resale value by destroying the original label.

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Just lacquer on the label, the method works great and is widely used by members. The resale value is not lost by applying lacquer, not that I am aware of.

OK, I recently attempted to seal an Escher with the original label that was basically complete and in fairly good condition, all things considered.
I used Mod Podge - Matte*Mate Clear Acrylic Sealer for a first coat hoping to prime the paper so as to limit the damage any hardcore/general sealer-finisher would possibly make.
I followed that with multiple coats of Rust-oleum - Crystal Clear Enamel which is the real waterproofing I would imagine.
The results are decent IMHO. Although the Mod Podge had the effect of slightly darkening the label, I think it did a good job of keeping any damage minor compared with what could/would have happened had I just used the Rust-oleum CCE. And the Rust-oleum has done a nice job of encasing the label in a nice clear protective layer that displays the label with a nice glossy look that I like. I don't know what this will do to any resale value, I am curious to know but I plan on keeping the stone so it doesn't matter too much.

I wonder if anyone knows of a good primer spray of archival quality that could be used to prepare the label for a more hardcore finish? Golden Archival Varnish is something I would like to try but I will have to order it. I bought the Krylon Matte Finish 1311 but I didn't want to use it because on the label it says it is "moisture resistant" which isn't exactly what I am needing.
Not to insult anyone, but the idea of using nail polish seems very strange to me. Basically the only reason to use it would be to save a little money, if any since nail polish isn't cheap, but to spend big $$ on a stone and then finish it with cheap sub-par materials makes no sense. Or does anyone think that nail polish would give better results than an dedicated spray finish?

I have used Shellac on my labels, and that has worked out very well.
No smearing and completely waterproof, so it will be well preserved for the remains of my days.

As to what a coating like this will do to the value of the stone, I really wouldn't know, mine will never be sold anyway;)

could you tell me the name of the shellac that you used? I am still trying to figure out the best way to accomplish this without any damage to the original label. Thanks

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Originally Posted by GreeneyedGecko

could you tell me the name of the shellac that you used? I am still trying to figure out the best way to accomplish this without any damage to the original label. Thanks

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wax free shellac will work, I used the one made by Zinsser available at Lowe's and other places.
you can also use clear nail polish , it works just fine as well.

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Originally Posted by Utopian

I was relieved that the label on my blue green escher became so loose over time that I managed to get it off in one piece. That way, I don't have to decide anything. I stored away the label and the original box for safekeeping and I can use the stone without worrying about a little slip of paper that likely is responsible for doubling the value of the rock. Now I can use the hone to my heart's content and if I ever wanted to sell the it, I can re-attach the label. This might be sacrilege for glue purists (you know they're out there!:rant:) but for now I like being able to not have to decide how to use the stone.

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If you reattach it with hide glue it would be a perfect restoration since that type of glue was likely used back then. I don't see how a glue fanatic could find fault in any way. Multi-millin dollar Strads have had their tops on and off many times for repairs over the centuries and into our own time. Hide glue is always used because it is completly reverseable. Period correct glue, period correct restoration of label. It has been around for 4000 years.

This was an old thread brought back to life.

I have used shellac, polyurethane, any clear spray made by Krylon, CA (superglue), and even clear nail polish discards from SWMBO.

CA & Nail polish is great for where labels are starting to raise up a little.

Mod Podge from Hobby Lobby is one that I will not use again as every time it gets wet it starts to look milky. I really wonder if it's not just plain old waterbased glue like we all used in school at the ripe age of 5-10 years old.

I recently applied my label on my Zulu Grey & used a spray acrylic the wife had around for her crafts. I sealed the side of the stone with two heavy coats letting each coat dry overnight. I then sprayed another heavy coat & placed the label on the stone & let dry overnight. I then sprayed another heavy coat over the label to help seal it down & repeated. Works OK, but my label didn’t stay perfectly flat and wrinkled in a few places. Next time I will seal the backside of the label somehow…