Printable View
:hmmm: I was ready to pull the proverbial trigger on a 28mm Two band Silvertip Bulb this evening and thought I'd do a little research first. Probably a very good idea for a $200.00+ shaving brush.
I've read on more than one forum that Thäter's instructions recommend against using their brushes if you are a face latherer. I use creams exclusively and don't know why this would be a problem.
I would appreciate your learned thoughts and ideas.
That sounds like bs to me. And 200 bucks ?? where are you getting it? Are they that much at SRD. I have owned my 24mm for over a year and its the BEST,i face lather and bowl lather too.
Yes, my BS Meter pegged when I read that as well. I've never had a problem face lathering with any brush I've ever used; silvertip, boar, etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by nessmuck
Well, the 28mm are over $200.00 at SRD but that's not where I was surfing. I wish I was around when the group buy was in progress! :cry:Quote:
Originally Posted by nessmuck
Gentlemen,
Correct you are on this nonsense about face lathering damaging Thater brushes. This is the first I've heard of it. The two Thaters I have are fine and dandy face or bowl lathering. Another warning floating around is that one should apply lather in a paint brush motion rather than circular for fear of damaging the brush. The next warning I expect to hear is that one should hold the handle with two fingers, thumb and index, and extend the pinky finger like an antenna to prevent the hairs from falling out. Oooooh, I like that.
Stay well.
Obie,
Grand comments and fine wit. I think you should post a photo of yourself holding that Thater with your pinky extended! Wonderful Sunday wisdom and wordplay, sir.
This got me curious (just had to check it out for myself) - so I headed over to the H L Thater website to take a quick look...
Dumped all 3 pages under 'Tips for Shaving and Care' into translation.babylon.com. Only one page talks about using the brush to build a lather. It only describes how to bowl lather. But - as is to be expected - makes no statement/recommendation whatsoever about not using the brushes for face lathering.
Makes perfect sense - after all, a badger shaving brush is a badger shaving brush regardless whose moniker is on it...
And as others have chimed in, they're using their Thaters to face lather without issue and with great success/results. So I wouldn't hesitate the least bit to grab a Thater and see if it takes you to face lathering nirvana.
As for holding the brush with thumb and index finger while extending the pinky - it not only prevents the hairs from falling out, it also focuses the ions in the air around the brush into the brush handle - causing the brush to vibrate for a really deep facial massage while lathering (just make sure none of your fillings are loose before starting).
In all seriousness though, if you do end up with a Thater, please do report back and let us know how you like it. As a face latherer who likes ZERO scritchiness in his brush, I've been on a quest for a large uber-soft fan for flat head brush. My search has lead to me a Shavemac D01 (standard 3-band) which is quite amazing. However the person who traded it to me mentioned the only other brush he felt could compete with it for softness is a Thater - which has me very curious about them now...
My dear pcg, thanks for the kind words. I think posing for such a photo on SRP sounds intriguing. Hollywood here I come. . . Stay well.Quote:
Originally Posted by pcg
my 6yo daughter just told me that when you are drinking from a glass you should hold your pinky finger out because it's 'ladylike'
I am a big proponent of smooshing my brush to get all the lather out of it and would probably make Mr Thater cringe if he saw how I treated my M&F brush (not only the smooshing AND face lathering in a circular motion, but I yell at it constantly. I'm sorry but shave brushes NEED to be demeaned so they stay in line).
Attachment 80975Quote:
Originally Posted by rearviewmirror
But seriously...
I have a habit of over-researching my purchases and my wife kids me mercilessly about it. Ultimately though, I make my decisions based upon that research. $200.00 is a lot of money for me and I would hope when you ascend into that class of product, you won't be replacing it for a long time.
Here's one of the links I found. Note the last sentence of the last post on the page. The forum poster claims face lathering is not recommended and his comment is taken from Thäter's instructions included with the brush:Quote:
Originally Posted by Malacoda
SMF :: View topic - Thater 2 Band
I'm not going to post every link I found, but there were no forums that I read that were critical of Thäter's products.
If you read other manufacturers sites they will tell you not to use shave oil and not to use swirling motions with a brush. Probably about as valid as some of the instructions packed with TI Razors.
I have one Thater and I pretty much exclusively face lather and have never had any issues with it or any other brush for that matter.
They probably figure the more you treat their product with kid gloves the less issues they will have dealing with you down the road. Hedging their bets I would say.
I tend to treat my things with kid gloves anyway. Lynn and I had an email exchange about this earlier; I don't grind my brushes into my face like a lot of face latherers. With the wire brush stubble that some guys have (cheese graters I call them) you can almost certainly wear out ANY brush; expensive or not.
The insert that came with my Thaeter said, as best I can remember, "Only make lather in your bowl, we don't recommend face lathering. Beard hair is harder than badger bristles and face lathering can reduce the lifespan of your brush."
And yet you use the brush to rub the lather into your beard hairs, whether the lather comes from a bowl or not. So I am wondering if there is that much difference in the result.Quote:
Originally Posted by JimR
Anyway I've face-lathered for years with a cheap boar brush and it is still good. I figure that if a boar can handle it, so can badger. So far (3 months) my Thater silvertip does not seem to be affected by the face lathering.
There is a simple reason for this statement regarding face lathering.
I just finished my quest for a new shaving brush. Living in Germany I had the choice between either a Thäter "chubby" 28mm [4125/3] or a Simpsons Chubby 2 or 3.
I opted for the Thäter after thorough research. In Germany the Thäter is very common and quite well known. There are not many issues known about the brush losing hair,
but there are some reports about broken tips and broken hair. Thäter managed to find out that if the brush is used with much pressure the hair can acutally be damaged.
Seeing some videos on youtube I see it is quite common to use pressure while facelathering.
The insanely dense brush with a lot of backbone does not like to be pressed against the face or the bowl!
If you look at this instructional (in German) from Thäter,
you will see a damaged brush on the very last page. The text sais:
Quote:
Do not use pressure while lathering. There is no advantage to that but leads to premature wear.
In the picture you see a damaged brush with a hole in the middle of the tips.
Remember: less pressure = more lather where you need it and less stress for the tips/hair of the brush
Gentlemen,
The assumption, then, is that everyone uses pressure to not only load the brush but also to apply or make lather on the face. I hate to disappoint these brush companies, because not everyone does so. That's the wrong way of doing it, whether using a Thater or a low-grade brush. In all instances the pressure should be kept light, because jamming the brush into the soap or onto the face accomplishes nothing. Yes, it could perhaps also damage the brush. And, yes, that could apply to many things: using extreme pressure with the straight razor is sure to give you some juicy razor burns and cuts.
Well, from the looks of the brush you linked to;Quote:
Originally Posted by Lesslemming
Attachment 81087
I'm guessing they were painting a house with the sample :D
Obie is right though; sanding your face with a Thäter or a paintbrush everyday will wear both out; eventually.
It's a brush - use it. If you're worried about wearing out your brush, go buy a $6 special at the drugstore and put all your Thaters on the wall shelf. Brushes, hones, and razors were all meant to be used.Quote:
Originally Posted by hamilton946
But Jerry, if I did that, you'd have no one to tweak :rofl2:Quote:
Originally Posted by jerrybyers
FWIW, somewhere around 1972 or 3 I bought a shaving brush at Hoffritz for Cutlery. I used it, face lathering with some pressure, for 35 years before I bought another brush. IIRC the brush, which is a badger, marked "Hoffritz" cost me around $80.00, so it was a quality brush. Back then $80.00 was a weeks pay for some folks. I still have the brush and it will still do the job for which it was intended.
The first instructions I read warning of swirling the brush came with a Kent BK4. They recommended a painting motion. I ignored that warning , as I have with all of the many brushes I've tried in the past four years. It seems to me these cautions are just the CYA mentality of the manufacturer anticipating warranty issues. BTW, the reason it is preferable to generate your lather in a bowl, aside from any benefit to the bristles, is because it creates more, and better lather...... AFAIC. .....YMMV. Enjoy your brush and your shave. :tu
Really, when you come to think of it every aspect of shaving dictates finesse over brawn whether it's honing or stropping of shaving or lathering. Heavy pressure in most cases gets you no-where.
