Does anyone have experience with manandshaving.nl?

Hello all,

I am another shaver from the Netherlands, still using cartridges but intending to go straight as soon as possible.

To start off with, i hope to buy a decent straight blade and a strop. I will hold off the hones until later.

The site manandshaving.nl claims to have all blades professionally sharpened. Does anyone have experience with them? My impression is that they are a bit expensive, but offer a good collection of products. They are located in Naarden so i could even pop by for a visit, which is nice.

The Dovo strop they offer that is still somewhat affordable is 3,5 x 35 cm, which seems a bit small to me. I am not in the market to spend over 100 euro's for a bit wider strop. On SRP i mostly see references to 2" or 3" wide strops, which is quite a bit bigger. Is 3,5 cm enough in width to do some proper stropping?


Suggestion for other sites that offer good deals in the Netherlands would be welcome as well.

Fellow dutch guy here. I went to demessenwinkel in Antwerpen since I only wanted to buy after looking and touchin different SR brushed and smell the soaps. The one I bought was also cheaper overthere compared to manandshaving. You also have the 'scheersalon'. No exp. with them. The messenwinkel sends for free above 70e.

Have fun selecting one and using it will be fantastic.

No experience whit that shop, what shave1975 said i want to see it live before buying.
you can go to the dutch barbershop at Breukelen, this guy have nice razors for a good price.
Barbershop Classics The Shaving Shop

Or if you want for sure thats shave ready buy here on the classifieds.
By the way Welcome here.

Hi Borr,

Ask them what they mean by 'professionally sharpened', is it a factory edge ? Or is there a honer somewhere?
If they only sell Dovo's, my advice is to stay away from them. I've seen too many issues with (especially entry level) Dovo's lately. You're *much* better off with a shave-ready from either here or the Barbershop at Breukelen. If you want a new razor that's shave-ready, you're way better off with a Revisor or a Ralf Aust. But yes, you'll pay more than for an entry level Dovo.

And please, I know you're Dutch (sorry to seem offensive), but good gear costs money. The small Dovo strop might seem a good deal, but you'll regret it, at least if you stay in this hobby. Check the Straight Razor Design website, they sell really splendid stuff for 50 USD. That quality at those prices simply cannot be beaten.

Just my opinion etc and so forth.

Something I forgot.

Even though I'm from Belgium and I met and quite liked the guy from de Koordenwinkel, the razors he sells have their factory edge, so most likely not shave-ready. I can't recommend this shop.

The same with 1Barber.be, splendid chap, lovely shop and site, but his razors have factory edges. The difference is, Gregory from 1Barber offers a honing service. By the way, make sure you check out his site, he really has an awesome collection of gear.

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Originally Posted by decraew

Something I forgot.

Even though I'm from Belgium and I met and quite liked the guy from de Koordenwinkel, the razors he sells have their factory edge, so most likely not shave-ready. I can't recommend this shop.

The same with 1Barber.be, splendid chap, lovely shop and site, but his razors have factory edges. The difference is, Gregory from 1Barber offers a honing service. By the way, make sure you check out his site, he really has an awesome collection of gear.

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The dovo I bought @themessenwinkel was absolute shave ready. We can discus what shave ready exactly is but since I shaved with it for two months before getting dull with perfect results for me it was. So with a lot of experience Ok it might be better but sometimes the whole honing on brand new SRs seems a bit over the edge to me.

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Originally Posted by Shave1975

The dovo I bought @themessenwinkel was absolute shave ready. So with a lot of experience Ok it might be better but sometimes the whole honing on brand new SRs seems a bit over the edge to me.

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Well congratulations, you've either got a good one, or somehow factory edges work for you.

I'm not saying there aren't any good ones you can shave with, I'm just saying that the quality is very variable. Especially for the cheap Dovo's. I remember my first razor, also a Dovo. Well, I could shave with it, in the literal sense. But it was not a pleasant experience at all, with serious pulling.

You can indeed discuss what shave-ready means, and yes, I have become quite difficult to please in that department.

A couple examples. A while ago there was a group buy of a Dovo on the CCC forum. I don't recall exactly, but I think virtually all members who bought such a razor (about 140 I think) had to revert to using a pasted strop at the outset to get their Dovo in shaving conditions. I'm talking a couple of hundred laps on puma paste (which is the usual way to do things with a new razor over in France). And the razor was not an entry level one either.

Another example, just a few weeks ago, a chap passed by my place because his Dovo didn't shave. A new one from said shop. Not only was it not shave-ready, it was positively blunt, you could literally not shave a single hair with that razor. I had to hone the damn thing. It also had serious geometry issues, so the honing was not an easy job either. It made me decide never ever to accept honing a Dovo again.

So there :)

Welcome to SRP from across the pond. If I understand correctly the strop is 3.5 wide ? Like the USA equivalent of 1 &3/8" ? IMHO, if that is what it is it is too narrow and 35cm is too short. Professional barbers in the USA, for most of the 20th century, used 2 1/2 (6.5cm) x 23" (58.5cm). Either a 2 1/2 or 3" wide strop is way more user friendly in my experience. :gl:

If you want to feel before buying you obviously need a store.
But with the big difference between $ and euro, it is often a much better idea to buy from the US, even with shipping cost included.
I don't buy anything in stores (except shaving cream) because of the big difference in cost.

ok going to check out what a honemeister can improve on my edge. Is 'Gregory from 1Barber' the only one offering quality hone services in the NL|BE? First results in google came up with zero :-(

Thanks for all the suggestions. It turned out i was not patient enough to actually visit a shop, so i ordered the red Pakka wood Dovo from the messenwinkel. Manandshaving do offer a honing service for EUR 23.50, not sure what the quality level is, but it will probably be my go-to address when this one dulls out, or is too dull to start with.

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Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

Welcome to SRP from across the pond. If I understand correctly the strop is 3.5 wide ? Like the USA equivalent of 1 &3/8" ? IMHO, if that is what it is it is too narrow and 35cm is too short. Professional barbers in the USA, for most of the 20th century, used 2 1/2 (6.5cm) x 23" (58.5cm). Either a 2 1/2 or 3" wide strop is way more user friendly in my experience. :gl:

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Hi Jimmy, thanks for the welcome :) Yes it would be 1 3/8" wide. I thought it would be too narrow. I now ordered an entry level strop at nearly 2" wide to cut up and will definitely order a bigger one when i get the hang of it.

Borr, I don't know where in the Netherlands you live but if you're close to Amsterdam you can come to my house and we'll hone your razor together. You can also mail it to me and I sent it back to you the next day but if you come over I can show you how it's done and/or let you do it under supervision so your razor is not only shaving sharp but you learn how it's done and only need to buy some stones to be self sufficient.
I know how hard it is in our small part of the world to get some good gear and honing service, I remember when I started out I felt like I had to do it all by myself (with only the friendly people on the internet to help me).
I have naniwas (chosera 1K and up to 10K SS) coticule, Cnat, and a JNAT (shoubudani) with nagura's so plenty of choice for finishers.
My offer is gratis offcourse as I like to help out a fellow straight shaver get started, it can be hard to get started here but I can shave the rest of my life with what I have now, except maybe for soap but I'm set for at least 10 years :D

Hi Puerco, that is a very kind offer, I might take you up on that! I would like to be self sufficient eventually and it would help greatly if someone could show me (what i am doing wrong ;)).

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Originally Posted by decraew

Hi Borr,

Ask them what they mean by 'professionally sharpened', is it a factory edge ? Or is there a honer somewhere?
If they only sell Dovo's, my advice is to stay away from them. I've seen too many issues with (especially entry level) Dovo's lately. You're *much* better off with a shave-ready from either here or the Barbershop at Breukelen. If you want a new razor that's shave-ready, you're way better off with a Revisor or a Ralf Aust. But yes, you'll pay more than for an entry level Dovo.

And please, I know you're Dutch (sorry to seem offensive), but good gear costs money. The small Dovo strop might seem a good deal, but you'll regret it, at least if you stay in this hobby. Check the Straight Razor Design website, they sell really splendid stuff for 50 USD. That quality at those prices simply cannot be beaten.

Just my opinion etc and so forth.

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I agree. My first straight was a Dovo best quality. It was not sharp at all even though I didnt know much then. I have purchased, honed and shaved with 30 razors since then and it is the one razor that no matter what I do will not keep an edge for an entire shave. I dont have this problem with my 30 others and would not sell it to someone who will have the same trouble as I did. My second razor was a Thiers Issard 5/8. Much sharper to start and takes and keeps an edge a long time. The price difference was $40 more. You have "cheap" and then you have value.

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Originally Posted by Borr

Hi Puerco, that is a very kind offer, I might take you up on that! I would like to be self sufficient eventually and it would help greatly if someone could show me (what i am doing wrong ;)).

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I look forward to it, will be my pleasure.
Just shoot me a PM if and when you want to come or send your razor(s).

After rolling the edge on my first straight razor, I got a paddle strop. Much easier to get the hang of. Now I have a 3 inch and 2 inch hanger and 3 inch paddle that I use sometimes even though I can handle the hanging.

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Originally Posted by bill3152

I agree. My first straight was a Dovo best quality. It was not sharp at all even though I didnt know much then. I have purchased, honed and shaved with 30 razors since then and it is the one razor that no matter what I do will not keep an edge for an entire shave. I dont have this problem with my 30 others and would not sell it to someone who will have the same trouble as I did. My second razor was a Thiers Issard 5/8. Much sharper to start and takes and keeps an edge a long time. The price difference was $40 more. You have "cheap" and then you have value.

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The quality control at Dovo is somewhat questionable, they make nice razors but sometimes a dud slips through.
On the other hand I have some cheap gold dollar razors that needed some work to get them to be able to hone them (grinding away the shoulder, reworking the spine, polishing away the rough grind marks, crappy scales etc.) but they take and hold an edge and shave as good as any more expensive or vintage razor.
I wouldn't recommend them as a first razor for a beginner but if you see them as an unfinished blank for grinding and rescaling they can be a lot of fun and great practice objects. I'd rather mess up a gold dollar then a vintage razor.

Havent tried a GD. I dont think I want to try one either. I would prefer a vintage sheffield or solingen. Even if it needs to be cleaned up. I will say I have heard a lot of good things about the temper of the steel, keeping an edge. The only blades I would consider buying now are old near wedges. I have about 30 straights total. 4/8 to 8/8. extra hollow to full wedge. Although I will never buy another full wedge, but thats another story for another forum!

Oh I prefer those vintage ones too especially Sheffield but I would never want to mess those up so for practicing I started with some gold dollar razors. They are cheap and the steel is good, everything else needs fixing to end up with something useable.
I'm not recommending them here but they served me well for learning how to fix things without worrying of destroying something with a lot of history on it.
After they are fixed, shoulders removed, rescaled etc. you at least end up with something useable for traveling or giving it away to someone who wants to try out straight shaving.

I hear what you are saying. Shaving honing stropping etc is very relaxing and enjoyable. Everybody should do whatever makes them happy. I wasnt knocking GDs, its just not my thing. Enjoy!

Popping in to answer the OP's question:

Juan from Man and Shaving.nl is a nice guy. I ordered a few times from him and he is a stand up guy. His prices are a little higher than some other shops. Service is top notch.

New straights will be honed by hand. No factory edge but a true shave-ready edge. The razors get honed by a 'Master barber' under the name of Jan Heideman. He also offers a straight razor course. Now I don't know the quality of the shave-ready edges of his razors as I've never tried them, but I know they get honed by hand.

I'm not affiliated with manandshaving.nl in any way, just wanted to answer the question!

Hi DoubleB, thanks for your answer. If Jan Heideman hones the new razors, I am pretty sure the edges will be fine. It would be helpful if the site offered this information themselves, it would have convinced me to buy from them probably.

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Originally Posted by DoubleB

Popping in to answer the OP's question:

Juan from Man and Shaving.nl is a nice guy. I ordered a few times from him and he is a stand up guy. His prices are a little higher than some other shops. Service is top notch.

New straights will be honed by hand. No factory edge but a true shave-ready edge. The razors get honed by a 'Master barber' under the name of Jan Heideman. He also offers a straight razor course. Now I don't know the quality of the shave-ready edges of his razors as I've never tried them, but I know they get honed by hand.

I'm not affiliated with manandshaving.nl in any way, just wanted to answer the question!

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Now that's interesting information ! Do you know what he uses for honing and what he charges ?

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Originally Posted by decraew

Now that's interesting information ! Do you know what he uses for honing and what he charges ?

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It took me a bit of effort to find it on the site, here it is:
Slijpservice open scheermes - Cursussen en services - Manandshaving.nl

EUR 23,50

Phew. Good solution for someone with only a couple of razors although not exactly cheap. Puts the price of razors in the classifieds section in perspective.

I've been considering outsourcing my owns razors due to lack of time, but at that price it would be a no-go.

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Originally Posted by decraew

Phew. Good solution for someone with only a couple of razors although not exactly cheap. Puts the price of razors in the classifieds section in perspective.

I've been considering outsourcing my owns razors due to lack of time, but at that price it would be a no-go.

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I would purchase a hone, at least a Norton 4/8 or comparable. I and many others have destroyed our first edges by improper stropping. The beauty for me is that I can get the edge whenever I want and as others have said exactly to the sharpness you want. If I had to mail a straight razor and wait for it to come back a week or so, I wouldn't use one. But that's my opinion, obviously you should do whatever you are comfortable doing. The hones will save you money in the end. Its a learning curve but I think most people would be able to hone after a few weeks. The narrow strop in my opinion is a waste of money. If you're trying to get in cheap, I think you will be disappointed. But again I'm not an expert just a relatively new shaver/honer who is enjoying this immensely. Good luck.

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Originally Posted by decraew

Now that's interesting information ! Do you know what he uses for honing and what he charges ?

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I'm guessing he uses a coticule, based on the pictures on the website. That's purely hypothetical though and not based on any solid evidence.

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Originally Posted by bill3152

I would purchase a hone, at least a Norton 4/8 or comparable. I and many others have destroyed our first edges by improper stropping. The beauty for me is that I can get the edge whenever I want and as others have said exactly to the sharpness you want. If I had to mail a straight razor and wait for it to come back a week or so, I wouldn't use one. But that's my opinion, obviously you should do whatever you are comfortable doing. The hones will save you money in the end. Its a learning curve but I think most people would be able to hone after a few weeks. The narrow strop in my opinion is a waste of money. If you're trying to get in cheap, I think you will be disappointed. But again I'm not an expert just a relatively new shaver/honer who is enjoying this immensely. Good luck.

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Norton's are really hard to come by in Europe. You will probably end up buying the overseas, with high shipping costs and customs declarations to follow. In my opinion you're better of with a Naniwa 3/8K combo. Pretty easy to come by in Europe, about the same price as the Norton and, again in my opinion, Naniwa's leave a better edge.

I just foud out an americanstore here in Eindhoven had the Norton4/8 stone. Currenty sold out off course. but for 'just' 119 euro's or so. We might combine an order from the US.

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Originally Posted by Shave1975

I just foud out an americanstore here in Eindhoven had the Norton4/8 stone. Currenty sold out off course. but for 'just' 119 euro's or so. We might combine an order from the US.

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That's a pretty steep price. But it's good to hear there is a Norton 4/8K available here for the people who really want it.

By the way; the Norton 220/1K can be had a several places for around 40 euro's. No problem in finding those for the people who want it.

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Originally Posted by DoubleB

I'm guessing he uses a coticule, based on the pictures on the website. That's purely hypothetical though and not based on any solid evidence.



Norton's are really hard to come by in Europe. You will probably end up buying the overseas, with high shipping costs and customs declarations to follow. In my opinion you're better of with a Naniwa 3/8K combo. Pretty easy to come by in Europe, about the same price as the Norton and, again in my opinion, Naniwa's leave a better edge.

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I have a naniwa 12k and it is a fine stone. I'm sure the 3/8 will serve you well. I use Norton because they are popular and readily available here. I can't see you going wrong with that.

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Originally Posted by bill3152

I would purchase a hone, at least a Norton 4/8 or comparable. I and many others have destroyed our first edges by improper stropping. The beauty for me is that I can get the edge whenever I want and as others have said exactly to the sharpness you want. If I had to mail a straight razor and wait for it to come back a week or so, I wouldn't use one. But that's my opinion, obviously you should do whatever you are comfortable doing. The hones will save you money in the end. Its a learning curve but I think most people would be able to hone after a few weeks. The narrow strop in my opinion is a waste of money. If you're trying to get in cheap, I think you will be disappointed. But again I'm not an expert just a relatively new shaver/honer who is enjoying this immensely. Good luck.

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Dude, I have about 10 coticules, and DMTs in 4 different grits for the rougher work, apart from some odd other stones. What I mean is, I do have enough hones and I know by now how to use them. It's just the time I lack. I have currently roughly 50 unhoned razors but sadly not enough time.

But thanks for the advice anyway ! :D

Like stated above, the Norton 4k/8k probably is to be found in more stores; I got mine at Classic Hand Tools
Also buy a DMT 325 for lapping the stones, I too found out it's essential.

As a finisher you can't go wrong with a 12k Naniwa SS. They don't sell those however.
This is where I got mine: Naniwa Chosera Stones
It is a lot of money, but hey, the good stuff always is.

Paulj you linked to the chosera stones which are more expensive than the super stones.
There's a branch of the Eden shops in the Netherlands.

My personal preference is a combination of DMTs (at least the extra fine) and a coticule. For the rougher work cheap diamond hones can be found on ebay.