If I were starting over . . .

I think I would STILL purchase a DE to get me started in the traditional shaving arena, but nothing too fancy, especially if the end goal was to get into Straight Razors. I would use my time shaving with the DE to gain an appreciation for the sharper edges while perusing this site for videos on Straights and lurking the classifieds and other for a to learn as much as I could. This also allows you to acquire the other hardware and software needed before jumping into Straight razor shaving.

I would NOT buy a new production razor as my first blade. Not that there was anything wrong with the razor I did purchase, but there are simply SO MANY cheaper options available to those starting out that I think it is foolish to do otherwise. The quality of the vintage "shave ready" blades on offer, even in just the Classifieds here, is equal to any lower priced production blade you will find on the market. The money I spent on my first razor could have purchased TWO razors on the secondary market.

Anyway . . . these are just a couple thoughts from a fairly recent convert to Straights. The ramblings were worth what it cost you to read them, and I hope you found them illuminating.

Aside from my short stint with the the straight razor in my early 20's which ended in failure due to my ignorance about maintenance, The DE rekindled my love for the Wet Shaving experience. DE shaving set me up with the foundation needed to make the leap back into the SR world with understanding of the processes involved, prep, lather, angles, beard growth direction and so on. I think in retrospect i could of bought 2 or 3 good serviceable vintage blades that were honed with love by its previous owner to start my journey back into straight shaving. Instead I found myself at the door of a large retailer and paid way too much for a Thiers Issard which was neither ready to shave and had all sorts of geometric issues that needed to be dealt with also. A daunting task to say the least for a new guy wanting to give it another go. Good thing I was stubborn this time and got through it but it meant buying some other Straights from reputable vendors here to get it done. So again I will beat the drum in favor of a good shave ready razor whether that means brand new or a secondary market for the new guy starting out. Reputation of source is key and I am happy we have many choices in our community. Outside its the wild west.

It has been a good time for me. Perhaps I too would have spent less on new blades, and should have spent less on the vintage blade I bought early on. We live and learn. I think if I had spent less on razors and more on going to meets it would also have been a smarter move. All in all it has been good. DE razors are scary items. I have gotten a few bad cuts from razors over time and none of them have been from straight razors.

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Originally Posted by RezDog

It has been a good time for me. Perhaps I too would have spent less on new blades, and should have spent less on the vintage blade I bought early on. We live and learn. I think if I had spent less on razors and more on going to meets it would also have been a smarter move. All in all it has been good. DE razors are scary items. I have gotten a few bad cuts from razors over time and none of them have been from straight razors.

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^^ I'm with what Shaun said...;)^^

I suppose if all you shaved with from the start were multi blade cart razors and crap in a can a DE would be a good way into traditional wet shaving at low cost. It will tech you about pressure and getting a good angle on the blade as well as allow you learn to make a good lather from a brush and soap. Fortunately I started shaving before cart razors were readily available.

If you go with a new straight razor or a used one the key thing is to get one that is truly shave ready. A used vintage razor does have the advantage of being less costly though. I started with vintage blades and had them pro honed. No regrets there.

Attending meets or having a local mentor could help immensely and greatly shorten your learning curve. Wish I would have been able to have those benefits.

Quickly came to the conclusion I'd have to learn how to hone my own at the rate I was dulling blades as a beginner. Just too expensive to keep sending the blades out especially when accumulating more vintage blades all the time. That was a long hard road without the benefits of going to meets or a local mentor. You do what you gotta do, so no regrets in the end.

Bob

IMHO starting with a DE will be a good way to learn direction of growth and also gentle touch on strokes. Skills that can be transferred to SR shaving later.

If I were to do it over again, I would have started much sooner.

40 plus years with a DE, only time I ever used a plastic job was in an emergency , I had my DE with me in the military even. I know this it taught me a lot about the skills you need with a straight , proper angle, touch, and stretching. Plus the lather part. I did try a straight back in the 70,s and like most had a bad time , not the amount of info that we have now , plus the only one I could find was a knife guy who really ruined my shave experience ,, tc

I started with two Wacker 4/8ths, and the full Castle Forbes line.

Today, I would start with a GEM Open Comb Micromatic (commonly referred to as OCMM), the full Baume.be, Esbjerg, or Meißner Tremonia line, and probably stick there.

The vintage single edge ("SE") razors put every DE razor to shame. Including the Pils line. There really is only one type of blades, so you can blissfully skip the fanboy stage of "oh, look, Ma, my new DE blade is somehow different from the previous one".

An SE in the hands of a capable user will also give any cut-throat razor a run for its money. But while you can master an SE in a few weeks's time, a cut-throat will take much longer. And that is not mentioning money wasted on "oh, look, you totally need that $INSERT_HYPED_BRAND_DU_JOUR razor".

So, $200 for preshave, soap, and aftershave. $200 for a Thäter brush. $10 for a GEM. $20 for 100 blades lasting a few years. Done.

Yes, life can be as simple as that.

Well, life can be simpler than that and cheaper too. I never knew anyone using a pre shave of any sort till I got on these forums and I still don't. An Arko or Palmolive shave stick will do just fine for a soap and drug store AS like Aqua Velva will do the job also. Add a decent serviceable boar brush and for about 20 bucks you are good to go. These will allow you a good comfortable shave without the $ INSERT_HYPED_BRAND_DU_JOUR soap, AS or brush.

I somehow easily and comfortably survived at least 45 years of shaving without any expensive gear. After joining these shaving forums I have tried more expensive soaps and brushes and come the conclusion that although they are nice to have they are not a total necessity in actually getting a smooth comfortable shave.

Bob

Truer words were never spoken, Bob. A Jeep or a Lada would get the job done when I need to go off-road. Yet still, I opted for a Tata. Why? It looks better (well, that one was easy), it smells better (that one was really easy), and in a squeeze, it will get me from A to B, no questions asked.

Is the Tata a better car? I don't know. I've never really put a Lada or Jeep to the test. And why would I? I own a car that will work, no matter what terrain I throw at it.

Shaving paraphernalia are the same. A good preshave soap will de-grease the skin, soften the follicles, and make the ensuing shave more comfortable. Does everyone need one? I don't know. But if you do, it will be there for you. Same for the soap, aftershave, and brush.

Some people get by with a Jeep or a Lada. Me, I don't bother. Forewarned is forearmed. I'll simply get the best stuff available, and be done wit it.

As an aside, your boar brush will cost you over time. It will eat a lot of soap. If you deprive yourself of the privilege of owning a high class product, that's all nice and dandy. ARKO costs about as much as a pack of breath mints. Smells the same, plus some of the native flavour. Good stuff, really, if you like Turkey.

But if you want the perfect shave, it just won't cut it. Pardon the pun.

I would just Commision Bruno and Glen to build me a 7 day set of customs to begin with and be done,after all the searching , they seem to be what I reach for all the time.

On the more practical side , 2 Blue Steel Kinfolks , haven't found anything that takes and holds a nicer edge.

Start off with the Kanayama strop and pick up a Pixelfixed and Walleyeman brush and a jar of Martin de Candre soap , stop there and I would be good. YMMV. Tc

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Originally Posted by RobinK

Truer words were never spoken, Bob. A Jeep or a Lada would get the job done when I need to go off-road. Yet still, I opted for a Tata. Why? It looks better (well, that one was easy), it smells better (that one was really easy), and in a squeeze, it will get me from A to B, no questions asked.

Is the Tata a better car? I don't know. I've never really put a Lada or Jeep to the test. And why would I? I own a car that will work, no matter what terrain I throw at it.

Shaving paraphernalia are the same. A good preshave soap will de-grease the skin, soften the follicles, and make the ensuing shave more comfortable. Does everyone need one? I don't know. But if you do, it will be there for you. Same for the soap, aftershave, and brush.

Some people get by with a Jeep or a Lada. Me, I don't bother. Forewarned is forearmed. I'll simply get the best stuff available, and be done wit it.

As an aside, your boar brush will cost you over time. It will eat a lot of soap. If you deprive yourself of the privilege of owning a high class product, that's all nice and dandy. ARKO costs about as much as a pack of breath mints. Smells the same, plus some of the native flavour. Good stuff, really, if you like Turkey.

But if you want the perfect shave, it just won't cut it. Pardon the pun.

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The point is you can make it as simple as you want or as complicated as you want. Once you satisfy the necessities the rest is luxury but not strictly necessary. The choice is always personal. I think people can delude themselves if they can't get the job done, in this case smooth comfortable shave with the basics, that throwing money at it will make a huge difference. Most problems are operator error not equipment failure.

Nothing wrong with chasing the shave nirvana, whatever that is in the users mind. Oth a good smooth serviceable shave does not require a lot of expensive equipment just skill. You have to make allowances for special conditions like skin that is more sensitive than normal though.

Bob

If I were starting over with straight razors, I'd just buy one good quality straight razor and use that exclusively. For myself, I bought a DOVO Palisander from The Superior Shave, which I consider to be my main blade. But, then I rapidly bought 2 more straights, a shavette and a DE. I bought a Whipped Dog razor so I'd have something cheap to practice on as I moved through each phase of straight razor advancement. Turned out to be unnecessary. I bought a vintage smiling blade to try a different sort of edge - turned out to not be the best for me (a fat face doesn't need a smile). I bought a shavette to know what straight shaving with a truly sharp blade is, but shaving with a shavette and a straight razor are two different things. I'd prefer if I'd just stuck with the DOVO alone for a couple years, if not forever. (In general I'd try to be a bit more minimalistic, but in truth, I'm suffering through a bout of RAD/HAD right now and I'm sure my collection will grow).

As for soaps...I've gotten a few since this journey began. I shaved for decades with just one puck of something. When that ran out, I'd go and get another puck of something. Now that I've developed a supply chain for getting soaps to Taiwan (there's almost nothing available locally), I'm enjoying having a range of choices. No change here.

The biggest change is that I would have started with a DE instead of a straight. I totally love DE shaving, thing is, if I'd found DE shaving first I'm not sure I'd ever have started straight razor shaving....so, I don't know if I'd really want to change this or not.

What would I do different? Nothing. It's all been a tonne of fun and still is. Too many razors, too many hones, too many soaps, creams, aftershave, too many brushes, too many strops.

In the words of Maxwell smart: And loving it!

James.

This thread got me thinking back about how it all started for me and what I would have done differently. To my surprise, I was able to find my first posts on the straightrazorplace yahoo group I had joined when I was a poor university student back in 2003. Namely, my first straight razor newbie experience.

I bought a straight razor kit off a forum member, consisting of a dovo prima ebony 5/8, a wide dovo strop and a barber hone. I was able to keep that going for a couple of years, before getting more razors and stuff.

If I were starting over, I wish I would have been able to find someone who is very experienced to show me the ropes hands on. Namely stropping technique and to inspect my edge to see if it is really shave ready and at its full potential. It would have shaved off a good 6 months off my learning curve. My barber at the time was experienced with straights, but was reluctant to share his knowledge. The straight razor meet ups were very helpful in acquiring that hands on knowledge, but that only came 5 years later.

We are very lucky today to have such a large and globally widespread community.

Oh and I almost forgot. I wish I would have discovered the joys of the coticule earlier on in my journey.

The only thing I would change would be to start with a 3" wide strop.

And maybe add a hot towel steamer to the bathroom. (SWMBO still won't let me do that) :)

The 3" strop is an excellent point. And a modular one, too. Like SRD's Natural. The perfect beginner strop.

We're all different and what somebody else would prefer is probably not going to be my choice.

I'd probably get a different first razor than I did, a much nicer one, but I still got those later so it doesn't really matter that much. I still would like to personally experience the wide range of equipment that I did, so whether in the same order or in different one is a secondary concern.

Skipping the whole journey and starting exactly where I want to end is not for me as that skips the whole wealth of knowledge.

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Originally Posted by RobinK

I started with two Wacker 4/8ths, and the full Castle Forbes line.

Today, I would start with a GEM Open Comb Micromatic (commonly referred to as OCMM), the full Baume.be, Esbjerg, or Meißner Tremonia line, and probably stick there.

The vintage single edge ("SE") razors put every DE razor to shame. Including the Pils line. There really is only one type of blades, so you can blissfully skip the fanboy stage of "oh, look, Ma, my new DE blade is somehow different from the previous one".

An SE in the hands of a capable user will also give any cut-throat razor a run for its money. But while you can master an SE in a few weeks's time, a cut-throat will take much longer. And that is not mentioning money wasted on "oh, look, you totally need that $INSERT_HYPED_BRAND_DU_JOUR razor".

So, $200 for preshave, soap, and aftershave. $200 for a Thäter brush. $10 for a GEM. $20 for 100 blades lasting a few years. Done.

Yes, life can be as simple as that.

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I have to say Robin that I bought a gem G-bar and I was very pleasantly surprised with it and I agree that the shave is very good too.
I would say that an expensive brush isn't 100% necessary though, my $15 boars are good enough for me. But I am happy to agree to differ on that one.

Thanks. I think SEs are vastly underrated. For me, they deliver shaves en par with a cut-throat shave, but sans the hassle of maintenance. Now, cut-throat razors are a hobby of mine, and I don't mind the hassle. But early in the morning, they are a non starter. So, yes, I wish I had skipped the DE phase, started with SEs, and opted for the right cut-throat razor when I began. Nothing wrong with trying everything, James, but in the beginning, one should have the right tools to avoid an unnecessarily steep learning curve. 4/8ths razors, Wacker or not, were a terrible choice.

Brushes... I am currently wading my way through a quagmire of so called artisan soaps. No way I would use a badger for this, because these products have been scented with cheap oils that cling. So, I am currently stuck with a synthetic brush. Does it work? Yes. Does it ooze luxury? No. Does it perform as well as my badger brushes? No. But, badger brushes do not need to be expensive. I expect my Thäter brushes to outlive me. I cannot say that for any other badger brush I've used, Simpson and Plisson in particular. If you divide the $150 for a Thäter by thirty years, it's not expensive. Your boar brush? You will need at least five during those thirty years, during which time they will have eaten a few hundred dollars in soaps and creams because of their relatively poor efficiency. Are they cheap? Only if you discard longevity and efficiency. ;)

What would I do differently? Easy... Nothing! I've always wet shaved, but the cartridges were just a stepping stone to where I am now. My journey has had ups and downs, but I've learnt from everything. Love my straights and will never stop using them.

Do I have enough stuff? Definitely. I've got enough creams, brushes, shave balms etc to last me the next 50 years! But so what? You never know how good something is, whether it be a brush, cream, strop, stone, until you've had something of lesser quality to compare it to. We live and learn! I'll still buy more! Can't help myself. Never has it been truer... YMMV!!