hello friends! i have some question to ask about the "nakayama slurry" : IN THE FINAL POLISHING STAGE the slurry should BE PASTEY or VERY DARK ??
i work with very dark but watery diluited slurry..........
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hello friends! i have some question to ask about the "nakayama slurry" : IN THE FINAL POLISHING STAGE the slurry should BE PASTEY or VERY DARK ??
i work with very dark but watery diluited slurry..........
From what I understand the final slurry on the stone should be from the stone, not a nagura slurry stone, and should be lighter than the previous slurries.
I have no experience with Japanese stones but .... I was on So's site today and read that he recommends using a diamond plate on very hard stones. He says that the nagura if it is softer will mix with the grit of the hone and cause scratches. So if yours is a harder stone a diamond plate might give better results. Below is a quote from So's webpage referring to diamond plates for generating slurry ;
Secret MUST item for using hard natural stones. Nagura stones cannot be used for harder natural stones, nor on various Suita stones. The polishing parcticles of Nagura is larger than the particles of super fine finishing stones, and when the stone is hard, the Nagura's particle will scratch the bevel before they are ground to smaller size. Using diamond stone to create the initial slurry, you are getting the slurry that is made of the finishing stone itself. You'd be surprised how much better result you get by this technique.
Also, when you use a Nagura on Suita stones, the coarse Nagura particles will get stuck in the Su (the holes in Suita stones) and will keep scratching the bevel, because these particles won't get ground to smaller sizes.
Jimmy , You window shopping ? :)
Nakayama Asagi is a light blue/grey stone. It cannot make a "dark" slurry.
In the polishing stage you only need a few strokes with the diamond plate & the slurry is all but invisible. Of course a thicker slurry will cut more aggressively if desired but go to very dilute at the end, almost water or just plain water. Some Asagi leave a "scratchy" looking finish with water alone but that does not necessarily impact on the shave.
:OT I am thinking of dipping my foot in the water. :hmmm:Quote:
Originally Posted by onimaru55
Resistance is futile :borg::)
Slurry use (or not) totally depends on the stone. Some work great w/ none or barely any & may have negative effects if overused; others like my Kiita absolutely must have milky slurry to work or the edge will be harsh. Mine also left significantly less sharp edges when I used a thin slurry/water only. Definitely there are Jnats out there that work better on water, but not all of them do. This is one case where the "rules" of slurry vary greatly from stone to stone.
Basically, you have to do all kinds of testing when you get yours to see how it behaves on razors. Try just water or super-light slurry & see how you like the edge. Then try JimR's method exactly as he outlines it & just see what happens. You might set your edge back; you might improve it drastically. Might work better or worse, but you'll never know until you try.
I've found it's better to not go in w/ any objective in mind when 1st testing a stone--just play around & see what you get until you figure out its properties. This usually takes me weeks when I get a new stone. :D
A small correction here, there are suita stones that do not have Su and for those one can use naguras.Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyHAD
Danzyc,
Relax. Try them. See what works with your stone. If you find that the edge isn't quite right when you don't add water, then try adding a few drops of water. If that doesn't improve it, try water only. If THAT doesn't improve, try refreshing your slurry more.
Quote:
Originally Posted by onimaru55
Oz, he's referring to the final stages of finishing slurry, which gets dark from the steel removed from the blade.
I've never had satisfactory results from a very diluted slurry or water-only finish, but I don't have your stone.
If one is truly in the final polishing stage then the slurry that one uses determines the final output. I have a very fine Asagi that I do my final polishing with and I have found that the thicker the slurry the smoother the bevel gets but it may be at the expense of keenness but there are many little tricks that one can use to tune the edge up. If you start with a thick slurry then go to water you will get very different results than if you just use a light slurry and then stop at that point, for instance. You just kinda play the process till you find one that works with the stone that you are working with and what you want in an edge. I am still in the learning process of using this Asagi but the results are very good thus far.
Take Care,
Richard
many thanks to all
refreshing the slurry would be to REMAKE THE SLURRY and DROP OFF THE OLD SLURRY? or only remake it on the old slurry??
jim generally on the japanese hone the slurry breakdown SIGNAL is the PASTE- LIKE DARK SLURRY or a simple DARK SLURRY??
thanks
I've tried both ways. It seems like making all new slurry would cut a bit faster if the razor has a way to go still, but I'll let Jim confirm that. I've actually been wondering how critical that is myself.
I'm not really sure if there is any definite "signal" that the slurry is broken down; only that by the time it gets thick, it should be. Again, I'll let Jim confirm that.
Thanx Jim, that explains it. Sounded like the OP was talking about an Aoto with dark slurry :DQuote:
Originally Posted by JimR
On the diluting & water etc. I'm sure we both use a different honing process, yours being a more traditional approach, I think, so it may not be just my stone that influences results. Just shows the versatility of these rocks.
you make your first slurry and use it until it needs change. Wash it off and make slurry again, use it and refresh again, you do that as many times as needed , for my stones 3 times is enough, then last refresh you work it untill it's dark from removed steel.Quote:
Originally Posted by danzyc
how you finish the razor? with slurry breakdowned or with water ?
It totally depends on your stone. You'll have to try & see what works best.Quote:
Originally Posted by danzyc
As far as darkness goes, I wouldn't get too hung up over it--my stone produces a dull brownish-orange slurry that gets tinged grey toward the end (It usually gets thick in 2-3 minutes if I've got the consistency right), but it certainly doesn't turn black. Pay attention to how the blade feels on the stone & how evenly hazy the bevel looks. As Jim's barber would say, "just hone!" :)
First point: I tend to make my slurry without washing, but I haven't made a real comparison of both ways. I'll work on that this weekend. But since I get good results without it, I don't know that it's critical one way or another.Quote:
Originally Posted by PA23-250
Second point: Yeah, that's it. The real signal is that keenness of the blade stops improving at a certain point, meaning the particles have lost their faster honing power. The visual cues, darkness and increasing thickness, are kind of coincidental but, since they're much easier to check for a new honer than keenness tests like HHT/AHT/TPT, I recommended them in the guide.