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I can get a decent enough shave with a couple of WTG/XTG-ish passes (now that I can get a pretty good lather), but ATG is really giving me trouble - my tentative attempts have problems with pulling and suction at low angles. Is there a razor angle/skin stretching technique that helps here?
PS I have started my collection of soaps, creams and after-shaves :) .
yes ATG angle will be the lowest comfortable angle you can get which your blade will cut hairs the easiest.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinclsw007
In reality you don't have to shave ATG to get great shave or make couple WTG/XTG 'S?
you will need only wtg +xtg and your shave should be fine enough.
just try to learn how to shave properly.
gl
Pulling at low angles sounds like a non optimal edge. Should actually be less pulling at low angles.
If there's something I have experience with, it's shaving with non-optimal edges. Because you are shaving against the grain on an ATG pass, that is where the less than shave-readiness of the blade shows. When you are shaving with the grain, whether the blade is shave ready or not, it can pass over the whisker whether it cuts it or not. But on an ATG pass, the whisker literally blocks the blade, and if the blade doesn't cut it, the blade will either pull, tug, skip, or just flat stop. Sounds like your blade and your face would benefit from a touch-up.
On touching the edge up, will going back to a 12k SS followed by 0.5 micron diamond spray on leather be sufficient?
I have never had much success with sprays and have now decided, based on recent successes, to stay with stones, linen and leather.
Give it a try but you may/maynot benefit from looking at the edge under magnification to assess your starting point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinclsw007
I examined the edge with a x40 25mm illuminated loupe and saw no obvious discontinuities or problems; hopefully any issues are addressable by the normal maintenance cycle.
V.Good. Let's here the good news when you're done :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinclsw007
ATG doesn't work for everyone. It all demands on your beard. Consider the possibility that you're doing things right but your beard is telling you how to shave it.
I've decided to exercise more patience and restraint (always good qualities with a razor at your neck...) and just do the simple things as well as possible until it becomes a habit to get good results that way.
Sure, go with patience and restraint and improve your technique gradually. But technique tends to improve through experimentation, so slip in a small ATG pass on the cheek every now and then. You may find that it just seems harder at first than it really is. Good luck!
hey sinclsw007
Don't know if you and I have the exact same problem or not but I have been having a lot of trouble with ATG passes too, particularly on my neck because my hair grows side to side. When I posted my problem some of the mentors suggested that I don't actually need an ATG pass on my neck to get BBS. They suggested I go XTG top to bottom and bottom to top (or vice versa), and then later on with (much) more experience adding in a scything motion. I've been working on it and it really started working for me yesterday, thought you might benefit from it too.
Hope that helps and good luck! :beer1:
This is what I came here to say. Everyone has hair that grows in different directions, at different angles, and at different thickness' and consistencies. Sometimes finding the right grind and size of razor can help with those types of problems, but I have always been a firm believer that technique will always prevail over the tools. I recommend spending a good deal of time studying how your hair grows in the mirror, and practice different methods of stretching your skin to pull the hair upwards (thus making it easier to achieve optimum shave angles). Once you are comfortable in doing that, and do it almost instinctively when you shave, you will find that you will get much better shaves as a result, regardless of the razor. That's how it went for me. Then when I finally did get a new razor, shave ready from the classifieds here, my technique was there to back up the great razor, and, for the first time in 3 months, I got a great shave.Quote:
Originally Posted by Howard
The long and the short of it: a great razor with an immaculate edge isn't even half the battle of shaving with a straight razor. Focus more on YOU than the razor.
+1 on this. I was wondering why my shaves were going down hill and getting some razorburn, even though the razor could've been sharper, it was still sharp enough so I concentrated on my lather and it made such a difference.Quote:
The long and the short of it: a great razor with an immaculate edge isn't even half the battle of shaving with a straight razor. Focus more on YOU than the razor.
a nice thick lather and keen edge will save you from razorburn and give you a really good shave after XTG.
you'll be surprised how much the lather contributes to a close shave.
regards alex
I can do ATG everywhere, but it gives me trouble on my upper lip. Yes, yes, I know I shouldn't, but I learned that way, and done it for a long time.
Anywhoo, since it has been giving me trouble, I decided to skip it until the skills come back to my tired hands, and I do WTG and two XTG there and I get the same results I get elsewhere with a WTG and ATG. That is, not BBS, but a decent shave.
This 18 year hiatus really sucked the skill out of me. :cry:
I was just about to post a thread asking for advice on shaving the hair on my neck which also grows side to side. I'll have to give this a shot!Quote:
Originally Posted by jmbbabson
ATG isn't needed to get a close shave, I actually stopped using it two months ago and haven't looked back.
Sham is right.
All you need to do is find the correct angle for your areas of face and adjust and then add a slicing motion to your strokes. I still do three passes, WTG, XTG with scything motion, WTG again and that's all.
Do that for about two months and don't try ATG at all during this time, you'll see what happens. Old Barbers didn't allow ATG for their clients and there's good reason, try and see.
I have only been at this a few months and planned to try ATG after I got comfortable. Now that I am getting better shaves than the M3 with just two passes WTG I am probably going to forgo the ATG altogether. That said, I have very light facial hair, so I can go every other day, and I am not dealing with a beard. It would seem that the volume of hair growth, and thickness, would have an impact on the need for ATG to get a good shave. Maybe someone can speak to that...
Shaving ATG isn't "too technical" at all really. Just remember, ultra sharp razor, low angle and no pressure. The biggest problem with ATG is that most folks will save it for the third and final pass, when your skin has already been abraded twice before. It does indeed court irritation. Good prep and no pressure will really help here, but at the end of the day we are shaving our own faces, not someone elses.
BTW - I fall into the "you don't have to go ATG to get a great shave" camp....
I've been shaving daily since I was in 7th grade and I don't even need an ATG pass, it's all about being willing to practice new techniques and unlearn what you have learned...as Yoda and Picasso would say.Quote:
Originally Posted by UWPete
There are many kinds of ATG passes. I have no difficulty with ATG passes on my neck or on my chin, and going ATG in those areas results in a much closer shave. Shaving the chin, the area below and at the sides of the mouth, and the moustache area ATG gets good results but the risk increases in these areas as does the commitment of time.
When I shaved with a DE, I just made one, long-stroked ATG pass from the neck area all the way to the top of the cheek, then did some touching up around the mouth and chin. I was hoping to be able to do that with straights, but the mouth and chin area are starting to take time that I'm not sure is paying off in shave quality. I just might convert over to WTG and XTG and see how that goes. Just like Pee Wee Herman, I'm a rebel.
I have a corporate gig and shave one pass WTG every morning before work. I have tried an ATG pass exactly twice in my wet shaving endeavor. There will not be a third attempt.
In my opinion, the idea that an ATG pass is required to achieve BBS is overrated. You'd be better served in the long run to master the one-pass shave before trying to move on, and your skin will thank you as well. Just some free advice, and it's worth exactly what you paid for it!
Throw in how hair expands when hydrated, which is what we are doing with the hot and moist towel pre-shave prep and you can get a really close shave with XTG passes. Once the hairs shrink back to normal, that is.