Preparing for straight razor shaving

Hello all,

I don't typically post "introduction" threads on forums but thought I might break my own rule here after browsing around. So, hello! I first got the notion of getting into straight razor shaving a few weeks ago... Shaving has always been, well, a real pain in the ass for me, and a very uncomfortable experience, such that I try to shave as little as possible without drawing undue attention at work. I had a straight razor shave a year or so ago at one of the Art of Shaving places and it was the best I'd ever had. As I was pondering spending $40 on another package of Gilette blades, I decided to look into alternatives.

There is a ton of information out there and sorting though it is somewhat daunting, but after some research I plunked down some cash for a TI razor, Dovo strop, some Taylor cream and aftershave, and a relatively inexpensive Vulfix brush. The razor was shipped off to Lynn for sharpening last week and so right now I am in the "anticipatory" stage.

I have been working on wetshaving technique in the meantime with the brush and the cream. Already I enjoy it more than using the "Edge" gel that I've used all my life (I began shaving relatively early). Yesterday I thought I managed to get a decent lather up, but after viewing a YouTube video demonstration, I think I used far too little water. I only bought a small tube of cream and so I need to get a tub or two, I think.

Here are some questions or things that have crossed my mind...

1) I purchased a small tube of Taylor's cream and I like it, although I'd like to try some others. Reading through these forums, some people seem to prefer soap, others cream, and some use soap regularly and then cream for special occasions. Some say the razor "glides" better with the soap, but another article I read referred to cream being the lubricant of choice. Should I get some soap for comparison and if so, are there any soaps in particular to consider? Does soap really last that much longer than a tub of cream?

2) Regarding soaps, I've seen some listed as "triple-milled", some "glycerin-based"... Are those different?

3) Is it necessary to store the razor somewhere other than the bathroom, due to concerns about humidity and rust?

4) Regarding stropping, some say to use the linen/canvas, some say they don't bother... Some say linen first and then the leather side, others the reverse... Some say 15 passes, some 30, some 60... Help! Lots of conflicting info.

5) Same for honing or "touching up" the blade - how quickly should I expect to need to somehow touch up (via strop and some sort of paste, I guess) or re-hone the blade? I know that a dull blade is a bad thing (heck, I've known that since Boy Scouts!) but I don't know what to expect in terms of the amount of shaving that can occur before needing to somehow touch up the blade.

A lot of the material I have read touches upon many of the questions above, but often the information is somewhat conflicting, so I figured it was worth a try to ask here. I've already had a lot of responses to a question I posted earlier about hanging the strop, so thanks - I may be heading over to the hardware store for a hook.

Anyway, thanks to Lynn and friends for providing a place to learn about this art, and thanks to the members for being a friendly and helpful lot. It's a shame that this sort of knowledge isn't passed down anymore, but luckily with the advent of the Internet, it's easier to share it.

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Originally Posted by mental

Hello all,

I don't typically post "introduction" threads on forums but thought I might break my own rule here after browsing around. So, hello! I first got the notion of getting into straight razor shaving a few weeks ago... Shaving has always been, well, a real pain in the ass for me, and a very uncomfortable experience, such that I try to shave as little as possible without drawing undue attention at work. I had a straight razor shave a year or so ago at one of the Art of Shaving places and it was the best I'd ever had. As I was pondering spending $40 on another package of Gilette blades, I decided to look into alternatives.

There is a ton of information out there and sorting though it is somewhat daunting, but after some research I plunked down some cash for a TI razor, Dovo strop, some Taylor cream and aftershave, and a relatively inexpensive Vulfix brush. The razor was shipped off to Lynn for sharpening last week and so right now I am in the "anticipatory" stage.

I have been working on wetshaving technique in the meantime with the brush and the cream. Already I enjoy it more than using the "Edge" gel that I've used all my life (I began shaving relatively early). Yesterday I thought I managed to get a decent lather up, but after viewing a YouTube video demonstration, I think I used far too little water. I only bought a small tube of cream and so I need to get a tub or two, I think.

Here are some questions or things that have crossed my mind...

1) I purchased a small tube of Taylor's cream and I like it, although I'd like to try some others. Reading through these forums, some people seem to prefer soap, others cream, and some use soap regularly and then cream for special occasions. Some say the razor "glides" better with the soap, but another article I read referred to cream being the lubricant of choice. Should I get some soap for comparison and if so, are there any soaps in particular to consider? Does soap really last that much longer than a tub of cream?

2) Regarding soaps, I've seen some listed as "triple-milled", some "glycerin-based"... Are those different?

3) Is it necessary to store the razor somewhere other than the bathroom, due to concerns about humidity and rust?

4) Regarding stropping, some say to use the linen/canvas, some say they don't bother... Some say linen first and then the leather side, others the reverse... Some say 15 passes, some 30, some 60... Help! Lots of conflicting info.

5) Same for honing or "touching up" the blade - how quickly should I expect to need to somehow touch up (via strop and some sort of paste, I guess) or re-hone the blade? I know that a dull blade is a bad thing (heck, I've known that since Boy Scouts!) but I don't know what to expect in terms of the amount of shaving that can occur before needing to somehow touch up the blade.

A lot of the material I have read touches upon many of the questions above, but often the information is somewhat conflicting, so I figured it was worth a try to ask here. I've already had a lot of responses to a question I posted earlier about hanging the strop, so thanks - I may be heading over to the hardware store for a hook.

Anyway, thanks to Lynn and friends for providing a place to learn about this art, and thanks to the members for being a friendly and helpful lot. It's a shame that this sort of knowledge isn't passed down anymore, but luckily with the advent of the Internet, it's easier to share it.

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I will take a shot at these:

1. I would say to start with the cream and learn to use it well. In my experience creams are generally easier to get a good latherwith than a soap (unless it is a quality soap). Both soaps and creams will work equally well when they are used properly. Check out the badgerandblade forums for some great tutorials on how to make lather with both cream and soap.

2. I don't really know much about the different soap making processes; however, I do know that the expensive high end soaps are usually tripple milled. Although I am not sure what this means, it seems that it is a good thing.

3. It would be a good idea to store the razor somewhere else because of the reasons that you described. Also completely dry the razor and then let the razor air dry for 5-10 min before putting it away. Oiling the razor is usually not necessary unless you plan to store the razor for a long period of time.

4. In my experience the linen is optional/not necessary; however, some people really like it. Use the linen before the leather if you are going to use it. 20 passes on the linen and 30-50 passes on the leather with good technique should be sufficient. It is really the quality of the passes, not the quanity that you should be focusing on though. In my experience you cannot overstrop a razor, but you can understrop it and you can dull the edge if you don't use good technique. Go slow and pay attention to what you are doing.

5. This really is very hard to quantify because it really depends on many factors including your stropping skills, sharpness of the edge, beard toughness, shaving technique, number of passes, tollerance for a dull blade, etc. Lynn says that you should be able to get 3-6 months out of his edges before having to touch up, many people say that they need to do a light touch up every few weeks. I think that you should be able to get at least a month (probably more) out of a Lynn honed before you even need to think of a touch up, otherwise you need to work on your stropping. The simple answer is that your razor will need to be touched up when it starts to pull more than you like and stropping will not bring it back.

Hopefully this helps you out a little. If you have not already done so, I highly recommend you purchase Lynn's DVD in the buy/sell forum as it will answer all your questions including the ones that you have not thought of yet. Have fun.

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Originally Posted by mental

...
Here are some questions or things that have crossed my mind...

1) I purchased a small tube of Taylor's cream and I like it, although I'd like to try some others. Reading through these forums, some people seem to prefer soap, others cream, and some use soap regularly and then cream for special occasions. Some say the razor "glides" better with the soap, but another article I read referred to cream being the lubricant of choice. Should I get some soap for comparison and if so, are there any soaps in particular to consider? Does soap really last that much longer than a tub of cream?

2) Regarding soaps, I've seen some listed as "triple-milled", some "glycerin-based"... Are those different?

3) Is it necessary to store the razor somewhere other than the bathroom, due to concerns about humidity and rust?

4) Regarding stropping, some say to use the linen/canvas, some say they don't bother... Some say linen first and then the leather side, others the reverse... Some say 15 passes, some 30, some 60... Help! Lots of conflicting info.

5) Same for honing or "touching up" the blade - how quickly should I expect to need to somehow touch up (via strop and some sort of paste, I guess) or re-hone the blade? I know that a dull blade is a bad thing (heck, I've known that since Boy Scouts!) but I don't know what to expect in terms of the amount of shaving that can occur before needing to somehow touch up the blade.

A lot of the material I have read touches upon many of the questions above, but often the information is somewhat conflicting, so I figured it was worth a try to ask here. I've already had a lot of responses to a question I posted earlier about hanging the strop, so thanks - I may be heading over to the hardware store for a hook.

Anyway, thanks to Lynn and friends for providing a place to learn about this art, and thanks to the members for being a friendly and helpful lot. It's a shame that this sort of knowledge isn't passed down anymore, but luckily with the advent of the Internet, it's easier to share it.

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Hi Mental and welcome :)

I'm not a soap expert (I always use cream) but I think it's a personal choice - whatever works best for you. So I'd say get some soap for comparison so you can decide what you like better. From what I gather, there's soaps and there's soaps. People here swear by either Colleen (Churley) or Sue (mammabear). Contacting either of them might help answer your second question too (I have no idea, but suspect that triple milled and glycerin-based are different :shrug: )

3. I've never found it necessary to store my razors anywhere other than the bathroom. As long as it's well-ventilated it should be OK.

4. Never owned a strop with a linen side, but in reading posts of others who do, I think linen followed by leather is the norm. Personally, I've never felt the want of a linen side on my strops - all leather has always worked well for me. Somewhere around the 30 return trip mark seems to work fine.

5. Again, there's no hard and fast rule for touch ups on the hone/pasted strop. Learning some sharpness tests (Xman's "In the Deep End" blog has an excellent introduction to the major sharpness tests) is a good idea, and using them before a shave can indicate whether a touch up is required. Of course, so can a shave! Depending on your beard type, blade type, shaving frequency, and stropping technique, your blade could go from a few days (bad stropping - been there, done that!) to a few months before it needs attention.

One of the reasons the info can seem conflicting is that a lot of this varies for each individual, either because of natural variability in individuals or because of personal preferences. One of the best things about straight shaving is finding your own way IMHO (with help and guidance, of course).

Good luck :tu

James.

I will purchase the DVD, thanks. One interesting thing is that while I typically NEVER shave on the weekends, I found myself shaving yesterday just to get some practice with the cream/brush and smell that lovely sandalwood smell. My wife probably thinks I'm nuts (well, she's probably thought that for a long time, just "more nuts than usual" perhaps).

I saw those Moss Scuttles for cream and I'm seriously thinking about getting one. Right now I'm using a cereal bowl; it was either that, or one of my kid's bowls, and somehow having Dora the Explorer peering up at me from behind lather seemed like it would detract from the experience. ;)

Oh yeah, while I'm at it, what's popular/recommended for after the shave? I got some of the Taylor gel with witch hazel and it seems pretty good. I've seen recommendations for Skin Food, bay rum, and of course the various manufacturers have a plethora of other products...

Well, I haven't received my razor yet but I have been practicing the "wetshaving" and doing a little experimentation. Even with my current razor, the shaves seem better, with fewer nicks. Definitely more enjoyable, although now I realize what a pain it is to have 3-4 blades stacked on top of each other because of how quickly they fill up with whiskers and lather. I do have a really hard time getting good, hot water and while I have adjusted the water heater, I do have small children and am trying to keep the temp no greater than 118-120 farenheit to prevent any injuries due to scalding. I may have to find an alternate method, like boiling water before the shower, or something. I think the lack of truly hot water is hurting the process.

I thought I would end up saving money because of not needing to purchase the disposeable blades, but as I purchase different creams/aftershaves and scan EBay for razor auctions as well as the B/S/T forum, I am slowly realizing that this may not be the case... I am looking for less expensive razors because I realize I will need to work on honing. A pasted strop and a hone are probably in my future.

Looking forward to receiving my razor and Lynn's DVD so that I can get started with the actual shaving.

Well, using good brush, cremes/soaps, aftershaves is certainly more expensive than not using them, but as you noticed it makes you enjoy shaving. Getting this better experience will cost you money.
However saving money on gillette cartridges is certainly possible. The cheapest option is switching to double-edge razor. It would cost you probably 20-30 for the razor and .25/razor blade.
Going to a straight razor is both more expensive and hader. Is it worth for you - only you can say. If you are just trying to save money it may not be optimal. If you want to try the experience of using a straight razor I'd say buying a shave ready razor and a strop is worth while (you can always resell it back here for not too much of a loss). If you're not sure you'd like to go long term with straight razors I think it's better to hold on purchasing hone, pastes, junk razor, since it's additional investment in money and time that you don't need to make for a while.

I think you don't want hotter watter either. Too hot of a watter will damage your brush. You can heat it a tad bit more in the microwave if you like, but don't go nuts.

Cheers

Thanks for the advice. I've purchased the initial straight razor/strop already, but I probably won't purchase much more beyond what I already have until I get the chance to actually shave with the straight.

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Originally Posted by mental

1) I purchased a small tube of Taylor's cream and I like it, although I'd like to try some others. Reading through these forums, some people seem to prefer soap, others cream, and some use soap regularly and then cream for special occasions. Some say the razor "glides" better with the soap, but another article I read referred to cream being the lubricant of choice. Should I get some soap for comparison and if so, are there any soaps in particular to consider? Does soap really last that much longer than a tub of cream?

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I think soap lasts longer. Try Colleens soaps they are awesome and easy to use. Also mama bear Sue has the hugest selection of scents out there. Thats the real advantage of soap it comes in more varieties

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Originally Posted by mental

2) Regarding soaps, I've seen some listed as "triple-milled", some "glycerin-based"... Are those different?

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These are different, made with different processes. In the thread on Colleens soap she explains the difference in detail. So once you have read the hundred pages of posts you will have learned the answer and also forgotten it just like the rest of us LOL:o

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Originally Posted by mental

3) Is it necessary to store the razor somewhere other than the bathroom, due to concerns about humidity and rust?

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Some do. I keep mine in the drawer in the bathroom all the time with no ill effects.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mental

4) Regarding stropping, some say to use the linen/canvas, some say they don't bother... Some say linen first and then the leather side, others the reverse... Some say 15 passes, some 30, some 60... Help! Lots of conflicting info.

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Yes lots of conflicting information out there. I can only tell you what works for me. I do 25 on the linen (roughly) then 30-40 (roughly) on the leather.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mental

5) Same for honing or "touching up" the blade - how quickly should I expect to need to somehow touch up (via strop and some sort of paste, I guess) or re-hone the blade? I know that a dull blade is a bad thing (heck, I've known that since Boy Scouts!) but I don't know what to expect in terms of the amount of shaving that can occur before needing to somehow touch up the blade.

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I touch up the blade when it needs it. Thats the only way can describe it. It starts to dull and pull a little so it needs a touch up on a barbers hone in my case or on a pasted paddle for others. I need to do this more often for some razors than others so its kind of an individual thing.


goo luck when you get your razor back!! Sounds like you are off to a great start. By the way if you want to save $$$ you have almost all you will need to shave comfortably for the rest of your life. If you get hooked on razors or any of the other collectibles in this hobby you can soon go broke. I think I will break even in a decade or so provided I only buy the soaps or cremes I need between now and then.

I have to recommend Colleen's soaps, as well. I think she currently has her last sale of the summer, if any of her new scents get your fancy.
Plus the soaps you can use with any kind of shaving you end up (unless you don't like them but there's plenty of soap reselling/trading on the other shaving boards).
Yes, you are set on a great start and right now and as long as you don't pick any kind of AD you'll save money.
Me, in the last 2 weeks I've already spent on soaps and razors more than I'd have spent my old way over the next 2 years. But now I love my shaving and wish my beard would grow and my skin will regenerate faster. Oh, and my new motor skills to be developing at a faster pace :)

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Originally Posted by gugi

as long as you don't pick any kind of AD you'll save money

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It may be too late, I am already hooked on creams and probably soon soaps as well, and then of course those beg for just the right brushes, and then... It can only get worse once I get into the razors. :eek:

But, a man is entitled to his "hobbies", right? :D At least, that's the story I'm preparing for my wife, who has already given me a raised eyebrow as I hustle past her with packages of stuff destined for the bathroom.

And it looks like Colleen just responded to my email, what timing! It's Providence!

well, then you're doomed. but as you said, it was meant to be. welcome to the club :)
ah, colleen's soap is addictive - not sure what she puts in it, but it is some goood stuff :)
no wonder she had the biggest thread on this board...

Well, she is about to receive an order from me... It's funny because I NEVER used to shave on a weekend unless there was a wedding or something similar that I had to attend... Heck, I tried to shave as little as possible during the week, and now I find myself shaving almost daily just as an excuse to use my creams (and soon soaps)...

Well, I thought I would add a slightly humorous update. I received a razor from heavyduty last night and so I finally needed to find a place to hang my strop. I don't have any hooks yet, so I took a clothes hanger and a pair of pliers and snipped it more or less in half, making a hook at each end and attaching one to the towelbar and the other to the strop. Well, the cutting pliers I used weren't the greatest and so the end that I clipped had a rather sharp point to it (you can see where this is going...) After I had twisted it into a hook and attached the strop, I brought my hand down and the palm dragged over the sharp end. It opened up a nice 1-inch gash across the top of the palm.

So, the first blood drawn was not on my face at all, which I found a bit ironic and humorous... Needless to say I am looking for a better means of attaching the strop. Tomorrow I will actually use the razor (I was in a hurry this morning and did not want to rush it). I did do a little stropping.

More tomorrow, after the shave...

welcome and best wishes for your adventure ahead. remember it takes time to learn this skill. don't go too fast or try to tackle too much on your face at the begining day 1.

soap vs. cream is very much a personal choice. my opinion is that creams are easier to use, produce very thick rich lather and cushion a tad more, especially for beginers. i think thats a good place to start. after about 4months i started buying soaps and havn't bought another cream since then. i think soaps produce a closer shave but in doing so i'd say on average there's a tad less cushion which is good as you are starting to give a slight more forgiving shave. soaps come in more scents which is part of this adventure. its what you want to smell like, how you are feeling or to put you into a feeling.

glycerin/triple milled. i don't put too much into these in the comparison on how well the soap work as they both work very well. you will eventually use both kinds and make that choice yourself. glycerin is much easier to make lather, it poofs up fast. tripled milled will last much longer then glycerin becuase its a harder soap. you can make great lather with both kinds. soap lathering takes some time to get right, eachsoap maker is different and lather techniques are slightly different for each soap... amount of twisting, amount of water, amount of soap applied to the brush. the 1 advice i'd give when using soap is to load your brush with plenty of soap. if you want cream like thick rich lather then you need the soap. don't under do it. do 20 twists on your soap till it starts making lather in the soap bowl just a tad, then move to your mug/face however you'd like. remember you can always add water to the mix to get more lather, add lubricity..but you can't really remove water so start with smaller amount of water and add 4/5 drops as needed.

for touch ups to the razors i'd agree with the above. it depends on your stropping technique as you can roll your edge if you angle your razor. ofcourse how bristley your beard is will come into play. after lynn puts that bevel and edge on your blade you will be good for a long time and won't need to touch the lower grit stones for up to a year. however, like stated above, only you can tell when its getting uncomfortable, pulling and you want it touched up. some do it as much as once a week to a paste to keep that velvety smooth feel, others go a month. one thing ill add is that when people do their first straight shave it does feel like its has a slight tug feeling. thats' becuase you are cutting more area per movement and becuase you and your face are not used to the feel of the razor and its feedback you get thru it. you and your skin will get used to this and wont even notice it going forward. so expect a little bit of it starting but it shoudln't be uncomfortable enough where you feel like you are ripping out your whiskers.

i also store my razors in the bathroom. you need to wipe down your razor to get off soap residue and water as those will cause you to lose your edge and lead to rust. thats what you need to worry about. clean it well before putting it away. i let mine sit out for a few hours before closing them but i don't have childer or anyone i need to worry about touching them. just clean them well. i use some toilet paper and gently and precisly wipe them down.

good luck, keep at it. don't get discouraged in week 1. i'd suggest you start using both hands as there are angles and movements you just cna't do using 1 hand only. learn early and it becomes very easy and second nature real fast.

~J

Indeed, I'm far more concerned about cutting my hands than my face. Do be careful while handling the blade (and the hangers, of course :D ). Good luck and let us know how the first shave goes. :tu

Jordan

another victim MuHahAHA

PuFF

Well, here are the details of the first attempt.

My razor had arrived, honed by a member of the forums. I hung up my strop in the bathroom (got an actual hook to replace my palm-slicing coat hanger arrangement) and so I figured I would give stropping a shot. In retrospect this might not have been necessary, and possibly was a bad move... That being said, I tried to be very careful while stropping, doing my best not to apply pressure, not flipping the blade over on the edge, etc.

I prepared with a hot shower. I had my hot water in my shave bowl and also in a mug in which I put my brush. After I got out of the shower, I dumped out the water from the bowl and mug, squeezed the water from the brush and ran it under some fresh hot water. Gave it a quick shake and then put some Trumper's Violet cream in the bowl and began to work up the lather. I unintentionally put a little more water in the lather than I intended to, which might have been another mistake... It seemed like I got a decent lather out of it but perhaps not as "cushy" as normal.

Anyway, I took out the blade and prepared to shave WTG on one cheek, based on the pictures in Moss' "Art of Straight Razor shaving" PDF. I had a couple of days of beard growth. The razor scraped down my cheek - the lather didn't seem to provide any sort of glide or cushion, which is why I fear that it had too much water in it. I adjusted the angle, re-lathered and gave several other attempts, but there was still a very strong "scraping" feel and the razor sort of bounced along.

I tried some other spots on my face - the other cheek, the neck, chin, etc. In retrospect this was a bad idea, but my intent at the time was to try adjusting my technique and see if it made a difference. Right away I was rewarded with a couple of nice nicks on the chin that wept for the rest of the shave. Not a big deal. I actually seemed to do OK down the middle of the neck. In retrospect I should have mixed up a new batch of lather to see if it made a difference - the razor went through the lather almost like it wasn't there and then scraped along my comparatively dry skin.

After some more experimentation with blade angles, etc. and a few passes in different directions, I finished up with my cartridge and put on some Trumper's CSF.

Now, I want to make it clear that I'm sure the problem was mine, and not the blade itself. I'm sure that it arrived with a good edge, but one or more of the following must be the culprit:

1) I somehow messed up the edge while stropping
2) My lather had too much water in it
3) Shave technique (angle, etc.)
4) Something else I've overlooked

So, I will let my skin rest a bit and give it another shot. I also just received my World of Straight Razor Shaving DVD, so I will watch that and see if it helps to point out some of my problems. I also should have another razor on the way that has also been professionally honed, which I will probably not strop at all before giving it a shot and see if that makes a difference.

Wow - congratulations on the first attempt.

I was also puzzled after my first shave last week, but it's getting better. Seems like you have pretty good idea what may have been the problems. I think the lather definitely needs to be thicker (you can see Lynn's on the DVD). My first few shaves were with pretty thin lather too, but I wasn't even sure this was a problem. As far as dulling the edge - I was afraid I did that as well, but it turned out I didn't. You say you were very careful with the pressure, so I'm inclined to think you didn't either. I found that having a bit of momentum is quite useful, and in my case it is mandatory for the tougher beard on the chin.

Good idea about switching to a real hook :)

Keep posted what you find and what works for you

I watched some of the sections from Lynn's DVD this afternoon. What a great and comprehensive resource - I'm a very visual person and it's great to actually see various techniques demonstrated. I didn't watch the entire honing section (saving it for later) but did watch the whole intro, the stropping demonstration, pre-shave and shave, etc. Lynn makes it look effortless. Based on watching him strop, I'm going to work on my "x-pattern", which I know will also be needed for honing. The razor seems to just glide over his skin, with the characteristic sound that indicates shaving is happening... So, I have to figure out what is preventing me from getting to that point.

One thing I considered is that I had several days worth of beard growth, and I would consider my beard to be relatively coarse/tough, so this probably did not help.

Tomorrow morning (actually this morning, as I just realized it's after midnight) I may try to do just the cheeks again, hopefully with better lather, and see if it helps. I don't think I will go beyond the cheeks (as Lynn and others recommend) until I can get things going fairly smoothly in that location.

My generation is certainly at a disadvantage, not having dads who practiced the art and could pass it down. But, assuming I can succeed, I can show my son the ropes many years from now.

I had the dvd running in the background for the honing section - paid attention at the begining, but then it was too much :) i think that was the most comprehensive section, which makes perfect sense, 'the honing' being particularly strong with Lynn
:)

Yeah, he does make shaving all effortless, doesn't he :)
As far as the sound goes, I am pretty sure this is very razor and beard specific. I've read in one of the old threads about this. If your razor doesn't make that sound it doesn't mean you're doing it wrong. In fact come to think of it, most razors will make sound at a steeper angle, but you don't want that.

Anyways, I think you're right on on mastering the cheeks first. The one time I nicked myself was on my upper lip, while just trying to position the razor - the shaving wasn't even happening at that time. Didn't even bleed - just had a red slice for a day.

Anyways, good luck with it tomorrow/today

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Originally Posted by mental

1) Should I get some soap for comparison and if so, are there any soaps in particular to consider?

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Yes. Contact Colleen and ask for the Leatherneck!

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Originally Posted by mental

Does soap really last that much longer than a tub of cream?

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It depends on the soap.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mental

2) Regarding soaps, I've seen some listed as "triple-milled", some "glycerin-based"... Are those different?

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Ask Colleen.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mental

3) Is it necessary to store the razor somewhere other than the bathroom, due to concerns about humidity and rust?

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Not likely, but I do.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mental

4) Regarding stropping, some say to use the linen/canvas, some say they don't bother... Some say linen first and then the leather side, others the reverse... Some say 15 passes, some 30, some 60... Help! Lots of conflicting info.

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I do only about a dozen laps on the linen, then 50-60 laps on the leather. There's no such thing as too much stropping on leather, only bad stropping. Doing more passes IS better for your edge and your practice.

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Originally Posted by mental

5) Same for honing or "touching up" the blade - how quickly should I expect to need to somehow touch up (via strop and some sort of paste, I guess) or re-hone the blade? I know that a dull blade is a bad thing (heck, I've known that since Boy Scouts!) but I don't know what to expect in terms of the amount of shaving that can occur before needing to somehow touch up the blade.

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Constant use? Guys go between a dozen and thirty shaves per edge. Depends a lot on the blade and the shaver. Consider seriously a pasted paddle strop for keeping her in trim for about 6 months (constant use (a rotation of 6 razors should last three years :hmmm: )) between trips to the hone.

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Originally Posted by mental

A lot of the material I have read touches upon many of the questions above, but often the information is somewhat conflicting, so I figured it was worth a try to ask here.

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Ensuring more opinions to confuse the issues further. Straight shaving is a personal thing and you'll get lots of varied personal experience I'm sure. :D

X

I was thinking... Instead of having too much water in the lather, what if it's not enough? I did another attempt this morning, just on the cheeks this time, and while it went a little better, there was still a great deal of pulling/"skipping"/whatever you want to call it. The lather didn't seem to provide any real "glide" - it was almost like taking a razor across dry skin.

I saw what Lynn's lather looks like, although he is using soap rather than ceam in the video, so I don't know if it's a good comparison or not. Mine seems a lot thicker than what he had.

Hmm I'm really inexperienced about lather - the only thing I've used had been Colleen's fantastic soaps and when i had thicker consistency like in Lynn's video the results were much much better.

Somebody else will probably shed some light on this.

Mental,

If your lather is like meringue, it's my feeling that it contains too little water. Fortunately this is an easily remedied situation: add more water, the warmer the better. I've returned to straight shaving after 30+ years of beard trimming and have noticed a similar phenomenon to what you describe and that is keeping "momemtum". This may be stubble strength related, dunno, but if I allow the razor to stop when it bumps up against a tough stub (singular of stubble?) and then try to move it from that point rather then backing it up to restart on shaved face, I can almost guarantee myself a nick and have even been able to go from nick to slice.

I've found that cheek, chin, and jowl are the easiest to shave and the upper lip presents the greatest challenge. Lynn's video, unfortunately, shows no tips on shaving that area.

I'm attempting to hone my own razors to find that edge that others talk about: one that renders the "oh my, absolutley smooth, silent, effortless - babies should have butts like this shave". I'm not even close yet and have to be satified with the edge that gives the "singing" shave or for me one where the edge kind of growls across my face, but does a fine job, I have to say.

Patience and practice and keep the styptic pencil handy, Bruce

Well, here is another update, with both good and bad.

I was out of town the last few days and so I returned home to find my package of soaps from Colleen. They smelled great and so naturally I was eager to try one and also to give the straight razor a shot again. This time, I took my razor back to the strop and gave it quite a number of passes on both sides, hoping both to improve my form and to get the razor as keen as I could. I notice that in my x-pattern, when I move the razor away from me on the strop, sometimes the toe of the razor lifts up and off the strop, so I'm trying to work on keeping it all nice and flat but with little pressure. I did nick the strop a couple of minor places and while it was very annoying, I think the strop is still OK in the long term (or at least I hope so). Basically a couple small nicks at each edge, down at one end.

Anyway, I didn't need to shower so instead I decided to give the hot towels a try. After one hot towel, I worked on lathering up the soap (this was new to me, never used soaps before). At first the lather was very bad but I realized I had put nowhere near enough water in the mug and so I added more. Immediately the lather started to whip up and I knew I was doing much better. Lathered again, hot towel, then re-lathered and got out the razor.

Still not the fabled "glide" I was looking for, but better than the other couple times... I made small strokes down one cheek, per Lynn's video, and I noticed that indeed, I was scraping away my day and 1/2's worth of whiskers. That was definitely encouraging, so I finished it up and did the other one. Also went pretty well, although it seemed with my current technique a WTG pass would not suffice for getting me as smooth as I wanted to be.

It was at this point that I got more adventurous than I should have and decided to try an ATG pass on the cheek. I should have stopped immediately because the position and grip on the razor didn't feel right to me, but I tried it anyway and felt the blade cut me. Pulled back and saw that I had given myself a nice little slice, perhaps 1" or 1 1/2", vertically on my cheek under the sideburns. That bled for the rest of the shave and I tentatively tried a few other spots, but it wasn't working well and I ended up with a few other minor nicks for my time. I think whatever confidence I'd had was quickly sapped by cutting my cheek and so that was really the end of the decent part of the shave.

So, the verdict - Colleen's Amber soap is awesome and I really liked the lather I was able to generate. I enjoy my creams but I could see myself utilizing the soaps quite a bit, maybe as my primary means of lather. I don't really know what accounted for the "good" part of my shave - the stropping, the soap vs. the cream I was using, or just slightly better technique? Maybe all of the above? Hard to say.

Well, tomorrow and Saturday my face can have a break, although I will probably have to shave Sunday. I've been a bit paranoid about getting scars on my face but it seems that the cut was probably not all that deep and I'm hoping it won't be noticeable after it heals up a bit. I'm happy that I was able to shave my cheeks more effectively but also reminded of just how far I have yet to go.

Sounds pretty good to me. I have gashed myself when either I was surprised while shaving or it didn't feel right in my hand and I went ahead anyway.

Well, here is another entry in my shave journal for anyone who is interested. Having given my face a few days to rest, I gave things another try this morning. I would say it's the best I've done so far, although anything beyond the cheeks is still tough for me, although for the first time I ventured gingerly to a few other areas (neck and chin, being VERY VERY careful) and I didn't nick myself, so I must be improving. The downside is that at least at this point, a WTG pass or two doesn't get me anywhere near as close as I'd like, so working on ATG or XTG is in my immediate future, I guess. That's the part where I still get a little nervous.

I still feel that I'm struggling with the lather. Even though I add a little hot water to it and I soak the blade in hot water, the lather gets downright cold very quickly. Still getting used to making lather from soap vs. cream.

Question for you soap users: Do you make your lather directly in the mug (or whatever you keep your soap in) or do you transfer it to a bowl (I have seen this done in one of the demos I looked at on the Internet)?

One thing that I'm not sure is good or bad is that my lather gets so thick that when I apply it to my face via the brush, the brush itself sort of flattens out, like a sort of oval paintbrush, and I don't know if that means there's not enough water?

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Originally Posted by mental

Question for you soap users: Do you make your lather directly in the mug (or whatever you keep your soap in) or do you transfer it to a bowl (I have seen this done in one of the demos I looked at on the Internet)?

One thing that I'm not sure is good or bad is that my lather gets so thick that when I apply it to my face via the brush, the brush itself sort of flattens out, like a sort of oval paintbrush, and I don't know if that means there's not enough water?

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What works best for me when using soaps:

1)Put a little water on the surface of the soap for a minute or so to allow the soap to soften. 2) Shake pretty much all the water out of a wet brush. 3) Dump the water off the soap. 4) Swirl the brush over the soap until a pasty lather forms. 5) Splash a little more hot water on already wet face and begin to build the lather directly on face. 6) Keep working the lather longer than you would think necessary - a good minute or two. 7) At this point the lather will probably still be a bit pasty, so pass the tip of the brush quickly through running water and continue lather building. 8) The lather should really come into its own at this point. You can add a little more water to the brush if you think you need it. I finish with a few straight or "painting" swipes with the brush to even things out. Then shave. Play around with and give the lather time to build.

Enjoy

Jordan

"Dear Shave Diary..."

I eased back on the pressure tonight and it made a difference in terms of comfort. I'm getting to the point where I can get my cheeks pretty decent but as I mentioned before, a lot of difficulty on any of the "trickier" spots such as chin and neck. I've been experimenting with adding more water to the lather and I think it's helping somewhat. It still seems quite a long way from here to the point where I could shave decently enough to put away the Fusion - I have to do a lot of cleanup in the aforementioned areas.

I definitely think my stropping technique is improving, as making the x-pattern and flipping the blade on its spine is becoming a lot more natural.

I have a loaner from Lynn on the way, so it will be nice to try out a freshly-honed razor now that (I think) my technique has improved a little. Along the lines of the "Lynn Abrams is a true gentleman" thread in the other forum, Lynn indicated to me that the razor I had purchased and had sent to him directly from the vendor wasn't satisfactory, so not only did he ask the vendor to send him a new one on my behalf, he sent me a loaner! Needless to say, I was extremely impressed by that kind of service... That's something you just don't find these days anymore.

So, hats off to Lynn, and I will continue to post in my "Shave-o-logue" here, assuming no one minds...

To weigh in on the lather issue, I find I have better results building lather in a bowl. I keep my soap in my mug, so I wet it the soap to soften it, then dig around with my brush. Once I get enough soap on the brush, I put a little hot water in my bowl, then whip it like scrambled eggs.

To quote JoshEarl on how to shave, "You're aiming at beard reduction with each pass, not elimination." And something I've learned is to not overshave. If a spot is giving you trouble and you've tried to shave it with 7+ passes (for me it's about 5) with no luck, try again later. Touch it up with whatever you used to shave with and give your face a break

Oh, and for those nicks, invest in a styptic pencil. You can get them in the shaving section at Wal-Mart. For those occasional bleeders, there's nothing like the styptic.

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Originally Posted by Quick Orange

To weigh in on the lather issue, I find I have better results building lather in a bowl. I keep my soap in my mug, so I wet it the soap to soften it, then dig around with my brush. Once I get enough soap on the brush, I put a little hot water in my bowl, then whip it like scrambled eggs.

To quote JoshEarl on how to shave, "You're aiming at beard reduction with each pass, not elimination." And something I've learned is to not overshave. If a spot is giving you trouble and you've tried to shave it with 7+ passes (for me it's about 5) with no luck, try again later. Touch it up with whatever you used to shave with and give your face a break

Oh, and for those nicks, invest in a styptic pencil. You can get them in the shaving section at Wal-Mart. For those occasional bleeders, there's nothing like the styptic.

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Yeah, it was some of the commentary on beard reduction vs. elimination that made me remember what I'd read earlier, which was not to put pressure on the blade. I think I was scraping too hard. I would really like to try a heavier razor and see how the added weight feels - some people say that it helps. Mine is a 9/16, I think, with a relatively small and lightweight blade. If I find an inexpensive wedge or 7/8 or something, I might go for it.

Here's my technique for making lather from soaps on my face rather than in the bowl. Run hot water in the sink and put the brush in. Swirl it around, spreading the bristles, and let it sit in the water while you shower. As you shower, hold a wet washrag against your face several times for 10 seconds or so and make sure to keep your face wet during the shower and as you dry off the rest of your body. At the sink, take the wet brush out and splash hot water on your face again. I usually then rub in some Trumpers Limes skin food, but it's not necessary. The key is to make sure your face never loses the moisture it picked up in the shower. Squeeze out your brush by gently wrapping your thumb and forefinger around it, and then run hot water right down into the top of the bristles. Give it another gentle squeeze and then begin to swirl the bristles onto your soap. I do this an a bowl or just on top of the soap in its jar. Swirl and pump up and down a few times for about 30 seconds. You should begin to see lather forming on the brush and in the bowl. When just a little lather begins to form, your brush should also feel "full." You are ready to begin building lather on your face. Make sure your face is still fairly wet and then take the brush to it. I really mash the brush into my face so that it spreads out and swirl it all around my cheek, neck and around my mouth. After about 30-45 seconds of swirling strokes, you'll have a thin lather (you can still see skin) covering your whole face. When this thin lather is evenly distributed over your entire shaving area, then you can begin to make vertical "painting" strokes. For me, this really thickens the lather into a shaveable condition. Paint with downward strokes until you have a thick (not Gillette Foamy thick, but so thick your skin doesn't show at all) lather over your entire face. At this point, I'm ready to shave. After the first pass, repeat this process. You shouldn't have to reload your brush. If you do a third pass, you might have to go back to the soap. My brush usually holds enough water that I don't have to add any throughout the process, but if the lather feels too dry, I just run the tip of the brush quickly under the faucet. Good luck!

Well, I am certain you are all anxiously awaiting my next update, and of course I aim to please. This morning I shaved after a hot shower, and decided to try out my Bay Rum and Sweet Orange soap from Colleen - very nice! I managed to get a "decent" shave on most of my face, with the exception of a few troubling spots around the lips and chin... Jawline and neck were rougher. Overall I had less clean-up to do, but still very rough on the neck.

I had been struggling a bit with the soap and lather earlier... Today I tried putting the soap in a bowl rather than a mug. What a difference! Lots of lather almost instantly. I realized that the reason my brush gets flattened out is because it gets packed with dense lather... I squeezed from the base of the bristles up, and this huge gob of really nice lather came up. For those who use a mug, there's so little room in there to maneuver - how do you manage to whip up lather?

Anyway, it seems I am making slow progress but at the same time, being able to do my neck without having to touch up with my cartridge seems like it is a very long way off. So I guess I am simultaneously encouraged and discouraged, but I will keep at it. One nice thing is that I don't think I nicked myself, or if I did, it was very minor.

mental,

"For those who use a mug, there's so little room in there to maneuver - how do you manage to whip up lather?"

We use the Robot Coupe method: frenzied small circles - the old tempest in a teacup routine. It sometimes works some of the time.:D

Bruce

Yep, lather in a bowl requires fists of fury, and a largish bowl. I regularly spray the mirror with partially whipped lather in frenzied attempts to get everything light and fluffy.

James.

Instead of trying to learn both straight shaving and lather making I might suggest just using foam from the can for a while if you have any. At this point you should probably be doing fine though.

Be careful with the x pattern while stropping. Although it is helpful, daintily stropping to create the x pattern may be part of your problem with a skipping sensation. Smoothing the edge out on a strop is essential to a comfy shave. Going straight down the strop, confidently, may dramatically improve your initial results.

FOAM FROM A CAN??? Oh be still my heart. Such heresy!! Are we next to hear Norelco spoken??

:roflmao Bruce

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Originally Posted by AFDavis11

Instead of trying to learn both straight shaving and lather making I might suggest just using foam from the can for a while if you have any. At this point you should probably be doing fine though.

Be careful with the x pattern while stropping. Although it is helpful, daintily stropping to create the x pattern may be part of your problem with a skipping sensation. Smoothing the edge out on a strop is essential to a comfy shave. Going straight down the strop, confidently, may dramatically improve your initial results.

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The strop is not wide enough to just do straight strokes, which is why I was using an x-pattern... Are you suggesting that I bring it straight down the strop, but in multiple passes per "section" of the razor in order to get the entire edge?

I'm not sure how wide the strop is, but if it's 2" you can angle the razor so that the blade is covered by the strop and do a parallel instead of x pattern. Lynn mentions that briefly in the DVD.
I think the main thing that AFDAvis11 is saying is to go confidently (still a light pressure) in one continuous motion, and not struggling to maintain an x-pattern may be helpful in this.
I believe the edge realignment during stropping is improved when there is a motion component along the edge. This can be achieved either by x-pattern or by angling the razor and one of these two options may be easier for you. I don't think doing a section at a time is a good idea.

At least for me stropping and the resulting edge improved quite a bit after i built up some muscle memory and my strokes became more smooth and rhytmic. My strop is 3" but I do the x-pattern.

As I was shaving these evening, enjoying the scent of Colleen's soap and the feel of the lather, I realized that even though I may still be working on the actual straight razor shave, my shave itself is still 100% better than it used to be, though I'm still cleaning up with the cartridge razor. My shave is both closer than ever, and more comfortable than ever, and my skin shows the difference.

I used to have to sacrifice a lot of blood and put up with a lot of razor burn just to get all those trouble spots. Now, I simply take my time and use the wetshaving techniques that I picked up here, and the results are so much better... Who would have thought that I could have gotten closer, with MORE comfort? I had just assumed that shaving was going to be something that I hated doing for the rest of my life.

Now it's a ritual that I actually look forward to. so, for that alone, I thank all of the helpful folks here who have given me advice and encouragement along the way. Still much more to learn...

Oh yeah, and thanks to some of the tips here and elsewhere, I think I'm getting pretty good with the soap! :tu