How close should my shave be?

I've been shaving with a straight for a few weeks now. I can tell that it is starting to feel a lot more natural. I still have a few problem areas, none so much as my chin, but overall I'm doing pretty well. I have been doing one pass WTG, which is usually pretty easy and sometimes a second pass XTG.

I have to say that I am a little disappointed in the closeness I'm getting. When I use my DE (an Edwin Jagger DE89), I get a real close shave on my first pass WTG. I finish up with an XTG pass and it is very close and comfortable. So far, with the straight, I have to finish up with my DE to get close enough. Is this what I should expect from a straight razor shave? Does razor sharpness come into play here? Will I ever get a REALLY close shave with just one or two passes with my straight?

Info: I have a vintage JA Henckels 4/8, 1/4 hollow recently honed by one of the greats.

If your blade is perfect,If your stropping is perfect,If your prep is perfect,You have a 6 month learning curve,Carry on:)

Yep, what Pixelfixed said. I spent about four months transitioning completely to the SR shave. There's no shame in using your previous method along with the straight as you learn it. The chin is tough for everyone--as you get more comfortable that too will improve. On mine, as on most I think, the whiskers are thicker and tougher, and I've found I have to steepen the blade angle a little bit to get it to bite into the hair bases the same way it does with a "normal" shave angle on, say, the cheeks.

Patience, and practice, and prep. I've never used a DE, but they sound like they can be pretty squirrely. So if you mastered that, you'll master the straight. Keep your pressure light, as I bet you already know, no more pressure than it takes to scrape away the lather.

Best wishes and happy shaving.

Oh, to answer your actual question, your shave from the straight should be as close as your shave from any other method you've mastered, and as comfortable. It just won't be that way out of the gate, as you've found.

Yep, just as the two previous gentlemen have said, it will take a bit of learning to master the straight razor.
Exactly how long is very individual of course, but rest assured, the straight will do as well or better than any other system out there. Eventually:)
To most of us anyway..
Personally I felt like I had reached very good shaves after about 3 months.
3 months after that I knew that that was a very wrong assumption!

Well, don't worry too much at least you have company. Still can't believe I have to use a DE or SE to finish and get a proper shave too. That is coming from over 40 years wet shaving with the other razors. I'm thinking the technique is just harder to get sorted so I just keep at her. Sooner or later the coin will drop.

Bob

Well, I feel much better now. I've been wanting to shave with a straight for a while now and I was a bit sad at the outcome so far. I guess I just have to be patient (not one of my strong points) and just keep at it. I'm still a little scared every time I shave and maybe with my technique will build with my confidence. Thanks for all your replies!

That fear was one of the reasons I took a while to completely give up my previous, familiar technology. Yep, the confidence will grow--and will also spread out into the rest of your life. 'Cause what you're doing is DAMN COOL!

If that's the blade I'm thinking it is, it's actually pretty close to a 3/8 and you need to be very careful with your angle when using it. It's a good shaver and it may take just a little practice. It is a pretty small and light and I think once you get the feel for it, you will like it.

Have fun.

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Originally Posted by danxaz

Well, I feel much better now. I've been wanting to shave with a straight for a while now and I was a bit sad at the outcome so far. I guess I just have to be patient (not one of my strong points) and just keep at it. I'm still a little scared every time I shave and maybe with my technique will build with my confidence. Thanks for all your replies!

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When one thinks about what has to be learned,It can be a daunting process,blade angles, prep,stropping,not only the basics, but you have eye/hand coordintion to master,you have finesse that only comes with much repitition over perhaps 100s of shaves,you have alot to learn about your facial features,beard growth patterns.
One of I feel is most important is learning facial muscle memory,you may not realize it but in certain areas of your face you actually flex muscle to move skin into the cutting edge,esp. the chin area where all newbs struggle.
You WILL master this,the time will come when you do not even think about anything other than what a great shave you are getting,after that we move on to honing:)) at that point you return to really bad shaves again:( and a couple more years of frustrations.
Actually forget about honing,let the pros do that crap,carry on:)

Just to put things in perspective, say about 120 years ago boys started an apprenticeship to learn the shaving skills taught by their fathers and they had months and months to learn all they needed to learn. These days we don't have someone at hand to teach, its either on your own or via a site like this and folks these days have no patience. They want it now.

Eventually everyone learned because it was the only way. These days we have choices and if you choose to use a straight the learning curve has not changed since the early days.

I'm about 18 months into straight shaving and still learning something with every shave. I got passably close shaves after 3 months, much better shaves after 6 months and felt I was really hitting my stride with a straight after 9 months. Maybe I'm a "slow learner", but I find that I'm still learning every day. At this point, I am finding that I can get closer shaves with a straight than with any other technology, but it did take some time and some patience. I think my blades were sharp from the start, but it took some time for the operator to get sharp.

I had the whole thing down pat in just under 4 years. Now, what's the issue here?

Its funny how often I knock myself down a peg. I have been SR shaving for around 17 months and everytime I think I have this mastered, I end up having a string of terrible shaves! I may go a couple months with nothing but nick free bbs, then I let down my guard and blammy! cuts nicks razor burn galore!!! Same thing happens with stropping. So I have decided that I will not shave when I feel invincible as I tend to not pay as much attention and try to force the shave! so no scotch/bourbon/tequila before shaving LOL :)
beer and wine are ok! :)

Straiigght shaving is definitely a long learning curve. After around 16 years I still learn new things all the time. The way I see it, the moment that I quit learning, the art of straight shaving will become a chore.

I must say this thread is very timely. Last night's shave was ok but I was somewhat dissapointed with it well cos its was just ok! I have been shaving with a cut throat for about 8 months now and like ace and others have pointed out you are always learning something. The first 4-5 months are def the most difficult however. Still dont get too frustrated "Zen" will come naturally. The most important thing for me was that I am enjoying the whole process so much. Shaving for the first time in my life is so much fun.:D

I missed your last question. A straight shave for me is somehow different than a "two-pass" De shave, but the difference is elusive. I do more work with each straight pass and there is an important pseudo third pass that I do without cream. Just warm water. It's not really a pass but more like I'm an artist, finishing up on a painting. I hold the razor in my hand, look for missed spots, stretch and shave, and then look for the next one. This part is quite time consuming too. I spend time moving my wetted fingers over my face feeling whiskers and evaluating the shave. I also evaluate the shaving direction that didn't work and come up with new directions that will work. I look for whiskers that demand customized angles and direction. I look for stray lone whiskers. I look for darker sections where I can shave in "deep" for a really wicked close shave. Finally, I work at removing all the cream, applying a post shave treatment and drying my face. Really it's the dry face that feels like a close shave.

Give yourself 3 months to function with the straight and 6 months to get good at it. It's a slow process so give yourself some leniency. Using a straight is like playing a musical instrument; some days you're on, some days you're off. That's even after you get it mastered.

I vowed that I would use nothing but my straight to ensure I would get it down (I was mixing between DE and straight). After some time (months) I was having a string of what I thought were sub-par shaves (I now blame it to the fact that I had bought so many new razors and stones that I had lost my focus), so I pulled out my DE which is always guaranteed to give me a BBS. It was worse!!

I got back to basics and focused hard on stretching and re-mapped my face. With that, I now don’t think as much, and try to have as much fun shaving with my stereo blaring in the background as I can lol! I have never had better shaves in my life, and even my wife is commenting on how healthy my face looks!

Once you trust your hands not to slice yourself and are a bit more comfortable, you’ll be able to focus on the shave more easily. But as everyone has stated – you’ll be learning for a while and that’s the best part of it! When I pulled out my DE as I was saying – it was rather boring!

Long learning curve is a sweet experience. There is no promise of joy to be had looking to a future when all is known and the excitement of discovery is long forgotten. Someday str8 shaving will just be a routine for me if I am unfortunate.

Sometimes we're our own worst critic. We all have those days where we feel we could have done a little better, but to be honest no one else is likely to notice except you and perhaps your significant other (well, if you're lucky at least ;)).

You might must need some more practice with face prep, it eludes some of us when trying to master the Str8.
To much concern for angle and honing intracacies, and less on a well preped beard!!
Just give it time, you'll find your way I"m sure.

As always, tinkersd

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Originally Posted by Lynn

If that's the blade I'm thinking it is, it's actually pretty close to a 3/8 and you need to be very careful with your angle when using it. It's a good shaver and it may take just a little practice. It is a pretty small and light and I think once you get the feel for it, you will like it.

Have fun.

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Yup, that's the one. Good to know that it's more like a 3/8. I really like this razor.

I think just starting this post helped out. Lat night, my shave was the best yet. Two passes and a little touch-up and I was nearly at my DE level. The support here is awesome!

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Originally Posted by thebigspendur

Just to put things in perspective, say about 120 years ago boys started an apprenticeship to learn the shaving skills taught by their fathers and they had months and months to learn all they needed to learn.

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I think this is one of the most overlooked parts of the learning curve..

I think back, I started 30+ years ago at 22 and my beard was nothing like it is today, but I only imagine if I had started at 14-15 with a straight razor and got to actually learn the moves with shaving off that "Peach Fuzz" , just think how much easier that would be :)
There is no doubt in my mind that as more of those pesky gray hairs populate my beard it gets harder to shave :p

I've thought about that, too, how much easier it would have been to learn on peach fuzz. Wouldn't have needed higher angles over the chin, wouldn't have had the craggy Adam's apple yet, and by the time the barbs got thicker and the face more challenging, the necessary changes in technique would have been unconscious, reflexive.

The thing I still wonder is if--back when this was the only method--men enjoyed their shaves as much as we--who have chosen this method--do today.

Well, I can't add much to all the excellent expert advice you've already been given, but I will echo that the learning curve is a lot of the fun. And I agree with another poster that, once you've built up some muscle memory and confidence over enough shaves (and maybe consider getting a bigger razor?), that you can get absolutely the closest, buttery smooth shaves with a straight (at least I do). Only 2 and a half years in, I'm still learning, having fun with the occasional new (old) razor I can add to the rotation, not to mention all the AD's. And wait til you start honing! "Chasing that ultimate edge" is, to me, more fun than shaving. As Lynn says, "Have fun." Aaron

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Just to put things in perspective, say about 120 years ago boys started an apprenticeship to learn the shaving skills taught by their fathers and they had months and months to learn all they needed to learn. These days we don't have someone at hand to teach, its either on your own or via a site like this and folks these days have no patience. They want it now.

Eventually everyone learned because it was the only way. These days we have choices and if you choose to use a straight the learning curve has not changed since the early days.

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I got to agree, I am only on my 10th shave and this website is the font of eternal wisdom when it comes down to SR shaving. Today I cut myself up a bit and made my self very sore and red and the first thought that crossed my mind was "Lets ask Dad where im going wrong" and sadly Dad enjoys his Cartrige razor and couldnt help me. Whenfind myself going wrong with my razor I often think how great it would be to have a Grandfather and Father around to help and advise me but they are children of the times and I rely soley on Straight razor place for my info.

I hope to one day teach my sons how to shave with the straight razor and they can rely on me for information, advice and guidence in the same way I rely on you guys.

I thank the heavens for this place and for the help I recieve.