New razor set problems

Hi,
I just bought my first straight razor in a set from Tony (stropmeister). It was sharp when I first used it but I think I probably killed the edge trying to learn to strop. I went ahead and bought a 4k/8k Norton stone and have been trying pyramids, but I notice that I can't seem to get a sharp edge that doesn't pull and irritate my skin when I shave. Also, it seems the bevel of the edge is good on the point and heel of one side of the blade and good in the middle on the other.

Does this mean my blade is curved? Is it bad to have a curved blade? Can it take a good shaving edge being curved? Should I just send it to Lynn to see what he can do with it?
Should I just buy a better straight edge and if so which one?

I plan on sticking with straight shaving until I get it all figured out. Thank you all for keeping this art going.


David R. Warden III, M.D.

David,
Thanks for the e-mail last night. I suggested you post here as you will get the best tips on learning about honing. I'm okay at it but there are far better honers here and they should give you better advice on passes, and pyramids and pressure.

If you decide you would prefer to just get this one sharp again, obviously I will take care of it, but if you want to learn how to do it yourself this is the place.

The curved blade thing, while not ideal is pretty typical of razors made today. Even my $200 Thiers-Issard exhibit this in some cases. A warped blade from new or uneven pressure while honing a perfectly straight can cause this

Best,
Tony

Well, I've said this before and I know most people here don't agree with me but I'll say it again anyway. Before venturing into shaving and stropping and honing a good blade I think people should get a garbage blade off Eboy just to practice stropping and honing with so they don't ruin their working razor. Sure you can send it to Lynn but it still has to be stropped every use so if you ruined it this time you'll do it again.

Having said that understand that stropping takes practice and honing takes alot of practice. To get a result that is even throughout the surface on both sides is not easy and personally I think few ever master it in a way that someone like lynn does. That does not mean everyone can't master it to a point where you can experience a truly great shave every day. You don't need perfection. Remember at one time everyone had to do this and I can guarantee alot of people shaved with some pretty bad razors.

So the bottom line here is to practice until you master the techniques. It will take time and patience. Read all the help files on this site and remember to go slow and whether stropping or honing the key is consistancy and no pressure on the stone or the leather. An uneven edge means unequal pressure was applied or in stropping the edge was rounded off.

You have tried multiple pyramids and still no success? Then you are probably overhoned(wire edge)( the edge is so thin that it bends when it comes in contact with the beard). Search in the Honing forum for the methods to resolve a wire edge or send it out to be honed and then follow the advice from Thebigspender.

Thanks for all your advice.

I will look into getting a junk blade, until then I am going take the following steps:

1. Try lapping my Norton 4k/8k (I haven't done that because I thought it should be good out of the book. Maybe that is a bad assumption.) I found waterproof 600 grit and 1500 grit. Will either of these work?

2. Try doing a conservative pyramid with no pressure. I may have been using too much pressure and just grinding the edge away.

3. Get a microscope as recommended on the forum to examine the edge.

Does this sound like a good plan?

When I am honing do I want to keep the stone clean all the time or does the metal slurry help?

Thanks,

David

You should lap the norton, if it's not flat then you're just grinding away for naught. The 600 grit wet/dry is what I used. Mark the surface in a grid pattern with a pencil, soak the stone and paper, then lap in an X pattern until all the marks are gone, then lap a few more times for good measure.

You can use a little pressure when honing, just enough to keep the blade flat on the stone. Watch the ripple in front of the blade to let you know that it's in contact along the entire edge.

Let the slurry accumulate until you're done. But keep the stone wet - a small spray bottle is good for this.

Its overhoned, no doubt about it. Just for your edification, it started out sharp and then you rolled the edge and then honed over the top of that. Lap the Norton with wet/dry sandpaper and try to assess the edge. Its overhoned so start with that.

You need to learn to hone. Find a method that you want to follow. Either lots of reading, a skype session with Randy, send it out to be honed, whatever. I don't think you should start honing away with Pyramids with no idea what your doing, but thats up to you, you can if you want ofcourse.

Heres honing in a nutshell . . . or honing for dummies, which obviously you are not so just pretend ok? :-)

Lap a hone - get the tool flat

Assess the edge - a microscope works well, check for thumb tests too.

Hone with the razor FLAT! Maintain the same angle and pressure and stroke the razor exactly the same distance on each side

Learn when to stop! This is one of the challenges, test shaving is a good default

Think of it as a "Release" Just a dab of pressure, then light pressure, then lighter pressure, then really light pressure, then no pressure - Learning when and how is the key, try putting your pinky under the scales to hold the scales up while you hone so you don't have to push down on the razor to keep it flat.

Think of the 4K as the bevel creator, it removes steel, and the 8K as the polishing edge. If it were me I would spend more time polishing then removing metal, by a wide margin. Pyramids get things close though.

Go slow, take your time. Keep the blade flat. Use the right amount of pressure, learn how to use an x pattern toward the end. You want the metal to sweep behind the edge without tearing the edge up. Keep the angle the same. You want to create smooth, small striated teeth.

Remember its about a slow, progressive release of pressure. That might mean you need to add a dab of pressure to get past a sticking point and then start to "release" again as you stroke. Eventually, just the weight of the blade should be plenty. Remember, your creating a razors edge. Think fragile, but don't let anyone tell you that every stroke should be without control or pressure on the edge.

Study up and have fun!

Learn to strop, getting the edge smooth helps you assess the edge by shaving. Keep it flat, use a light touch, don't lift the blade. A dab of pressure to achieve a draw can help but keep the blade flat.

I have lapped with 600 and 1500 grit. This worked well. I got a shavable edge going. It is not perfect but getting close.

Thanks for all your advice. I am starting to get a feel for honing. I think you just have to do it for a while to figure it out.

I'm sure my edge was overhoned.

David

Thanks for all your help and advice.

I lapped my Norton with 600 and 1500 grit. This produced good results.

I am getting a shavable edge. I am on my way to figuring out how to hone.

I think I am getting stropping figured out as well. The real test is shaving. No luck with HHT.

David

Don't fret the HHT. Many of us don't use it, and have found other substitute tests. As for the shaving edge, you may want to invest in a pasted paddle with 1 micron and 0.5 micron sides. This is an inexpensive way to achieve a very fine, very sharp edge beyond what the 8k norton can produce. I can get a decent shaving edge from the norton, but I can't get a *great* edge with it.