Shavette shaving vs Straight razor shaving

I have been learning straight razor shaving using a Dannyco Magico 112 Shavette (Dannyco - Home Page). I am starting to get a confortable shave with it. I have decided to move on and to buy a real one. I bought a Dovo Silver steel round edge 5/8 , full-hollow razor and i shaved twice with it this week.

My first shave was awfull. First, i am not used to the longer edge. Second, i found that even if the vendor said the razor had been honed on stones (i bought it on the classified ), it seemed that it had problems cutting the whiskers. It was ok just for the sideburns. I could not get a good shave because it felt like it was pulling instead of cutting. I had to complete my shave with the Shavette. My face was so red when i finished, my immediate thought was that the razor was not sharp enough.

I exchanged and email with the seller and he suggested that it might be my technique and to wait after a few more shave to see if i could experiment with the cutting angles and see if i get a better shave.

The second shave was a bit better. I had received my strope and i stroped the razor on the linen (20 times) and then the leather (30 to 40). THis time, i used pre-shave oil to further help. It appeared that it was a bit easier to cut the whiskers. But i found it was harder than the Shavette. The chin is the region i had the most problems with. It seemed it had problems cutting the whiskers. In the end, my face was red and burning, but i managed to have a BBS . At what cost!

Is this normal ? I am tempted to shave with the Shavette next time to see if i have lost the touch of shaving... Then try again the next time with the Dovo.

I am looking for advices. I am thinking this razor may not be sharp enough. I tried the hair test a few times on the Dovo and the Shavette. Everytime, it appeared that the Shavette was quicker to cut the hair. The Dovo blade would cut sharp the hair but it seemed it was pulling or having a problem doing it . I am no expert in doing this test and it may be just me being biased when doing the test.

I do not have hones. I am still undecided on what i will buy. I will be looking for a fast and reliable hone. I have yet to decide between Nawina, Shapton or Norton .. That will be the next question after i have fixed this issue.

Thanks

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MichelG

I have been learning straight razor shaving using a Dannyco Magico 112 Shavette (Dannyco - Home Page). I am starting to get a confortable shave with it. I have decided to move on and to buy a real one. I bought a Dovo Silver steel round edge 5/8 , full-hollow razor and i shaved twice with it this week.

My first shave was awfull. First, i am not used to the longer edge. Second, i found that even if the vendor said the razor had been honed on stones (i bought it on the classified ), it seemed that it had problems cutting the whiskers. It was ok just for the sideburns. I could not get a good shave because it felt like it was pulling instead of cutting. I had to complete my shave with the Shavette. My face was so red when i finished, my immediate thought was that the razor was not sharp enough.

I exchanged and email with the seller and he suggested that it might be my technique and to wait after a few more shave to see if i could experiment with the cutting angles and see if i get a better shave.

The second shave was a bit better. I had received my strope and i stroped the razor on the linen (20 times) and then the leather (30 to 40). THis time, i used pre-shave oil to further help. It appeared that it was a bit easier to cut the whiskers. But i found it was harder than the Shavette. The chin is the region i had the most problems with. It seemed it had problems cutting the whiskers. In the end, my face was red and burning, but i managed to have a BBS . At what cost!

Is this normal ? I am tempted to shave with the Shavette next time to see if i have lost the touch of shaving... Then try again the next time with the Dovo.

I am looking for advices. I am thinking this razor may not be sharp enough. I tried the hair test a few times on the Dovo and the Shavette. Everytime, it appeared that the Shavette was quicker to cut the hair. The Dovo blade would cut sharp the hair but it seemed it was pulling or having a problem doing it . I am no expert in doing this test and it may be just me being biased when doing the test.

I do not have hones. I am still undecided on what i will buy. I will be looking for a fast and reliable hone. I have yet to decide between Nawina, Shapton or Norton .. That will be the next question after i have fixed this issue.

Thanks

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You are covering a lot of ground here with your questions, and I am not sure what is causing your problems without seeing the razor in person. this may be a case where you just need to experiment with a few things and revisit this in a couple of weeks. I would say that you shouldn't sacrifice your face for a smooth shave. If you are not getting a good shave, it's either the razor or you. No need to force either one if it's just not there yet.

based on my (a month) experience good lather preserve good shave, of course then you should have shave ready blade the good beard preparation...but as far as I read all the wiki and threads here, shaving with shavette and str8 razor is different in many aspect...

I'm a newbie my self, so my advice might not really help (then what's the point I'm writting here :gaah:), I started SRS just a month ago, but unlike you, I start with str8 razor (not with shavette or any DE) after years using electric and mach3, having said that I butchered my face, getting irritation, etc. but in the end after a month each shave getting better result, nowadays I can get good BBS without any irritation but still need to work on several area but in overall I get better result...

I can't seem to find people that get straight BBS shave in the first try (in the right way, I did have BBS in wrong way, irritation, etc.), some people spend months and years, and that's just part of the learning curve, the beard prep, lathering, angle, stropping, etc. If you did good in shavette then the problem might be your blade and angle, since shavette is typically sharper than straight razor out from the factory, but still logically str8 razor can be made as sharp as shavette, the point is that in straight razor you choose how sharp you want (or the honemeister choose, if you're not hone it yourself) while in DB, basically you get whatever the factory made for you.

good luck!

I followed the same path, execept it went faster for me. It just happened that I received my straight faster. So I used the Dannyco only once.

In my case, the straight made it easier. But it was really shave ready, so I could know right away how it was supposed to be and when I found the second shave less comfortable I knew I had to use the strop.

If it can help you, I noticed that I use a smaller angle with the straight than with the Dannyco.

And my opinion is that the honing on stoned should not be the last step. Stropping it on a leather strop should follow the honing and be used before each shave.

I'm no expert myself so it is only my opinion based on my little experience of 1 week...

Gilles

Thanks, yes, i probably put too much information. It is hard to gauge just how much is enough. For this Thread, i am seeking for information comparing Shavette shaving vs straigth.

I read another thread where someone mentionned that a Straight is not as sharp and does not slide through the hair as easily. This confirms the hair test . Even though the Dovo popped the hair it was not as quick as the Shavette in doing so.

I was thinking some more about how i shaved and the difference between my first and second shave. I shaved with the straight using the same speed and technique i was using with the shavette (what else did i know). The second time, i went a little slower and i had stropped the razor before (i did not the first time because i had not received my strope - i rely on mail order since it is hard to find straight equipment around here).

Since the straight does not slice as easily, perhaps the pulling of the whiskers is a consequence of going too fast and an improper angle. I will play closer attention next time. This is mother's day tomorrow , here, and my wife has pleaded i do not use the straight today . Next week, i will make another attempt . In the meantime, i will keep reading and will get back to basics to uncover what i am doing wrong.

Thanks

Well, i have shaved for a third time using the straight razor. I was afraid of using it and wanted to use the shavette. However, i thought i needed to use the straight if i really wanted to learn to master it. I took my time and paid attention to the pressure and angle of the blade. I used light slicing strokes. It worked ! I got a decent shave: only 3 nicks, considerably less redenning (almost none - only the chin). One was caused by a mistake and the other two because i came back to the same spot too often.

I guess that i need to get used to my new razor. Shaving is improving at a fast rate. I still have the impression that the Shavette is sharper and can give a faster shave.

I believe that i need more mileage to get better at it. I was reading the post for May 2010 advices, the gentleman who wrote it was observing that most of us complaining that our new razors were not sharp enough had to work on our techniques. I believe from my little experience that he is damn right! I need to get back to basics and pay attention to my technique and get used to my new razor. It is a different beast than the shavette and i must learn to control it to give a confortable shave.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MichelG

Well, i have shaved for a third time using the straight razor. I was afraid of using it and wanted to use the shavette. However, i thought i needed to use the straight if i really wanted to learn to master it. I took my time and paid attention to the pressure and angle of the blade. I used light slicing strokes. It worked ! I got a decent shave: only 3 nicks, considerably less redenning (almost none - only the chin). One was caused by a mistake and the other two because i came back to the same spot too often.

I guess that i need to get used to my new razor. Shaving is improving at a fast rate. I still have the impression that the Shavette is sharper and can give a faster shave.

I believe that i need more mileage to get better at it. I was reading the post for May 2010 advices, the gentleman who wrote it was observing that most of us complaining that our new razors were not sharp enough had to work on our techniques. I believe from my little experience that he is damn right! I need to get back to basics and pay attention to my technique and get used to my new razor. It is a different beast than the shavette and i must learn to control it to give a confortable shave.

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congratz! yesterday was my 10th shave and I have fully BBS and comfortable shave with no nicks, I didn't count the time but I was in a rush, 3 passes done. Probably good fast morning shave is important :) but I personally loves to shave at night and go too sleep with happy feeling coz BBS, especially if there's no nicks, a personal satisfaction of mine :)

well...the honemeisters here saying that they can hone their razor sharper than factory DB :)

btw, I also feel the same way, sometimes we, newbie, get excited too much and skip the basic :) it happen to me, and I actually a bit feel shame with my arrogance saying I got BBS in my 2nd shave but then at night I feel all my face burned and dry...and well now, I've proven that all the mentors here are there for reason and what they experienced...:beer2:

I made some progress in the past couple of weeks and i have found that the Dovo that i had bought was not shave ready for me. I first thought that it was the transition from the Shavette to the straight razor. I went back to basics and paid attention to angle and the amount of pressure. I helped reduce the redenning but it never helped get the razor to do its job properly. I always felt the razor pulling the hair while it cutting. I never had this feeling with the Shavetted except when the blade was dull.

I decided to buy a brand new razor and after i talked to the owner of the store (who advertises on this site) and told him about my problem, he recommended i buy a Thier Issard C135 Steel razor. This razor comes shave ready from the manufacture , in France. I have been using this razor since i got it on may 18th and am i glad i bought this razor. The first time i used it, i did not even use the leather strope and i gave me a nice shave. I now use the leather strope before i use it and it provides me with a very nice shave. I find that it is very close to the shavette as far as the ease to cut the whiskers. I still feell that the shavette with a brand new blade shaves quicker (blade is sharper in my opinion). However, the feel of the shave with the Thier Issard is much nicer.

I have also bought a set of Naniwa stones (3K, 8K and 12K) to bring the Dovo in line with the Thier Issard. I thought i would post my last findings to help those who experience a similar issue or those helping people: consider that the razor edge may be dull even if the razor was sold as shave ready.

I bought the razor from a newbie member who had bought the razor brand new in december. I thought the razor would still be sharp since it was honed by SRD. However, the seller felt it was too sharp and used natural stones to make it more confortable to him. I suppose that the process of using the natural stones made the blade a little dull. I have a coarse beard and i need a sharp edge if i do not want to exert pressure while cutting the whiskers.

Beware of newbie selling their razor and telling that they are not honemeister. You may get a good razor that won't shave comfortably. I now understand why you need two straight razors. One needs to always be sharp so that when you hone and try it out, if it is not shave ready, you can continue with the other razor and take care of the edge later...

Now, my next task is to learn to hone to bring the Dovo in line with the TI.

the issue was with the razor. thanks for pointing me in that direction. it helped me decide to buy a new razor.

thanks for the follow up on this post.

I just started with my first razor, which I got new and is the same dovo as you have. I did not experience any sharpness issues, but found that by doing more stropping on the canvas side of the strop, it has become a better shaver, it's sharper now.

congrats on the TI!

Having used both and written on this subject many times before....

The disposables edge comes from a wider angle on the blade and is stainless steel. So its cutting action is superb for 4-5 shaves, but having to maintain that angle on a fixed straight razor would take a funky looking straight razor.

Now, two issues with your straight razor that I will take a stab at:
1) It isn't sharp enough for your beard. 10 passes on a pasted strop may have helped out your situation and make the blade feel smoother and cut better. I recieved a few straight razors from honers and although they were shave ready, they just didn't do it for me. After 10 passes on my pasted strop. .50 crom ox, it felt like a different razor and its feel was more in line with my preference. Why: Sometimes there is metal hanging on the fin after a honing and this can creating a slight catch and pull action when shaving, thus it doesn't shave smoothly enough for some people. The pasted strop either realigns these pieces or takes them off.

2) Technique does play an important role in getting a better shave. Shorter strokes in tight areas tend to be more effective than longer strokes. All this takes time and some trial and error.

I hope this helps and good luck!

Pabster

I do not have a pasted strop to try your suggestion. I bought a set of Naniwa stones : 3K, 8K and 12K. I was told not to use the 12K until the razor is sharp. With your advice of using a pasted strope, i tried the 12 K stone and it made a huge difference. It felt much sharper and it did not tug as much.. Or did it ? I shaved this morning after using 20 passes on the 12K. Not sure if this is enough. It gave me a nicer shave, but not as nice as the TI though. Perhaps i should send an email to TI to get their tricks. I wonder if they used pasted stropes. The flyer that came with the razor is promoting TI pasted stopes...

When i decided to get a straight razor, i had read on honing and from my reading, i thought that 12 K stone would be the finishing stone i would need... Well, well well. Let me shave a couple more times with the Dovo and see how i get used to it or if i need to consider buying pasted strope. I did not realize that honing was such a challenging experience and that it would require so much equipment (expensive too) to get a nice and comfortable shave.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MichelG

...I now understand why you need two straight razors. One needs to always be sharp so that when you hone and try it out, if it is not shave ready, you can continue with the other razor and take care of the edge later...

Now, my next task is to learn to hone to bring the Dovo in line with the TI.

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not exactly right, I forgot who said this, but I read it in this forum...a blade need to rest for 24hour approx before you use it again, I think that's the reason why you need 2 straight.

maybe I miss something, what I understand is that, you don't need to buy stone in order to get a good comfortable shave, a good soap soap, brush, razor and strop is all you need...depend on the strop, I use Filly's 2 sided, one rough has crox with it and the smooth, with this I have comfort shave, if the blade is a bit pulling (after 2 weeks or so) I immediately have it lap around 20 times on the pasted strop, my razor is shave ready and is not dovo or TI, the point is that, razor is just a slab of steel which has been designed to cut whiskers, while the material of the blade is fairly important to bring the edge to proper sharpness, if you have a good steel and good edge, you have good razor...I believe DOVO and TI have that, if they don't they might not have as many fan as they have now, however most of them only have factory edge when they're sold, and not a shave ready edge.

equipment is just an equipment, our hand is the one who use it, so it also depend on our hand a.k.a technique...if we have chance to help our weak technique by soften what we want to cut a.k.a soften the beard/beard prep then it will help also.

So I guess, the basic is to have good and proper equipment:
1. Shave ready razor
2. Good soap
3. brush
4. strop (and pasted strop)

honing is for me another thing than shaving...

that's my 0.2 as newbie.

Erick.

The Naniwa you have is a nice set up. Yes, I started laying out the cash when I switched to fixed straight razors and I thought, "but I thought I was going to save money". It will be about 5-6 years before that happens, but I am in this for life, so no worries about it. But I also like quality products and that was my personal preference.

The paddle pasted strop helps with fine tuning the fin to be sharp. It removes some of the loose micro fin and realigns the rest. It is a minor honing tool. A 24 hour period helps the fin dry and realign itself. I dry my razors off after every shave and clean them up nicely and have used the same razor 14 days in a row without any issues.

Coming off my Naniwa 12K, the razor gets finished up with my pasted paddle strop and it is one effective straight razor. It shaves so smoothly and you feel like to you get away with a one pass and get a DFS. When the pasted strop can no longer bring back the edge, its time for full stone honing. My straight razors get stoned honed only about once every 15 months.

The Video's on SRP will help you along on the honing process. Overall, this has been a worthy investment because the Mach 3 was creating unsighlty pimples if I went for a BBS shave ATG in many areas. Straight Shaving doesn't do this to me and I am much happier about it.

Good Luck,

Pabster

I did not mind putting the money on the table for the right equipment. The difficulty was to determine the equipment i needed. I was starting to believe that i had not bought the right equipment. Thanks for confirming that my setup is just fine...

The forums on this site talk a lot about honing equipment, but it is not clear what is really needed. It appears that there are lots of different views. Some say that honing on 8K is sufficient. When you are a beginner, you just do not know. In my case, i refrained myself from using the 12K stone cause some members suggested not to go to the 12K before the razor was sharp. But it was not clear to me if the razor was sharp enough bucause it tugged.. Also, reading user's experiences, some seemed to be satisfied with a razor coming off an 8K stone.

I am starting my journey, i now know that 8K is not sufficient to me and that the 12K is the minimum i need to satisfy my shaving requirements. I am aiming at getting the sharpness of a shavette . Clearly, the 12K does not provide me with this. I will follow your suggestion and study the pasted strope equipment.

It would be good if this site had suggestions / recommendations for the equipment needed for different type/profiles of beard. I bought my first str8 from someone who did not like it too sharp (perhaps his beard is not dense/coarse), and clearly this did not satisfy my needs.

Not withstanding the fact that when we start to use a str8, we have a lot to learn , taking decision and choosing any equipment is not an easy task. If there were some standard recommendations based on some profiles (perhaps based on beard type or i do not know what), then it could help the new people joining. I had read about pasted stropes, but from what i had read, it seemed like an advanced technique that was not needed to get a comfortable shave.

On the positive side, this forum gets us in touch with great and experimented people who steer us in the right direction. Thank you , i have learned a lot already, i am slowly getting to where i want to be.