Can one's beard be NOT suited for a straight shave?

Hi guys,

I'm so frustrated right now. I've shaved for the second time now with my razor honed by Lynn (did a great job by the way!). I've got around 8 shaves under my belt now in total. The razor passed the HHT and popped hairs off my arm, without the edge touching the skin.

I shaved today and WTG went rather well, just like normal, but still learning. After that i did an ATG pass (as i always cut myself with a XTG pass), but at most parts the razor pulled like hell and just dug in my skin. My moustache went so bad, i was worried about the razor would slip one time and cut off my nose. Also, i wasn't applying any pressure and stretched the skin under my nose, by making funny faces.

So sharpness isn't an issue with my razor, this got me wondering: could it be that the beard of some people aren't suitable for a straight shave?

Kind regards!

How's your prep?

In addition to the importance of the prep gradual stubble removal rather then trying to get down to bbs on the first pass is advisable. Before I knew that I would have the same experience that you describe and razor burn to boot. Now I do two or three light passes and all is well if my prep is right and my razor is shave ready.

Same as usual: shower, leave face moist, lather up and leave it about 1 minute there before the shave.

I have used straight razor for years, and I found that my 200 buck German razor (which is excellent) doesn't get as close as a staight I own with replaceable blades.... I think prep is an important part, as a true straights edge is so thin. The disposable one has a thicker edge and my beard is very tough indeed.
I would recommend you try a shaving oil. I apply a few drops before I soap up. Also, it is best to shave after a VERY hot shower. I use the brush for 2-3 minutes to soften beard up...Never had cut even atg.
Still, I wish someone can tell me why a 20 dollar hair shaper with 50 cent blades gets closer than my new 2oo dollar straight......Keep at it...it only gets better....Bullwinkle

Thanks for the input so far, guys! I appreciate it. I've tried shaving oils in the past and those irritate the hell out of my skin. In fact this, in combination with a electric gave me so much irritation that i still have scars from it, after half a year. :cry:

With respect to your original question remember that at one time straights were the only instruments for shaving so everyone used them. Usually when people say they just don't work for them either the razor isn't shave ready, their technique is lacking or they started using a straight and have unrealistic expectations as to how long it takes to get good shaves with one or they damaged the edge by stropping, honing or some other way.

From what I see in your case it looks like you aren't giving it enough time. Most people takes weeks of shaving before they start getting the most minimal of shaves.

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Originally Posted by thebigspendur

With respect to your original question remember that at one time straights were the only instruments for shaving so everyone used them. Usually when people say they just don't work for them either the razor isn't shave ready, their technique is lacking or they started using a straight and have unrealistic expectations as to how long it takes to get good shaves with one or they damaged the edge by stropping, honing or some other way.

From what I see in your case it looks like you aren't giving it enough time. Most people takes weeks of shaving before they start getting the most minimal of shaves.

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I agree with this statement!

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Originally Posted by gentleman

Hi guys,

I'm so frustrated right now. I've shaved for the second time now with my razor honed by Lynn (did a great job by the way!). I've got around 8 shaves under my belt now in total. The razor passed the HHT and popped hairs off my arm, without the edge touching the skin.

I shaved today and WTG went rather well, just like normal, but still learning. After that i did an ATG pass (as i always cut myself with a XTG pass), but at most parts the razor pulled like hell and just dug in my skin. My moustache went so bad, i was worried about the razor would slip one time and cut off my nose. Also, i wasn't applying any pressure and stretched the skin under my nose, by making funny faces.

So sharpness isn't an issue with my razor, this got me wondering: could it be that the beard of some people aren't suitable for a straight shave?

Kind regards!

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I hope that you don't mind me being blunt, but I can say with pretty good certainly that you should not be shaving ATG. ATG for me is the last step after XTG both ways. You have been shaving 8 time now? I am a pretty fast learner and I did not attempt ATG till I could shave twice a day with little, or no irritation. You did not mention if you shaved with a DE before this, as that will speed your learning curve. In the first 3 months that I shaved I had about 150 shaves in. Just now at about 5 months I am doing ATG and am running into problems that I have to work through. Don't worry it will come to you. Add a little at a time and there will be a day that you will "break" over the top. Practice WTG because you should be able to get a very good shave with just that. The problems that most of us have is that when we get that really "great" shave the bar goes up for us, and if we were to look back that was more than we expected when we started1

It will just happen when it should and you can not rush it other than getting a certain number of shaves under your belt. Your face is getting into probably the best shape it has every been in, you are using soaps and stuff that are make shaving a pleasure so just kick back and enjoy the ride.


Just a thought,
Richard

Thanks a lot for all of your input, guys. You've (and Lynn) have given me great feedback to proceed with it. I've used a DE before (but i really can't see why this is beneficial, as the shaving is completely different), but my shaves with a straight are closer and would more comfy than with a DE. So i will shave WTG for the next period coming.

Just wanted that my Shavemac would arrive. :D

Thanks again and have a nice weekend!

The DE is beneficial because it makes you learn proper beard prep.

If over the counter pre shave oils irritate your skin, try olive oil. just a few drops will do.

What soap are you using? if your soap is sub-standard your shaves will be too.

Allow the lather to sit for more than a minute, put it on, and find another task to work on for a couple of minutes, then relather and do your WTG pass.

Try doing several WTG passes for now, and forego the ATG until you can get a nice clean shave doing only WTG. (You can get very close to BBS just going WTG with enough practise)

Pay close attention to your angles, they can make a world of difference.


I get pulling when I go ATG on my upper lip, I always have, with a Mach 3 a straight even a feather. I have to work up to going ATG by doing several passes, and removing 99% of the hair before I do my ATG there.
I have a spot on my chin that is similar.
This is not unheard of, you just need to build your skills and work up to a skill level where you are ready to go against the grain. Some people are fortunate enough to do this quickly, others take longer, there is nothing to be ashamed about.

DE'a are a great quick fix close shave, and are very comfortable, but there is little skill or self satisfaction involved in using one.

I am also learning to use a str8. One week in and my shaves are exceeding all my expectations at this point. They are not as quick to complete as with a DE and not quite as close. I would reckon my worst areas are about as good as I get with an electric.

At the moment I see every shave as a challenge and take pride in improving in the areas I have identified as weeknesses.

I have read many posts that say allow yourself many months to get a good shave and this is why I don't worry if my shave is not yet perfect.

I think the journey would not be half as much fun if one was able to master a str8 within one or two weeks.

As has been said, 'Enjoy the journey', Good luck! :tu

From the information you provided, I should say that your razor is shaveready, and your beard preparation is good enough. That only leaves one possibility open: your technique.

Here's my advice:

1. For now, don't worry too much about ATG and XTG. Just do your normal WTG-pass first, (I assume that you're fairly comfortable doing that). Then, rinse your face with hot water, and lather up again. I always use a very thin, watery lather for my second pass. It helps to see really well what's going on.

Then perform an upward, South to North pass. Don't worry about grain direction. You can start bringing that in account after you figured out the upward pass, and search for all the particular shaving directions your face needs for the perfect shave.

2. Start the South to North pass low at your neck, if you're right handed, start at the left side. Place the razor flat at your skin, lift the spine up, about one or two times the spine's thickness, which approximates a safe (low!) and good shaving angle.

3. Place your other hand a bit lower on your neck, beneath the razor and push down a bit, while at the same time sticking your chin up. This gesture should stretch the skin of your neck very nice and taut.

4. Now, with minimal pressure, take a small stroke, about half an inch, and watch how the stubble disappears. Take your time to enjoy.
Make similar small overlapping strokes, all the way up to the jaw bone. Then start below at your neck again and shave the adjacent lane, till you complete the right half and the middle part of your neck.

5. Then continue with your right cheek. Push back on the skin under the jawbone in combination with facial gestures to maximize stretching.

6. Change hands, or change grip, depending on personal preference, to shave the left side of your face.

7. If you get this far, you'll be able to figure out how to do the chin, that generally takes a bit more practice to be shaved without a few minor nicks. Don't worry too much about those. (Just use your styptic pencil, and you'll be fine)

8. STOP! At this point, its time to do the cold water rinse, and be pleased with yourself. :) You'll have smooth spots, and spots with some stubble left. That's normal. Within a few weeks experience, the smooth area will enlarge with your growing expertise. Don't be tempted to scrape over those rough parts over and over again. Your face won't like you, and you'll only end up with more frustration. (Believe me, we've all been there:w)

9. Stick with doing this for a couple of weeks and you'll find the spots of your beard that need other shaving directions and/or angles. By the time you do, you'll have enough basic shaving skills developed to figure out, through trial and error, the exact shaving map for your own unique facial hair growth.

Good luck & keep us posted,

Bart.

I haven't time to read through all posts to see if this has been mentioned before but....

I would advise trying some Pre-shave Oil. It made a world of a difference to my shaves.

- Start by wetting the face with warm water and then applying the oil. I use Kings of shaves oil which is readily available.
- Whilst I let the oil work in, I begin to make my lather.
- When the lather is done, I apply it to my face and massage the lather into my beard with my hands after I have applied it with the badger brush.
- After working it in wiith my hands, I then re-apply with the badger brush and am now ready to shave.

Try this and see if it helps.

Good morning gentlemen,

Many, many thanks for all of your idea's! You really make me want to go on with it! Your posts, and the fact that my BBS already lasts me about 17 hours, in the neckarea some spots are feeling a bit stubly now, but my moustace is still BBS and 99 % of the cheeks. LOL

Oh and i've tried olive oil too (wasn't happy with it LOL) and the soap i was using was the Proraso, but i also have De Vergulde Hand, Honeybee Spa and such in rotation.

I don't know if olive oil will be indicative of the effectiveness of a pre-shave oil, but I've never used either so who knows.

I'll cast my vote in the take it slow and work up to XTG and ATG passes. It took a long time before I was comfortable doing ATG passes.

Also, are you keeping the lather moist as you go? It may be drying out a little.

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Originally Posted by gentleman

Oh and i've tried olive oil too (wasn't happy with it LOL) and the soap i was using was the Proraso, but i also have De Vergulde Hand, Honeybee Spa and such in rotation.

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Just make sure it is 100% extra virgin! For me it works: reduces irritation and razor burn to a minimum after the shave.

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Originally Posted by Russel Baldridge

Also, are you keeping the lather moist as you go? It may be drying out a little.

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When you lather, the water should be warm but not very hot ... the hotter the water the faster it evaporates and the faster the lather dries out.

I've been shaving with a straight every days for a little more than a month now, and I still only do two WTG passes (I still have too much feedback when I'm trying to pass ATG)... I'm working slowly on my cheeks to practice the XTG. My advice (not much but who knows, maybe it will help) is to do only two passes WTG until you are confident and - most important - confortable with it. Then go on with the XTG as second pass, and when confortable with it, with an ATG as third pass (if your beard is not too strong, you can maybe try an ATG as second shave).
And as a DE user myself, I use it as a third ATG pass after my two passes WTG with the straight if I need a really close shave.

That's what is working for me...

Hope it helps.

Not sure if it's been mentioned but stropping is important too. Took me more than eight shaves to really get the idea (and lots of reading up on it on this site and others). As others have said, you're still very early on on the learning curve, which is long but steep.

Hi guys,

Yes, i keep my lather moist nowadays and my stropping is also good (i think).

I will try WTG passes only for the next month or so. Just to get comfortable and without irritation (which the ATG gave me a bit now).

Thanks again and have a nice day!

Keep us posted.


Later,
R

Will do!:tu

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Originally Posted by gentleman

Oh and i've tried olive oil too (wasn't happy with it LOL)

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The talk about pre-prep with olive oil made me want to experiment because I've been having some irritation lately. I mentioned it to my wife, who knows about these things, and she discouraged me from using olive oil, which she said was too aggressive. She suggested using sweet almond oil instead. The first day I rubbed the oil on my face and then lathered up. I liked the results but my face was too slippery to get a good grip to stretch the skin. The second day I put a little bit of oil right in the soap bowl before I started lathering and made an emulsion with the soap. I've done this for two days and I'm totally pumped! I get an absolutely perfect BBS shave and absolutely no irritation. Plus, the skin is not too slippery to grip. I highly recommend it.

sweet almond oil is much better than olive, but most house holds have olive oil in the kitchen.
2 or 3 drops of olive oil rubbed into your beard is very effective, if not over kill.
I haven't tried it on the soap, but it should work just fine that way, almond oil is very neutral, and would provide a good slick, much like adding glycerine.

Add a pre-shave like proraso or noxzema to help soften the beard.

I believe the ATG is the penultimate pass for us straight users. I'll unabashedly say I'm finally getting comfortable making this pass. I say this not to discourage but to encourage.

Finally, map your beard. I recommend using a digital camera. Zoom in on areas like the neck. You might find a WTG pass in some areas may actually be ATG!

does this method oil up your brush?

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Originally Posted by Chimensch

The talk about pre-prep with olive oil made me want to experiment because I've been having some irritation lately. I mentioned it to my wife, who knows about these things, and she discouraged me from using olive oil, which she said was too aggressive. She suggested using sweet almond oil instead. The first day I rubbed the oil on my face and then lathered up. I liked the results but my face was too slippery to get a good grip to stretch the skin. The second day I put a little bit of oil right in the soap bowl before I started lathering and made an emulsion with the soap. I've done this for two days and I'm totally pumped! I get an absolutely perfect BBS shave and absolutely no irritation. Plus, the skin is not too slippery to grip. I highly recommend it.

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Originally Posted by OldFashioned

does this method oil up your brush?

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No, sweet almond oil is very light and not greasy.