How close is a 'close' shave?

I've only been str8 shaving for about 2 months now, and before that it had always been crappy cartridge razors. I see people talking about BBS shaves, and I'm not really sure what a close shave really means...

When I give myself a close shave, it feels super smooth (BBS) when i rub my hand WTG along my face. But as soon as I move my hand against the grain, my face feels like some serious sandpaper! This has been true ever since I started shaving (cartridge and str8).

no matter how many WTG and XTG passes I do, I've never been able to get a smooth feeling when I rub my hand against the grain. Only when I shave against the grain, which is never ever comfortable for me, can I get that entirely smooth feeling. How are people able to get BBS without shaving against the grain?

I'm wondering if it's the way my whiskers grow. Especially around my neck, my whiskers grow at a very shallow angle. My skin is pretty taught to begin with, so stretching against the grain can only do so much...

Am I cursed to never be able to get a BBS shave??

I don't know if anyone can answer that ? We all have different skin and beards. I know that it took me awhile to get the same level of smoothness with a straight as I could get with a Merkur Slant and a Gillette Swede or a Feather.

Even when I was getting 95% of my shave bbs there was a spot on either side of my windpipe that I had to learn how to get smooth. That was with a combination of blade angle and stretching in alternative directions. If you've never gotten a smooth ATG with any type of razor I wouldn't know what to tell you. :gl:

There are more than a couple members who say you can't be truly BBS without a full ATG pass, but I digress.

I say don't be so worried about what others consider to be BBS, and concentrate on smooth, COMFORTABLE shaves for YOU. Comfort comes before closeness for most people.

FWIW there are areas on my neck that will not tolerate ATG no matter what. It will look smooth, but not feel smooth. Does it matter? Probably not. But I only save true BBS shaves, and the neck irritation that comes with it, for very special occasions, like my wedding last month.

I hope this helps.

If I rub the back of my fingers against the grain, with a little pressure and I don't feel any stubble whatsoever is a BBS shave (for me anyway)
I can get a BBS on the cheeks, a little spotty on the neck, and almost there in the goatee area.
I have been shaving for about two months also, but I'm not to worried about getting a complete BBS shave just yet. I think I'm still in the learning stage, and from what I've read from other members posts, I don't expect to get a really good handle on it for about 4 more months, even though I feel that way right now.

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Originally Posted by DanS

When I give myself a close shave, it feels super smooth (BBS) when i rub my hand WTG along my face. But as soon as I move my hand against the grain, my face feels like some serious sandpaper! This has been true ever since I started shaving (cartridge and str8).

no matter how many WTG and XTG passes I do, I've never been able to get a smooth feeling when I rub my hand against the grain. Only when I shave against the grain, which is never ever comfortable for me, can I get that entirely smooth feeling. How are people able to get BBS without shaving against the grain?



Am I cursed to never be able to get a BBS shave??

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Sorry to say i think you have some sharpness problem. if your blade sharp enough you shouldn't feel uncomfortable while go ATG.
I am the person against to go ATG but you can if you like to. You should be able to get a good shave with wtg and xtg.
while you use your hands atg won't feel like sandpaper.

You might also have an angle issue. ATG can be very uncomfortable if you have the blade at too steep an angle. Stretching your skin ATG is also important. Make sure you are stretching the right direction or it will make the issue worse.

BBS is a term that gets used very freely on shave fora (forums ?)
I doubt anyone that's been Str8 shaving for 2 months is achieving BBS & if they are I bet they're definition will change in another 12 months.
Sounds like you're doing ok at this stage but just need to work on the ATG pass.
For that you will need a well honed razor & an accumulation of skill. The former can be achieved quickly but the latter takes time.
Keep at it.

For me and I don't use str8's yet just DE's and my jaw line is still a trouble spot,like said before comfort is key,and I get a better shave now than ever,not just to me but my wife likes it as well.So like siad above COMFORT is key.You can keep trying to achieve this bbs but your skin will tell you otherwise, listn to what your face tells you while your shaving,it'll let you know when enuf is enuf.

As already stated, I guess BBS is whatever we personally want it to mean. For me, BBS is two things:

• Feel no stickers or hair, no matter which direction I move my hand on face.
• Feel no stickers or hair, no matter which direction I move my hand on face for several hours.

I hate for my face to feel smooth now. But, in 30 minutes start to feel stickers.

For me,on my neck,I have to START with the ATG pass and have the blade ALMOST flat against the skin.

I am going to upset you Unimaru55.
I've been using straight for more less 2 month and my BBs means no roughness on my face. I am 40 so my grains are pretty tough. With some effort I archive it every day.

My advice is, don't worry about achieving BBS and enjoy the shave. It'll either come or it won't. Just concentrate on getting a good, comfortable shave. That doesn't answer your question though, so, in answer to your question… as close as you want it to be. (This is one of those subjective parts of the discipline.)YMMV etc.

I agree with Sham. For me, I can't get my shaves totally smooth without going ATG (usually twice), but AGT is comfortable for me so it's not an issue.

Cheers!

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Originally Posted by DPflaumer

You might also have an angle issue. ATG can be very uncomfortable if you have the blade at too steep an angle. Stretching your skin ATG is also important. Make sure you are stretching the right direction or it will make the issue worse.

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+1 on the angle. ATG pass should be made (I think) with a watered-down lather and less of an angle than the WTG pass. And stretching cannot be over-emphasized.

I'm pretty new too but since I've been doing some experimentation going back and forth between shavette, regular straight, and some gilette products (sensor excel II and fusion) and I'll chime in here with what I see so far:

1. There seems to me to be a trade-off between closeness and comfort no matter what you use. More passes and including ATG gives superior closeness (for me) and longer lasting BBS feeling throughout the day, but worse comfort. Difference for me is that with a straight I can achieve a BBS feeling that lasts a good portion of the day - at least through lunch hour, and even after that it never feels scruffy late in the day as is common wth cartridge types. Also the cartridge type never does get me quite as close to begin with.

2. Everyone's different but I have to do some amount of ATG to get true BBS. I'm still working on how to make that comfortable. I'm getting better at it and I expect it to improve over time with practice and learning. I do not expect that it'll ever be as comfortable as a single WTG pass of course.

3. There seems to me to be an optimum sharpness range. Shavette with new blade = super sharp and gives no tugging or snags as it mows through the whiskers like a hot knife through butter. But at that level of sharpness I'm sure to have a handful of weepers when finished. A regular freshly honed straight shouldn't tug too much but in my limited experience neither will it mow 'em down like a fresh shavette blade. Less weepers though and certainly capable of getting BBS. Somehow the straight seems to leave your skin in different state than the shavette - not sure if that is sharpness or some other effect (like the shape of the hollow grind or who knows what else...). If it's not sharp enough a straight begins to hurt as it tugs the whiskers too much, and more or less rules out an ATG pass (for me at least).

Other stuff... I have some nice pre-shave oil but I hope I don't have to resort to actually using it regularly. Post shave treatment is huge for comfort. If I use the wrong after shave the effect on comfort become cumulative so that after 3 or 4 days of using something that maybe smells nice but doesn't do much for healing "ATG skin trauma" then by the 3rd or 4th day of using that stuff I can't get a comfortable shave no matter what I do. I've found AOS post shave balm is great in this respect, as well as the Ogalalla stuff. I haven't tried an alum block yet but probably will soon.

I tend to agree with the earlier comment that it sounds like you have a sharpness problem, but the other thing to consider is whether your post-shave treatment is helping to heal your skin between assaults. If not, you may be going down a rat-hole of worse and worse comfort each time because you never do quite heal up in between (learned that one the hard way...).

Hope some of that is helpful. Good luck.

Charlie

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How are people able to get BBS without shaving against the grain?

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I don't think you can get a bbs shave w/o going against the grain. Your razor has to be sharp enough and it should come clean for you.

Rich


Always acknowledge a fault frankly. This will throw those in authority off their guard and give you an opportunity to commit more.” – Mark Twain

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Originally Posted by mojka

I am going to upset you Unimaru55.
I've been using straight for more less 2 month and my BBs means no roughness on my face. I am 40 so my grains are pretty tough. With some effort I archive it every day.

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Good for you but in general people don't always learn as fast as you did :)

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Originally Posted by onimaru55

Good for you but in general people don't always learn as fast as you did :)

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That's true. Just be patient, and it will come. :gl:

You can not expect to get almost perfect shaves after 2 months. If you are not cutting yourself and everything is going good, that is all you can expect. For most people it takes over a year and a half to get those crazy close shaves with almost no irritation, daily.:D How you accomplish that will take intimate knowledge of your own face, a lot of thought about getting a better shave and some techniques that you have yet to develop. I am learning something almost weekly. Your honing skills have to be very good to excellent to get those buttery smooth shaves that you can only dream of when you are first starting out. Just kick back and enjoy the shaves that you are getting and it will come to you.


Take care,
Richard

I vote the sharpness too.
If you have a truly shave ready razor you shouldn't feel uncomfortable while doing atg. If you have a dull blade you probably try to compensate the dullness and might load too much pressure on the blade.....just to make it cut better. And the result is that it won't cut any better but goes deeper in your skin and cause irritation due to unneccessary exfoliating.
For me BBS is not a big thing. :fim:
I admit it's a great feeling but I prefer to shave every day as it's my truly morning meditation and preparation for a brand new day.
Wtg & xtg give enough close shave for me daily and occasionally I'll go to atg.
Also if you have a truly sharp object in your hands be careful with stretching and pressure load.....ingrown isn't fun at all.

I agree that you may have a sharpness issue as well as needing to build up to a full ATG pass. Start with your cheeks first and slowly enlarge the area shaved ATG. Skill won't come over night.

I would agree that the first thing is a sharp blade, as sharp as you can get it. But the thing that makes a straight better for getting some spots smoother than a double edge is the ability to vary the angle, and generally the shallower the angle in those tough spots the closer you will shave. But the big challenge is that if your beard grows like mine, it doesn't have two simple directions, and you have to learn over time which way WTG, ATG, and XTG are all over your face and neck, and they are not the same. I have to spend a lot of time on my chin because it is not a flat surface and because the grain goes to the side, actually, so I shave it every which way. There are other spots like on one side of my neck and under my chin where it is simply not practical to comfortably get a straight pointed exactly against the grain, so I settle for a less than ideal feel there for the most part. My 2C.

Don J.

I am out for a BBS shave everytime I shave and the only way for me is WTG, XTG, and ATG. The ATG action may cause some cuts and weepers, but a good cold water rise will close them up.

The feeling is smooth, smooth, smooth and beyond anything you get from a cartridge razor. You will just keep feeling how smooth it is and be pleased with it. The facial hairs take a longer time to grow back due to a nice BBS shave.

My higher end straights can get the job done in two passes, but it takes some advance technique to accomplish this. My bottom line straight takes three passes and the third pass is mostly about getting areas around the windpipe a little smoother or perhaps the jawline could be a little smoother and need a once over.

I have all the decent tools and I always give the face a good prep. There is no substitute for the feeling of a BBS (Baby Butt Smooth) shave. Once you are hitting it, it becomes addictive.

Pabster

I only try the bbs when im going to receive a nobel prize, otherwise a well done wtg is very enought to me. And more secure, healthier, faster.

How close is very close ? Pass a cotton on your face and you will see.