I am somewhat confused

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06-19-2009, 07:28 AM
demetriustracy

I am somewhat confused

I believe the best way to test a newly honed razor is to shave with it. I am confused about what is the difference between a bevel and a wired edge. I do not have a true definition of a wired edge as far as performance and visibility. From videos, a wired edge is the visible line that shows as you slowly move your razor in bright light. I am honing a razor and it gave a comfortable but not very close shave according to other razors I have on a first pass. I was thinking of back honing and starting from scratch. I do not want to jump to conclusions. Please correct my newbie hearsay.
06-19-2009, 07:32 AM
JMS

Quote:

Originally Posted by demetriustracy

I believe the best way to test a newly honed razor is to shave with it. I am confused about what is the difference between a bevel and a wired edge. I do not have a true definition of a wired edge as far as performance and visibility. From videos, a wired edge is the visible line that shows as you slowly move your razor in bright light. I am honing a razor and it gave a comfortable but not very close shave according to other razors I have on a first pass. I was thinking of back honing and starting from scratch. I do not want to jump to conclusions. Please correct my newbie hearsay.

You are officially invited to come up the hill and see me! Make sure you bring your hones and a razor. PM me for more info
06-19-2009, 07:45 AM
VeeDubb65

First of all, take JMS up on his offer if you're able. There's no substitute for learning first hand.

As far as the difference between a bevel, and a wire edge, they are completely different things. I'm not into honing razors (yet) but neither of these terms are specific to razors, and I've honed darn near everything else at some point or other.

Bevel: Generally refers to the particular angle at which an edge is honed. Setting the bevel (the angle of the edge) correctly and evenly is considered to be the most important part of sharpening/honing. The goal is to set a bevel on each side of the razor that is uniform from end to end, uniform in angle and width on each side, and meets at the narrowest possible edge.

Wire edge: Sometimes used to refer to the microscopic edge that develops where the bevels on each side of the blade meet when honing something very fine like a razor. With razors specifically, it's often used to describe a particular effect of improper honing, where metal starts to form something like a microscopic wire along the edge, which is in no way sharp enough to shave with.
06-19-2009, 08:26 AM
gugi

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMS

You are officially invited to come up the hill and see me! Make sure you bring your hones and a razor. PM me for more info

Here's a little secret - when you go to visit Mark bring along some belgian beer, then just watch the magic happens....
06-19-2009, 10:40 AM
bassguy

Quote:

Originally Posted by gugi

Here's a little secret - when you go to visit Mark bring along some belgian beer, then just watch the magic happens....

Kasteel Quadrupel anyone?
06-19-2009, 02:18 PM
gssixgun

For those not fortunate enough to live by the "Mark"...

Burrs, Wire Edges, Overhoning.....

These are all bad things when it comes to honing straight razors...Forget everything you thought you knew about sharpening anything else, it's not the same....
All of these bad things come from one part of honing and that is pressure, that is why there is soooooooo much emphasis on "NO PRESSURE" while honing, and while you don't want pressure you do need to have enough to keep the blade even on the hone...

A burr, is just that it, forms when you apply pressure to the edge from one side. this is how many tools are sharpened and a burr tells the sharpener that his edge has met and that he just needs to refine it now (Think Chisel).... BAD news to a razor...

A wire edge, forms when both sides of the edge are being honed and a tiny, tiny, wire forms and when broken off leaves an edge that can now be refined into a cutting edge... (Think Knife)

Overhoned, is just that you have either done to many strokes, or you used pressure and the edge of the razor is sooooooo thin, that it falls apart and leaves a rough toothy edge, instead of a fine smooth edge....

This is why we always say that you need to sneak up on a razors edge.....

Please keep in mind that I don't know jack about honing tools or knives so if I described something slightly wrong, and you have intimate knowledge about sharpening these things, I defer to your wisdom...
06-19-2009, 02:25 PM
JimmyHAD

Quote:

Originally Posted by demetriustracy

I am somewhat confused

Me too :cry: ......:D Really nice of Mark to make the offer. I learned a heck of a lot from The Topher, a more experienced honer that used to be on the forums and lived close enough to me. Stuff I probably would never have figured out for myself. :gl:
06-21-2009, 06:56 AM
demetriustracy

I had a great day of instruction by JMS. Thank you for all the advice and also for a smooth and even Norton. The shave went well. I might try to sharpen further, but only after about 4 shaves. You have given me a good base to start from. Again thanks alot.
06-21-2009, 01:11 PM
jendeindustries

Quote:

Originally Posted by gssixgun

For those not fortunate enough to live by the "Mark"...

Burrs, Wire Edges, Overhoning.....

These are all bad things when it comes to honing straight razors...Forget everything you thought you knew about sharpening anything else, it's not the same....
All of these bad things come from one part of honing and that is pressure, that is why there is soooooooo much emphasis on "NO PRESSURE" while honing, and while you don't want pressure you do need to have enough to keep the blade even on the hone...

A burr, is just that it, forms when you apply pressure to the edge from one side. this is how many tools are sharpened and a burr tells the sharpener that his edge has met and that he just needs to refine it now (Think Chisel).... BAD news to a razor...

A wire edge, forms when both sides of the edge are being honed and a tiny, tiny, wire forms and when broken off leaves an edge that can now be refined into a cutting edge... (Think Knife)

Overhoned, is just that you have either done to many strokes, or you used pressure and the edge of the razor is sooooooo thin, that it falls apart and leaves a rough toothy edge, instead of a fine smooth edge....

This is why we always say that you need to sneak up on a razors edge.....

Please keep in mind that I don't know jack about honing tools or knives so if I described something slightly wrong, and you have intimate knowledge about sharpening these things, I defer to your wisdom...

+1 but I think I met jack and his family a few times :D. I concur with everything above - still working on the pressure bit though for the SR...
06-21-2009, 04:44 PM
JMS

Quote:

Originally Posted by gugi

Here's a little secret - when you go to visit Mark bring along some belgian beer, then just watch the magic happens....

And he brought one too!
Now gugi, how can I kick the newbies around when you keep giving them the secret of getting on my good side?

;):D
06-22-2009, 05:57 AM
biffdebris

Finally, after 10 years away, a reason I'd move back to San Diego! You wouldn't happen to be coming to Spokane, or Boise, or Pendleton, or Walla Walla, or...
06-22-2009, 06:10 AM
gssixgun

Quote:

Originally Posted by biffdebris

Finally, after 10 years away, a reason I'd move back to San Diego! You wouldn't happen to be coming to Spokane, or Boise, or Pendleton, or Walla Walla, or...

Your in my end of the country.... The inland NW