Very uncomfortable on neck and chin

Ive been shaving with a SR for maybe 2 weeks now and am shaving with a DOVO blackstar razor. For the last two weeks I shave my sideburns, cheeks, and upper lip and finsish everything else (neck and chin) with a regular multi-blade razor.

The last 4 days I have attempted to shave my neck and chin and it has been quite possibly one of the most painful experiences my face has ever had. My neck hair grows sideways from left to right all the way accross my neck and my chin grows down. When I shave down my neck it HURTS... the razor feels like it is plucking out every hair individually. And I cant figure out how to shave sideways because of the awkward hold position and the razor jumps and grabs and skips on my neck (not a pretty sight).

My chin is just impossible, I shave WTG on my chin and it almost brings me to tears. The aftermath is worse... my cheeks and upper lip is smooth as silk and just wonderful... my chin and neck is beat red, cut up, bleeding, and covered in razor bumps.

Ive searched the forum and found a couple things like scything? I dont know what to do maybe just practice more but if I dont get better in a couple more weeks I dont know if I can continue with a SR. My face cringes everytime it sees the blade come out.

The blade was professionally honed so maybe I dulled it with bad stopping? Is there anyone around Santa Barbara who can hone it for me?

I have more experience with DE than with SR, but the principles are basically thee same.

First: let your skin get used and heal.
If you're new to wet shaving, then your skin is not used to it and it will react to this new routine... specially the neck and chin since they are VERY sensitive.

Two: Avoid ATG
At least for a while, once you're 100% comfortable with XTG then move to a mix between XTG and ATG. In other words, do a progressive mote towards the ATG.

Three: Preshave
This is one of the most groundbreaking parts of the shave. you might already know it :) Take special care when preparing your neck and chin. Do not rub your brush too hard, when washing it (right before the lathering) do not rub your hand too hard, when your GF is kissing you don't let her rub her lips too hard... ok maybe that's allowed haha.

Four: Championship Quality Lather
The better the lather, the better the shave :) creamy and with a Yuggoth... I mean a Yogurt feeling is waht works for me. Find the lather that best works for you. By general agreement the best is the one that doesn't dry fast.

Five: Angle/Blade/pressure
If even WTG gives yoiu pain it can be either the blade or the angle. How sharp is your blade?, is your angle right? Are you applying too much pressure? By general ageement, the lighter the touch the safer and better the save :)

And that's what I can tell you.
In my case, I also use a St.Ives body lotion, it makes my skin smoother and gives my DE an easier time going there. Sometimes I use Noxzema Body Cream (the one packed in a blue Jar) and that helps not only my skin but the lather too :D

Wish you good luck with your next shave and Never Give Up!!
If something else comes to my mind I'll write it down here ;)

The neck and chin are definitely the hardest spots to learn to shave comfortably, it took me two weeks to a month longer to learn to shave my neck than it did my face. Your preshave prep, angle, pressure, and stretching are far more critical and harder to achieve on the neck and chin due to the small areas and the hair growing sideways for most of us. With me being almost a year in, I still need to slow down and take my time on those areas, with my face it seems no matter what I do it is smooth and comfortable, with my neck it seems everything has to be perfect to achieve the same result.

Pay extra attention to your razor angle(around the curves it is very easy to open up the angle of the razor, resulting in ripping the whisker instead of cutting), get the skin stretched flat as possible and find which direction you need to stretch(different directions will give different results), take your time, work on the schything stroke, relax and in no time the your neck and chin will catch up to your cheeks. Just like everything in life, good things come to those who work at it and perservere.

Thank you so much for all this information. I have been getting what I thought was a decent lather by it sounds like I should take a bit more time and really get the lather super thick. I think my razor is sharp just because it seems to cut well on my sideburns and cheeks but I may have dulled it a bit in the first week when I was learning how to strop. A reputable razor supplier recommended I get a balsa hone and strop paste white to polish the edge back if I did damage it a bit.

I definitely am not ready to quit because just the thought of learning this art keeps me going. Should I consider using preshave oil? Or is it a waste of money? Also I know it is all opinion but is there an aftershave lotion that doesn't have alcohol that is good?

Thanks for all the help!

My neck hair also grows sideways. Stretching the skin to the side, and shaving downward works the best.

If you get a painful "pulling hairs" sensation then:
1. make sure lather has been on your neck for 3 minutes and is still wet
2. make sure you don't have the razor too flat to the skin (2 spine thicknesses away from your face for initial (WTG) passes is about right)

If you still get the pulling sensation then your razor is probably a little dull. Get some Cromium Oxide (.5 micron jewelry or rock polishing paste), put a very light coat on piece of balsa wood, and strop your razor. That may refresh the edge so it feels as sharp as when you got it.

I had to refresh my edge every 2 weeks when I first started since my stropping and edge angles while shaving were a bit rougher on the edge than my technique is now.

ps: If you hold the razor too upright to your skin, you'll also get painful "razor burn" sensation - and more nicks. Plus your razor will dull faster...

Let your neck and chin heal up for a few days. Shaving off bumps will set you back another week...

Use Witch Hazel instead of alchohol based aftershaves to sooth your razor burned skin (available from Walmart near the Peroxide). Then use a gylcerin-based balm to help your skin heal up. I hear Corn Huskers lotion from Walmart is very similar to Trumpers Skin Food. I know it definitely helps my skin heal up faster.

Good luck.

+1 on all the information regarding razor angles.

When i first began, which is not all that long ago, my neck gave me crazy problems. Try to document which way your whiskars grow. This provides some legitimacy when you're shaving. You can say "ooops, thats not a good idea, maybe I'd better do it this way".

For the upper part of your neck, a member suggested that I pull it up as far as I can onto my cheek. That was magic advice. Skin stretched and as flat as possible.

For the lower part of my neck, since my hair grows in multi directions, I shave north to south, with the spine almost against my skin. No pressure at all, and a very slight sideways motion. It works for me, and allows me comfortable shaves.

Slow, well thought out strokes. If they work, remember them. If they don't, try something new after your face heals. Give yourself a couple days in between shaves.

Good luck,
Maxi

I just went back in and read your thread again so I'm changing this first paragraph. I'm a little puzzled at how you can get a good close shave on your cheeks but have that much pain on your neck. When I first started out, I had an experience with both an unhoned razor and a rolled edge on another. Usually, a razor should easily glide across the skin while shaving whiskers. And usually, any time it feels like it's pulling whiskers, it's a sign of a dull or damaged edge. The way you described the feeling of "Plucking" the whiskers on your neck, leads me to believe it's a damaged edge due to poor stropping. Even if you're not stretching the skin tight enough, I wouldn't think it should cause you to have that much pain. I would say give your face a rest for a day or two before anything. If possible, go a couple of days without shaving as a little stubble may help you to see how your razor shaves on both the cheeks and neck. Once your face feels normal, try a section on your neck concentrating mostly on blade angle and some on stretching. Try different blade angles. Some almost flat to your skin and some a little more steep. Then try the same on your cheeks to see if you can feel the razor pulling any. If it feels like it's pulling on whiskers, especially on your cheeks, I would say it's most likely a rolled edge and needs to be repaired.

If you got the razor from SRD, they usually send it with a free re-honing certificate. If you didn't get it from them, you can send it to them and they will hone it for a minimal charge. Or, if you don't want to mail it to someone, you might want to call around to some of the barber shops in your area to see if they can help you to find someone locally to hone it.

Let me try to say this where it makes sense. When stropping, keep in mind, you are not sharpening the razor. You are only re-aligning and cleaning the wire edge of the blade. Even though, you go one direction while honing a pocket knife on a stone and the other with stropping a razor on lined/leather, it's easy to associate having to use the same kind of pressure when stropping. All you need is minimal pressure of your razor against the strop. Make sure to keep the strop taught and don't let it sag where the razor is. Picture this in your mind and you will be able to see how you can roll the edge. If you were to lay the razor in the middle of the strop and let it sag while pushing down on the blade, the strop would form a "V" with the blade in the bottom of the "V". Add too much pressure into the mix and you wind up with a rolled edge. You can also roll the edge by just using too much pressure and not letting the strop sag at all.

Once you look into the above and think you have any issues fixed, I'd like to give you some advice on the chin. Use little short strokes, adjusting blade angle as you progress around the curve of the chin. don't try to shave with long strokes on the chin like you can with a disposable. You can use longer strokes on the flat areas of your face but not on the chin.

Well, now that I wrote you a book, I hope you have time to read it. LOL! I hope this helps you out and you stick with it. Just be patient and in time, you will begin to enjoy and experience shaving like you never have before.

I am knew to the whole SR shaving myself about 3 weeks or so into it. I feel lucky my shaves have gone well and I look forward to shaving now. The thing I have trouble with the most is getting good lather I have had to work on this trying different things till I get the thick creamy lather. If your lather is watered down the save is not as good you will notice a big difference if you have a nice thick lather. I don't know how your lather is but if you are like me making lather was tough as I was use to the canned junk. As others have said the prep is just as important as the rest of the process. Just stick with it and things will get better.

Wow! Such a wealth of information here, thank you everyone for the advise!

kcarlisle: The razor is not butter smooth on my cheeks either but my cheeks and stash is the only place where I have been successful in getting a good shave. Nowhere is the razor as comfortable as a multi-blade razor so Im guessing that I may have rolled the edge slightly. Ill check some barbers around and see if they know of anywhere I can get it honed locally.

*Just FYI to anyone reading this that doesnt have a Walmat locally (closest one to me is a 45 min drive), you can get the Corn Huskers Lotion and Whitch Hazel mentioned earlier in a reply at CVS for pretty cheap.

After reading all the replies, I noticed off the bat that I was using a bad razor angle for everything. I was shaving probably 4 spine widths from my face so I will close the angle and make shorter more precise strokes because I was using longer strokes like a multi-blade.

Also is there a difference between buying an actual balsa hone thats $25 and just getting a piece of balsa wood at a local hobby shop for $5?

I am actually really excited to try out and practice these new techniques and see how the work!

From what I have read on the forums here you can just go to a hobby store and get a piece of balsa wood. You may have to lap it which will be putting a piece of fine grit sandpaper on a flat surface and running the face of the balsa wood over it just to make sure it is flat for honing. Then get some chromium paste or powder and you should be good. Here is a link on the wiki on how to make a balsa strop or hone whatever you want to call it.
Easily make a pasted balsa strop - Straight Razor Place Wiki

Bnick,

In my first few months, I had the same issue with trying to get a good lather. My first brush was a cheap Wally world boars hair brush and little did I know, it was the source of the problem. I'm not sure what kind you currently have, but a good brush is necessary to a good lather. Notice, I didn't say an expensive brush...only a good brush. If you haven't found a good brush, try to find a badger hair. At first, I didn't even bother to even look for one because I thought they were all so expensive. The boars hair fell apart in the first month or so and I was forced to look for another brush. I found the Tweezerman and was so shocked at the price for a badger hair brush, I orderd 2 of em. Here's the link where I bought mine from: Tweezerman Shaving Brush - MUHLE . The very first shave with it, I was astonished at how much of a difference a good brush will make when trying to obtain a good lather. Almost a year later, I'm still on the first brush and have yet to touch the second.

The reason I hate to recommend it is that gear is not what we need when learning, it's skills. I'm at 10 wks, and LOVING the shaves. The Mrs. loves them too.
I had a real game changer when I got a 1/4 hollow razor for my bday. You'll see lots of threads about shaving where the veteran found the heavier grind enabled him to learn the moves. Then he was able to do them on a hollow with a little practice. I seem to be following that well worn path. 'Got a 6/8 1/4 hol. and it was like the shaving world changed. It wasn't just a challenge, it was now easy. And PLEASANT. 'Best shaves, no drama, no blood, unless I was trying some new moves. New moves are tempting, 'cause everything is easier. Now I'm reading about how the full hollow is just more demanding. I'm thinking that's right. The last two days, I've used the full hollow, and could duplicate almost all the moves w/ the 1/4 hollow. Yet the 1/4 H. remains my fav. tool, and I want another. It has a very very slight smile, which was new for me too. This doesn't mean blow a wad of money. There's lots of wedges in the classifieds, and they will give a similar advantage. If we both grow out of the heavy grinds? so what. We'll have shortened our learning curve.

I'm not that good at stropping - as my leather will show. I glued some latigo on a pc of finished oak for a paddle strop, and the edges improved alot. The 3" wide strop is always smiling or frowning, leaving some portion of the blade without contact. My next strop will be no more than 2.5" wide. I understand they're less prone to cupping or bowing.

A word of thanks for all the experienced guys that have been so kind to us noobs. It's impossible to thank you enough.

Jusy my 2 cent.I didn't really have the time to read everyone elses feed back ,so pardon me for just jumping in okay.If your razor was honed to shave ready ,then it sounds like a couple of problems arose here.First it might very well be your honing. Practice slow and steady ,speed comes later and you may possibly have rolled the edge.Keep your strop tight.Although I believe you said you have a balsa wood strop..I don't have any knowledge of those honestly.While lather is important , I can tell you ,it also sound like your technique more than youe lathering as I have had perfect shaves without tons of creamy lather. Remember to ease up on your pressure while still holding the blade firm.Try just holding with the thumb and first two fingers and keep to about a 30 degree angle.Don't try to force the razor,let it do the work.You should be hearing what sounds like toast being buttered when shaving which is a good indicator. and go slow and easy.Read the wiki,I'm sure you have been so just reiterating.Aslo read the threads about cold shaving which might help you and also find the article on the 1960 barbers manual..very very helpful and while you're at it checkout chimenches 30yr. anniversery shave video as it has good visual reference on technique.Very worth while..I have neck hairs that go E/W so I feel your pain but believe me I can get pretty smooth down there.Just be patient it will come.In the mean time,let your face heal and start over.Hope this helps a little? Just be patient,have fun and relax.Pre shave prep creams and post shave prep creams and all that other stuff is like icing on the cake when starting out.Remember,straight shaving is really quite primitive and straight forward albeit very efficient and excuisite IMHO.Soak yer brush ,strop yer razor slow and easy,make yer lather and ease up on that pressure. Good luck and sorry if I sound like I'm mother henning ya.Just want ya to not get frustrated and have a nice shave that's all.Again Good luck okay.Hang in there man.:gl:

This is my favorite brush. Inexpensive Badger hair, I have a tweezerman also, but it seems a bit short and stiff. This Parker is not a silvertip, but holds water well and makes a ton of lather!

: Amazon.com: Blue Wood Handle Shaving Brush with Black Badger Bristles and Free Stand - From Parker Safety Razor: Health & Personal Care

:beer2:

I went to a local barber today and the main barber guy put a good stropping on it and let me tell you all... this razor is SHARP! This is what he recommended:

He said I needed to put a bit more pressure on the razor when stropping so instead of basically letting gravity push down the razor to the strop, he said to give the razor some pressure so there is a slight dip in the strop with every pass. This is against some other advise I have read here but the guy brought my razor back to crazy sharp with this method with just 15-20 passes so I am going to use this and see how it works for me.

Also I have a Vulfix Super Badger brush which seems to be pretty good I think?

Tomorrow morning I will give it a go and see what happens... I haven't shaved in 2 days and my face is all healed up. Im going to work on my lather a bit longer to get it thicker and pay special attention to my strokes, thinking about which directions works best and which hurt.

Thanks to everyone who has contributed!!! Hopefully there are some other noobies who have or will find this helpful also.

If you want a couple of pre-shave tips that work well for me, try these:

- Rub a good load of conditioner into your beard in the shower.
- Apply your lather then throw a hot towel over the top of it for a minute or two. I use water right from the kettle on a face flannel for this and its so hot it almost hurts!
- Re-apply your lather and start to shave.

Good luck and keep us posted!

Update:

I shaved this morning and here was my routine...

I decided to use all cold water after reading the 1905 booklet thing.

1. showered (cleaned face)
2. dried face
3. soaked brush for few min
4. made a lather and applied to face
5. rubbed lather into face with fingers
6. reapplied lather with brush
7. wet razor and began shaving
8. finished with Witch Hazel (which IMO doesnt smell very good but feels nice on my face) and the Corn Huskers lotion.

Verdict: best shave yet the the SR. The blade went through my sideburns/cheeks like a red hot knife through butter.

Then I attempted my neck, and although I still stayed away from the middle, short sideways strokes, starting from the lower portion of my neck and moving up towards the jawline was magical. I placed my other fingers below my ear to stretch the neck skin back (seems to also help stand the hair up Ive noticed).

So I dont know if it was because of the properly stropped razor or the cold shave or a combo of both but whatever the combo, the shave was great and gave me new confidence in the razor and excitement to continue practicing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by rynearnold

Should I consider using preshave oil?

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I use hair conditioner; it works great, and it is very cheap.

I wet my face and message my beard well with whatever conditioner I am using at the time, then I apply a hot wet towel for more than a minute. I do this twice!

* This works extremely well for me,

Steve