How sharp should a honed blade be?

I had my razor honed before it was shipped to me.

When I got it I tried the HHT. The blade just pushed the hair away.

Next I tried it on the tips of my arm hair and the result was the same. The blade would only cut at the base of the hair and with some pressure applied.

I then took a hair and folded it in a loop over the razor's edge. As I lifted the blade I felt the hair stretch slightly then cut. Is this an acceptable level of sharpness?

I managed to get a pretty decent first shave with it, but having looked at the level of sharpness some are managing to obtain when honing I can't help but wonder. :confused:

I hadn't stropped the blade prior to these tests.

I have since checked it under a microscope and there is no sign of the blade having been rolled and no burring.

Try those same tests with a single edge razor blade straight from the package, You'll find yor results are similar. The single edge might be a tad sharper though.

The only test that matters is shaving. If you got a decent shave your first time out, thats pretty darn good. Most guys experience a bit of tugging and pulling, even pain during their first few shaves, and the razor has nothing to do with it. It takes some time to find the best angles, amount of stretch, strokes and grip for a really comfotable shave. Even once you find all of the above it takes a while to get really consistent in your use of all the above for every shave.

I would keep practicing your shave technique before I blamed my tools.

The shave did not make me question the sharpness of the blade.

I had read this and that about sharpness of blades in the honing forums before I got my razor, so I thought I would try some of the tests mentioned.

Hence the above post.

I had my second full shave today and similar results to my first, so no complaints there.

I guess I'm just having those newb moments we all have.

Thanks for setting my mind to rest.:o

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Originally Posted by Black Beard

I managed to get a pretty decent first shave with it, but having looked at the level of sharpness some are managing to obtain when honing I can't help but wonder. :confused:

I hadn't stropped the blade prior to these tests.

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First, I would say that you have done very well to get a good shave on the first time out!

Second, the hanging hair test is an indicator but not the acid test of shaveability. The shave is the real test.

You are doing great! Welcome to the world of str8 shaving.

There are many factors that go into whether a blade will pass the HHT, how fine the hair is, the angle you hold it at, etc.

If it shaves well, it is sharp enough. And it sounds like yours is just fine! Congrats!

You may also find that improving your stropping technique will get the same blade to pass some of those tests.

You can get a blade to pass those test after honing but it can also shave worse for the effort.

It's amazing how a little bit of reassurance can make you feel better about things, even at the ripe old age of 43 :D.

Just as a point of interest, I have managed to aquire a mild dose of RAD.

I now have my second shave ready razor on it's way to me from 'The Invisible Edge'. It's a vintage Ragg from Sheffield and is a near 7/8 in practically new condition.

I can't wait to shave with it :)

Thats awesome! You'll find the sharpness requirement will be a little less with a big heavy blade. It'll kind of shave all by itself and then ask for more.

I've had the same thing, blade not passing HHT or slicing through arm hairs without pressure, but still shaving great. This has happened with most, all my straights including a feather.

This is not at all uncommon IIRC.

On the other hand, I just had a razor pass the HHT but it did not provide a great shave. It took the hairs off, but left razor burn behind. I don't have this problem with my truly shave ready razors.

Next I'll be ordering some chromium paste to work with.

Back on topic, if your razor is shaving well, that's really all that matters. Good luck!

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Originally Posted by Black Beard

I had my razor honed before it was shipped to me.

When I got it I tried the HHT. The blade just pushed the hair away.

Next I tried it on the tips of my arm hair and the result was the same. The blade would only cut at the base of the hair and with some pressure applied.

I then took a hair and folded it in a loop over the razor's edge. As I lifted the blade I felt the hair stretch slightly then cut. Is this an acceptable level of sharpness?

I managed to get a pretty decent first shave with it, but having looked at the level of sharpness some are managing to obtain when honing I can't help but wonder. :confused:

I hadn't stropped the blade prior to these tests.

I have since checked it under a microscope and there is no sign of the blade having been rolled and no burring.

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Old barber texts taught the student barber to hone their razor until it passed the thumb nail test. Whether or not that level of sharpness coincided with the hanging hair test is unknown, or may vary from case to case.

I suspect that a lot of the guys who are using multiple hones, and using honing progressions, are effectively using their high grit hones as reverse strops, and all that additional honing is a waste of time and metal off of the edge. Better results can be achieved by incorporating the strop sooner than later.

Once the razor meets the requirements of the thumb nail test, it's best to stop honing and go on to stropping. Either on the leather alone, or alternating both leather and linen, until the edge is keen as indicated by the thumb pad test. At this point, the razor will most likely pass the HHT.

Scott

As has been said many times above it's all about the shave. If you're happy with the shave, great!

In my experience stropping made all the difference. I got my razor from a member here and then sent it to another member to be honed. The honed razor didn't pop hairs, either hanging or on my arm, but did shave wonderfully. Though at this time I didn't have a strop. A couple weeks later when I got the strop the first thing I did was give it a few passes, 10 or so, on the pasted side and then 20 or so passes on the non-pasted side. Let me tell you, it made all the difference. I was worried about rolling the edge since it was my first attempt stropping but when I ran the blade above my arm and heard those lovely "tink" sounds I smiled. Now the blade pops hair all along it's edge.

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Originally Posted by JCitron

As has been said many times above it's all about the shave. If you're happy with the shave, great!

In my experience stropping made all the difference. I got my razor from a member here and then sent it to another member to be honed. The honed razor didn't pop hairs, either hanging or on my arm, but did shave wonderfully. Though at this time I didn't have a strop. A couple weeks later when I got the strop the first thing I did was give it a few passes, 10 or so, on the pasted side and then 20 or so passes on the non-pasted side. Let me tell you, it made all the difference. I was worried about rolling the edge since it was my first attempt stropping but when I ran the blade above my arm and heard those lovely "tink" sounds I smiled. Now the blade pops hair all along it's edge.

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Wow, your strop experience is extraordinary compared to mine! I seem to need to strop 40-100 passes before each shave. I've never noticed a difference with just 20 passes on leather - I might be going too lightly I suppose, but since it's working I guess I will leave it be

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Originally Posted by hoglahoo

Wow, your strop experience is extraordinary compared to mine! I seem to need to strop 40-100 passes before each shave. I've never noticed a difference with just 20 passes on leather - I might be going too lightly I suppose, but since it's working I guess I will leave it be

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In all honesty I have only shaved a handful of times with a straight. The stropping took it from essientiall just honed plus a few shaves to popping hairs. I don't want to give the impression that my 20 or so passes will have any effect on a more used razor, I just don't know yet. :shrug:

Wow, with 40-100 passes I'd be afraid of rolling the edge. I'm sure as my technique improves I'll do more passes.

I shaved my wifes legs with one of my razors. After the shave the razor felt noticably less sharp. I stropped the buggery out of it and it felt sharp again and shaves just the same as it did before the leg outing:)
I bought my wife a Venus ladies razor though!

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Originally Posted by JCitron

In all honesty I have only shaved a handful of times with a straight. The stropping took it from essientiall just honed plus a few shaves to popping hairs. I don't want to give the impression that my 20 or so passes will have any effect on a more used razor, I just don't know yet. :shrug:

Wow, with 40-100 passes I'd be afraid of rolling the edge. I'm sure as my technique improves I'll do more passes.

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You can strop as much as you like, if your technique is correct you won't roll the edge. Just take it a little slower if you're worried about making a bad pass and harming the edge.

This is odd: personally, from the relatively little experience I have had with my shave-ready 6/8 Dovo I found that I actually got a better edge (and shave) when I decided to experiment with more pressure, which also meant I could strop it faster. I think I was stropping too lightly in the beginning. I had read on this forum about someone measuring the "just holding it to the surface" pressure amounting to 4-5 ounces, which made sense in my mind, so I was very consciously careful of inadvertantly screwing up the edge as a newbie. Now I strop with a little bit of pressure beyond keeping it in contact with the strop, and do it faster and return the edge to better shape than when I started.

I often lose count of the number of passes, but it couldn't be more than 40.

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Originally Posted by AxelH

I often lose count of the number of passes, but it couldn't be more than 40.

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I guess I could qualify my previous stropping experience by noting that I generally brush my teeth and then strop my razor while my lather is sitting on my face. So about a minute and a half to two and a half minutes of stropping and flipping the strop over from the linen to the leather would probably come out to around 100 total passes for me. It's easy to keep going, but I have to try to remember that it's better to be on time at work with a one-pass shave than late to work because I obsessed on my shave.

yeah, this bothered me for a while when I was new, too. no matter how carefully I honed and stropped, no matter how much I spent on exotic hones from around the world, no matter how many razors I bought, NONE of them would ever pass the hanging hair test! (it should be noted that my hair is VERY fine)

despite all this, my razors shave very well and very comfortably, so in the end, I decided that as long as the razor shaves well, who cares if it will cut a hanging hair? don't get too hung up on it, as long as they shave ok that's all that matters.