Razor not sharp??

Hello friends,

I am new to straight razor shaving and I seem to be having a bit of trouble. I know that it is because of my inexperience, but I was wondering if it was also because the razor is not sharp enough.

I have only shaved with the razor three times. It is a Le Grelot 6/8 1/4 hollow razor that I had pre-honed by Martin at razurpur.de. Most people say he hones razors well, so it probably arrived nice and sharp. I don't know how common it is for the razor to become dull after only a few shaves, but I think it is possibly why I'm having trouble. I am using firm, confident strokes, but I get a lot of tugging, rather than slicing, on my neck and chin. It seemed worse the third time I shaved than the second time. The first time I don't remember getting to much tugging, although chin and neck hair were harder for me to cut. I just remember not knowing how to hold the razor.

The razor doesn't pass the hanging hair test. It also doesn't seem to tug at my skin when I try the thumb pad test. Because I am not an expert at the TPT I compared the feeling of the straight to that of a fresh DE blade. The DE felt like it was tugging at my skin but there was significantly less tugging with the straight. It was much smoother feeling.

Anyway, I was wondering what you guys thought about this. Maybe I did something to dull it. I don't think it's my stropping technique, because I have been doing it slowly and lightly while keeping the strop taut, and it makes the sound like you are supposed to hear. Maybe the way I was slicing at the hairs or pushing the razor against my face caused it to dull? Or dulled it some other way? Or maybe it's not dull at all, it's just my technique?

I recently bought a barber hone (pike swaty). Is this a good hone for keeping my razor edge sharp? How often should I expect to have to hone this razor, and around how many strokes do you estimate? If it's not such a great hone, what would you recommend?

Thanks a lot!

The Gssixgun test for razor sharpness for new guys ;)

First off those tests you read about the TNT TPT HHT are really for honing a razor...

For somebody that is testing a "shave ready razor" here is my reccomendation... Lynn has said the same thing many times but more as a shaving routine than a test but try this...

After you do all your prep, lather up your face, then while the lather soaks in strop your razor...
Take the razor in your strong hand and shave from your side burn to your jawline using your weak hand to stretch the skin.... One smooth stroke keeping the spine of the razor exactly two spine widths from the skin...

Rinse the lather and using the back of a finger feel that spot...
if smooth than the razor is fine
if not smooth,
repeat test on other side
still not smooth
yer razor most likely is dull and needs to be honed...

Well, I'll tell you I bought a razor from Martin,the TI Silverwing LE and though I didn't pay extra for honing it came with a sheet saying to shave with it out of the box and not even strop it. That wasn't a TI instruction it was Martin's. What a joke. Forget about the no stropping it wouldn't shave worth a damn.

So my advice is send it out to a honemeister for sharpening. Certainly your inexperience could be a factor also however until you know for sure that your razor is sharp you'l never know.

It's most likely stropping technique at the moment. I'd say it was very likely shave ready when you received it, & the most likely culprit since then would be stropping. There's a lot to learn in the first few weeks, & proper stropping is one of them.

Have a look at this page & see if it helps. Razor stropping - Straight Razor Place Wiki. It's possible you can get it back with improved technique. If not, you'll have to get it honed.

:gl:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Scabby

Hello friends,

I am new to straight razor shaving and I seem to be having a bit of trouble. I know that it is because of my inexperience, but I was wondering if it was also because the razor is not sharp enough.

I have only shaved with the razor three times. It is a Le Grelot 6/8 1/4 hollow razor that I had pre-honed by Martin at razurpur.de. Most people say he hones razors well, so it probably arrived nice and sharp. I don't know how common it is for the razor to become dull after only a few shaves, but I think it is possibly why I'm having trouble. I am using firm, confident strokes, but I get a lot of tugging, rather than slicing, on my neck and chin. It seemed worse the third time I shaved than the second time. The first time I don't remember getting to much tugging, although chin and neck hair were harder for me to cut. I just remember not knowing how to hold the razor.

The razor doesn't pass the hanging hair test. It also doesn't seem to tug at my skin when I try the thumb pad test. Because I am not an expert at the TPT I compared the feeling of the straight to that of a fresh DE blade. The DE felt like it was tugging at my skin but there was significantly less tugging with the straight. It was much smoother feeling.

Anyway, I was wondering what you guys thought about this. Maybe I did something to dull it. I don't think it's my stropping technique, because I have been doing it slowly and lightly while keeping the strop taut, and it makes the sound like you are supposed to hear. Maybe the way I was slicing at the hairs or pushing the razor against my face caused it to dull? Or dulled it some other way? Or maybe it's not dull at all, it's just my technique?

I recently bought a barber hone (pike swaty). Is this a good hone for keeping my razor edge sharp? How often should I expect to have to hone this razor, and around how many strokes do you estimate? If it's not such a great hone, what would you recommend?

Thanks a lot!

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This is such a common problem for new shavers. It is much more likely that you are not shaving correctly than that Martin did not hone it right. Have you read the beginner's stickies or watched shaving videos?

Glen already covered the shaving issue so I'll touch on the hone. The Pike Swaty is just fine as a barber hone. You use it following the same instruction as the real Swatys in that you use it wet or with lather and take only 3 to 5 strokes. Then you strop and test shave and repeat the honing as needed. If the shave is not adequate, then it's time to re-hone. Don't wait until the shave gets really bad. Do it as soon as the quality of shave diminishes. Frequency of honing depends on lots of factors including beard type and prep, stropping routine, razor quality, and shaving technique. Some people touch up as often as every ten shaves while other go for months.

As a beginner, like me, don't think about honing. Just don't. By the time you want to start with that, don't use your production material, use a cheap razor you can hone to smithereens.

Look at technique, and don't be disappointed that you don't get lightningfast BBS-shaves after a few weeks with 2 passes. Pick it up slowly and make sure you think about what you do. At least that works for me, analyze what I do and do it conscientious. Then look at the stropping. Jockeys, Seraphim and lots of members have stropping clips online, and shaving clips as well. Watch, listen and learn.

It's not instant gratification, although I don't think that's what you're after, it's a gradual process of improvement.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Scabby

I don't think it's my stropping technique, because I have been doing it slowly and lightly while keeping the strop taut, and it makes the sound like you are supposed to hear.

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I think you're a bit too gentle with the stropping. Taut is good. It's not a stretching exercise tough. Just the force applied to keep the strop taut when there's no razor on it, is good. During stropping, you need some friction, not a lot, but there must be a kind of draw between the steel and the leather. It depends on the strop how likely it is to get draw and you must adjust your stropping pressure accordingly. I also think it's important to use some speed. It doesn't need to be lightning fast, just try to avoid slow motion.

If I'm right and your razor has fallen back from a lack of effective stropping, then you need to catch up a bit. I suggest 50 laps on linen and 100 on the strop. Check with your TPT before and after. You should be able to sense a difference. It's a good exercise to develop a feel for the TPT.

Good luck,
Bart.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Utopian

This is such a common problem for new shavers. It is much more likely that you are not shaving correctly than that Martin did not hone it right. Have you read the beginner's stickies or watched shaving videos?

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I have been watching shaving videos. I have been trying to follow the techniques on the videos. It really seems like experienced shavers have a "plan" for tackling the hair on their faces. I have tried to plan it out better also.

I actually enjoy my shaves, and get relatively close without too much irritation. Usually just miss a couple spots. It really seems like I have to do a lot of "battling" to get certain areas of my face. Like the razor just doesn't want to go through those hairs. I have to push pretty hard, and I feel some pulling.

When I did get a professional straight razor shave by a barber, I felt some similar pulling under my neck. Maybe it's the nature of my hair? I do know that it was a great shave, I just winced during the first pass under my neck.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bart

I think you're a bit too gentle with the stropping. Taut is good. It's not a stretching exercise tough. Just the force applied to keep the strop taut when there's no razor on it, is good. During stropping, you need some friction, not a lot, but there must be a kind of draw between the steel and the leather. It depends on the strop how likely it is to get draw and you must adjust your stropping pressure accordingly. I also think it's important to use some speed. It doesn't need to be lightning fast, just try to avoid slow motion.

If I'm right and your razor has fallen back from a lack of effective stropping, then you need to catch up a bit. I suggest 50 laps on linen and 100 on the strop. Check with your TPT before and after. You should be able to sense a difference. It's a good exercise to develop a feel for the TPT.

Good luck,
Bart.

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Thanks for the advice. I'll strop more like this next time and see if that helps any.

My strop is a latigo leather strop from tony miller. It doesn't have linen. Will 150 on that work or should I do more or something else to make up for not having linen?

I also suspect stropping technique. Sounds like the shaves got progressively worse.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Scabby

Thanks for the advice. I'll strop more like this next time and see if that helps any.

My strop is a latigo leather strop from tony miller. It doesn't have linen. Will 150 on that work or should I do more or something else to make up for not having linen?

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Just do the 100 laps, and find out if it helps.
The linen has a reputation for being slightly more abrasive while the leather really is more about realigning. There is a lot of speculation about stropping, and little solid facts known. But linen definitely has its virtues for me.

Just keep us posted on the progress (or the lack thereof), and we'll take it from there.

Good luck,
Bart.

Whether or not linen actually does something the leather does not do... I just don't know and can't tell. However, it is some damn good fun! Simple pleasures. :)

Scabby,

FWIW, recently I've been trying MParker's recommendations on using the linen/cotton part of my strop(s) fairly extensively before doing the leather routine. I do 60-70 laps on the linen (real linen from Tony Miller) and then 40-50 on a HandAmerican buffed horsehide Old Dawg strop followed by about the same # of strokes on another horsehide strop (supposedly shell cordovan). I'm not a fan of a grreat deal of draw on a strop which is why I like horsehide. I may be stropping with more strokes than necessary, but it gives the lather a chance to soak in so I figure it can't hurt.

With this routine, I am also coming to agree with MParker's analysis that the linen has some very subtle abrasive qualities which adds to the edge prep for a very close and smooth shave.

If you keep 1-2 spine thicknesses between your face and the spine of the razor, things should be just fine. Two spine widths away from my face is too much for my style of shaving. Fiddle with the angle and you'll come up with something that suits your components and technique.

By the by, the 1/4 hollow Le Grelot in my opinion is one of the nicest razors out there and IMO Martin's honing sets it up to work well.

And there you go: analyses worth exactly what they cost. :rofl2:

good luck, good shaving

I Suspect stropping as well. This was the same exact issue I had when I started and I found out I wasn't drawing my razor on the strop correctly even though it seemed like I absolutely was to me. You should feel some draw on the strop when you're going back and forth. Keep the strop tight also. Hopefully the edge can be restropped into a good shaving edge. Pulling is always bad on your face, and it can lead to some nasty cuts. I have been shaving since I was thirteen and I have the heaviest beard of all the guys I know, it is like copper wiring. My razors can still cut through the hairs without getting snagged on my face. If it feels wrong, then it probably is.

When you strop is the strop at your waist height or is it hanging vertically somewhere?

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Originally Posted by Disburden

When you strop is the strop at your waist height or is it hanging vertically somewhere?

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I used to have it hanging in the closet but now I'm doing it at waist level. It seems a little easier this way.

I shaved again today after stropping many times. I tried to strop a bit quicker and not quite as lightly.

I think the razor felt slightly better today. There was less pulling but I didn't get as close a shave. This was because I started to see speckles of rust on my razor after awhile before I had a chance to shave over the spots with left-over stubble. I stopped shaving and put some oil on my razor. The rust spots don't really look that bad now. I have been trying to take especially good care of my razor because when I tried to take up straight shaving a couple months ago I didn't use oil on my old razor and got some rust on it (I also chipped it eventually).

I also noticed that the razor seemed sharper on the part of the blade near the shank of the razor. It's probably because I had been using mostly the end of the blade to shave previously. Maybe I need to try using all parts of the blade more evenly.

I think I will try a few strokes on the barber hone before next time, and see if that improves the shave.

Hey Scabby, welcome to SRP!

It does sound like the Razor is getting less sharp so I would suspect your stropping technique.. it more stropping improved the shave I guess you are on the right track... so you could strop some more..

I also had a strop without a linnen side I just added some athletics/sports tape to the back and stropped on that.it worked for me..( take care that there isnt any glue residue on there anymore)

I dont know if I would start on the barber hone already..

Maarten

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mlangstr

I also had a strop without a linnen side I just added some athletics/sports tape to the back and stropped on that.it worked for me..( take care that there isnt any glue residue on there anymore)

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This is an interesting idea. I guess I should try this before I go to the barber hone. Did you put several layers of tape to make it padded or just one layer?

Hi Scabby,

I started all this about 6 months ago and have only just gotten to the stage where I can get a smooth shave every day, and only with two of my razors, ther are 3 or 4 others that I am nearly up to scratch with but can't quite get them there yet. Even my Dovo won't play nice, it keeps falling just short of shave ready.

I only recently got a good strop to replace the cheap one I began with and killed a few months ago. I killed it by adding goose grease as strop dressing then removing it with too much soap and forgetting it was drying near the radiator. 3 stupid mistakes in one. For months I had no real strop and no good shaves, i even went to shaving off the coticule for a while as it was the best choice I had.

For me I would say a good strop that has been broken in well is the crucial factor, even one treatment with lather and a bottle will make a huge difference to some strops. Once I had got that in my kit and learnt to strop with a smooth and flowing technique things really changed.

You really do need friction though, either good draw or a little speed, slow careful stropping doesn't help in my experience.

I would seriously advise buying a few old razors off ebay to practise honing and stropping with, or much better: buy one from one of the guys on here, then you know it is a good razor that has been cared for, I have some great looking ones from ebay that just refuse to take an edge no matter what I try. If I had only those two razors I would have quit this long ago thining it was jsut me.

I also use an old car safety belt instead of a linen strop, it works very well indeed and comes free from the local scrap yard, make sure the edge is not heat sealed though.

With a little Cro Ox on one side of the safety belt (less is more -seriously!) one side clean and a good, smooooth leather strop I find I can quickly bring my razors back to shave ready.

If you jump into honing it now you may find it many months before you get back the edge you need.

Learn to strop first, learn honing later, when you need to.

Unless you get bitten by the bug like so many of us.

Then you will be up to your neck in strops, razors, hones, pastes and shaving soaps within a week, referrring to this site like your new bible, cursing your dull razors that pull your beard mercilessly and loving every minute of it.

I cannot stress, though, how much things improved once I took stropping seriously.

Some good tips here:

http://straightrazorpalace.com/strop...-mistakes.html

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Scabby

This is an interesting idea. I guess I should try this before I go to the barber hone. Did you put several layers of tape to make it padded or just one layer?

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I just put one layer on there. I used the widest tape i could find and put it on the backside of my hanging strop.. it is not as wide as the strop itself but that doesn't seem to be a problem... I just put it near the edge of the strop.

Maarten

Try playing with the angle of the blade. Most people will disagree but a steeper angle works better on my face. This is qualified saying 'My face", YMMV.

The other thing I do is use a buffing stroke sometimes. You take a one inch stroke then come up 3/4 of an inch and then take another one stroke and repeat. If you do this every section of your face will get the blade several times.

You should never, ever, ever, ever be tugging the razor against your face. That is hands and knees begging for a huge cut. Remember use a light touch with your blade.

Lastly, don't go for BBS on your first pass. Your goal with every pass should be to be a little smoother than the last pass. I will even go so far as to say do a second WTG pass before you go ATG. You should get noticably less tugging. Eventualy it will all fall together and you will get rockin' shaves.

UPDATE!!

I am now pretty convinced that my razor is not sharp. I ordered a razor from the classifieds and shaved with it with much better results. The new razor I got is a 5/8 full hollow and the other one is a 1/4 hollow 6/8. I don't think the width or grind is making the difference because everyone says the Le Grelot shaves well. Let's just hope that I don't ruin the edge on the new one.

I shaved twice with the new razor and got good results. I also shaved a couple times with my old razor after following your advice: I tried changing my stropping technique, stropping with athletic tape, and after this didn't seem to help very much I ran the blade over my swaty a few times.

Can you recommend someone who can hone my blade for me and perhaps look at it and tell me what might have gone wrong (I don't even know if you can tell that by looking at it)? I'm currently in San Diego. Are there any good ones nearby?

Thanks!

If you bought the razor from the classifieds, and it shaves well, and the seller honed it himself, you may want to ask him to hone the Le Grelot for you. I am sure he wouldn’t mind.


You could also check the Member Services in the classifieds, any one of those fellows will do a good job.


I would hone it for you, but I am in NY… PM me if you are interested.