Necessity of ATG

Hi Again,

With much advice and help from the members on this forum, I've managed to get a really good ATG shave. I really had to map my hair growth as it's somewhat unusual, and I've also found that a pre-ATG stropping helps greatly.

I have found, though, that my beard grows really fast. I shave at night so that I am not in a hurry. I'm not much of a morning person. If I only shave WTG and ATG, I get a CCS and it lasts me until about 10-11am. By early afternoon, I have a noticeable shadow. I'm an IT guy, so I can get away with it on days I don't have meetings or presentations. However, if I do an additional ATG pass, I have a "beginner BBS" shave that looks good until nearly the end of the next day.

I've read some members have great luck doing only WTG and XTG and achieve great shaves lasting two days. Is it just my beard or am I missing something? Do some straight shavers need to do an ATG pass to stay presentable?

Andy

To stay presentable ? Maybe not but we would all have our reasons if we do ATG.
For me it is the best test of an edge I have honed. WTG & XTG is not as big a challenge.

From what I have read some guys really do need the third pass to stay smooth all day, imagine that a heavy dark beard would show through pretty quickly.

I don't think you are missing anything. Beards vary from person to person as to type and how fast they regrow, so the type and number of passes necessary also varies person to person. You just use a shave routine that suits your needs and end purpose.

Bob

This is why a shave the evening before does not work for me.

It doesn't adequately cover the 24-hours from the previous evening until the next evening and I see little reason to have the smoothest face while I sleep and an increasing stubble while I am awake.

I don't even think that I have a particularly strong beard growth; maybe it's just that I sometimes catch myself during the day subconsciously feeling my face to see how the shave is holding up.
And it's just not as good if I shaved the evening before.



B.

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Originally Posted by beluga

This is why a shave the evening before does not work for me.

It doesn't adequately cover the 24-hours from the previous evening until the next evening and I see little reason to have the smoothest face while I sleep and an increasing stubble while I am awake.

I don't even think that I have a particularly strong beard growth; maybe it's just that I sometimes catch myself during the day subconsciously feeling my face to see how the shave is holding up.
And it's just not as good if I shaved the evening before.



B.

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Yes, shaving the evening before would not work for me either for the same reasons. I don't have a dense heavy beard that shows as blue beard when it regrows but I can only get 10 to 12 hours out of a shave before I feel I need to do another even though the boss says she can't tell. I don't like feeling stubble. All that is after doing a 4 pass shave with a straight razor or Muhle R41 with a feather blade. I guess it depends on what your definition of acceptable is too.

Bob

For me, it's a carry-over from my days of BBS shaves with aggressive DE razors and blades. If I feel beard stubble my S.R. Shaves are incomplete.

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Originally Posted by feltspanky

For me, it's a carry-over from my days of BBS shaves with aggressive DE razors and blades. If I feel beard stubble my S.R. Shaves are incomplete.

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Question is how long do your shaves last till you feel you need to shave again given a BBS shave to begin with.

Bob

Gentlemen,

I prefer comfortable to perfect, especially on the neck, and shave in three passes. The first pass is always with the grain north to south; the other two passes are a combination of across the grain and against the grain. I shave every morning and my face is pure Hollywood until the next morning. For me, one of the great joys in life is to start my day with a sweet straight razor shave.

Well, when you get to be my age (>65) most of the whiskers are white or gray and I don't get a shadow, I get "highlights" which unless I'm really tan aren't a problem :rofl2:

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Originally Posted by BobH

Question is how long do your shaves last till you feel you need to shave again given a BBS shave to begin with.

Bob

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Bob my S.R. shaving technique has really improved. I can also hone and strop keen edges on my razors now. I can do a three pass shave with one of my S.R. and not feel the need to shave again before 24 hrs.

I would try using cold water. I used to have the same problem if I had to wear a uniform later at night. For me it was easier to get a good smooth shave without irritation by doing a WTG and two XTG and cold water.

I've been adapting my shaving technique the past three months. Basically I don't use an ATG unless I'm going to a special event (which hasn't occurred for a very long time) and am content with a WTG and XTG on my face with good results. The adapting is in shaving my neck where WTG and XTG just haven't done the job. After watching, randomly, barbers giving shaves, I was struck by one where the barber started by shaving the neck area ATG then WTG. My neck hairs seem to be more wiry than the rest of the face so I now start my shave, when the blade is the sharpest, with an ATG & WTG passes and then my face with the WTG & XTG passes. My neck area is now, generally, smoother than my face for a longer period of time.

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Originally Posted by feltspanky

Bob my S.R. shaving technique has really improved. I can also hone and strop keen edges on my razors now. I can do a three pass shave with one of my S.R. and not feel the need to shave again before 24 hrs.

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Nobody doubts your prowess using and maintaining a straight razor. Just wondered how long it was till you "felt" the need to shave again. That brings up what is your criteria for actually feeling the need to shave? I mean things like just feeling stubble starting to come back, actually seeing stubble again or it does not matter once you make it through the work day so you are good till next morning?

I am just saying everybody has different regrowth rates, not everybody is after a BBS and will accept comfortable over close and also the criteria is different for everyone as to when they actually feel they need a shave.

I am a bit OCD and don't like to feel stubble even though my better half can see no stubble 10-12 hours later I can feel it. So I shave but it is likely good enough to tide me over till next morning. Consider too that I shave between 0400-0500 usually when I get up.

There really can be no set standard length of time a shave should last an individual because of all the variables.

Bob

I'm with BobH and Razorfeld - beard regrowth varies and what you're after also determines the game.

If I'm doing a quick clean-up shave or in a hurry, two passes or my Sledgehammer DE will get some game time.

If it's a normal shave, I like to take the time to do a full three passes, and sometimes, just for the extra clean feeling, here's where I'm with BobH, I'll do a fourth pass to get that very smooth feeling...when I do that, I'm basically not shaving for two days...it's completely personal and things can vary, even down to the type of razor, wedge vs hollow...you get the picture. ;)

Usually after fourteen hours I begin to feel the emergence of stubble on my face. Based on my work schedule it's not convenient or necessary for me to shave for another ten hours. I totally agree that beard growth is different for each individual. The time between each individual's shave is not set in stone. It's a matter of each individual's preference and what's acceptable.

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Originally Posted by feltspanky

Usually after fourteen hours I begin to feel the emergence of stubble on my face......
I totally agree that beard growth is different for each individual.

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That's about when I begin to feel my stubble reemerge too.


But it's not only that, there is also a noticeable difference in opinion among shavers when it becomes necessary to shave again.

A stubble that one shaver might feel necessary to remove before going out for dinner may be perfectly acceptable to someone else.



B.

You need to shave in the morning.

My morning routine is a 3 pass, 2 with 1 against and ATG cleanup with water, 10-15 min start to finish, including stropping, cleaning and drying.

As said you need a keen razor.

Practice speeding it up and shave in the morning and face lather to save time.

I am a one pass guy, I get a good close comfortable shave that lasts the whole day.It makes no difference if I add two more passes, I will still have to shave the next morning.

I don't have a job that requires a clean shave. Granted I have a fairly thick beard but if I get it good on the with the grain then the against the grain is just water and blade and a few min. I do kind of blend my WTG and XTG in one lather, but that is partly because of the different directions my hair grows in from my sideburn to my chin. Almost has a paper fan pattern in that the direction my facial hair grows kind of points at my jaw just below my ear. So I take a two for one pass and then with just water hit the ATG. I don't get too picky though, because if I got that swirl that I have on my neck to where I couldn't feel the hair at all then I probably lost too much skin.

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Originally Posted by GrimClippers

I would try using cold water. I used to have the same problem if I had to wear a uniform later at night. For me it was easier to get a good smooth shave without irritation by doing a WTG and two XTG and cold water.

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This applies to me as well but only on touch ups on the neck just below the jaw line. XTG gets as close as I need to look presentable for the day with exception of under the jaw line and I only go ATG everywhere else when the Mrs is frisky and wants a true BBS surface to work with rather than the clean but rugged feeling XTG gives.

100 shaves from now this will have all sorted out for most...

Obie speaks truth to power...hope that you can hang on to comfort no matter what..

Cold water shaving can be your friend - many of us who have tried it have never turned back.

Those smiling blades, like the Robert Williams SRP LE...can do amazing things to those pesky swirly hairs on the throat - just sayin'

With a Cart I am looking pretty scruffy in 12 hours. Using a straight, cold water I'm 12 hours on this AM's shave and as my Barber would say: "ready for that appearance Mr. C" - I can feel the stubble with a little pressure but the SWMBO says I would be allowed in public with her - for at least a couple of hours.

With practice the problem areas get smaller and smaller and the amount of time/passes you need becomes less. You just have to try every trick in the book and then make up a few of your own, its part of the fun.

I make a North to South pass, but change the direction and angle (heel forward, heel back) based on working on each area. I say north to south but some of it is WTG and some of it is XTG.
Then a South to North, again adjusting as I go - a mixture of XTG, ATG for the most part.
Then a clean up, I lather the jaw line/chin and down. Using buffing, angles and directional two finger stretching (short buffing strokes in between the thumb and forefinger to stretch and tension opposite the direction of growth for a small area(s)

Buffing, sweeping (like a windshield wiper) and heel forward "snow plow" - none of which I even think about any more - it just becomes part of the muscle memory after a few hundred shaves - as it will for you.

A great edge is a must, and with practice you will be amazed at what a basic stropping can do to bring an edge back. Recently I picked up one of my first Whipped Dog razors and gave it the strop and shave test. I was amazed with the results, I remembered setting it aside because I though that I had rolled the edge. It was just new shaver bad stropping - not destructive, just not giving the edge the right basic care (all my bad)

Smooth Shaving...and do enjoy the journey...

I work with a 26 yr old bloke who shaves in a morning before work. By lunchtime, he has a 5 o'clock shadow! By 5, you'd swear he hadn't shaved that day. He can grow a full, impressive beard in about a week. The boss has even suggested he shave again at lunchtime!

Convert in the making?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Razorfeld

I've been adapting my shaving technique the past three months. Basically I don't use an ATG unless I'm going to a special event (which hasn't occurred for a very long time) and am content with a WTG and XTG on my face with good results. The adapting is in shaving my neck where WTG and XTG just haven't done the job. After watching, randomly, barbers giving shaves, I was struck by one where the barber started by shaving the neck area ATG then WTG. My neck hairs seem to be more wiry than the rest of the face so I now start my shave, when the blade is the sharpest, with an ATG & WTG passes and then my face with the WTG & XTG passes. My neck area is now, generally, smoother than my face for a longer period of time.

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I do this as well, and with cold water, and it works great for me!!

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Originally Posted by Walterbowens

I do this as well, and with cold water, and it works great for me!!

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Is there any other way but the cold water shave? OK, don't everybody that shaves warm/hot jump on me. To each their own, YMMV, I Did It My Way and all that. I'm only commiserating with a fellow CW shaver.