President of the US of A

Look, you get the cards you're dealt. Then it's up to you to do what's best. There are rich families that made their wealth generations ago, and these families haven't lifted a finger as far as work is concerned for generations. Now they can choose to keep investing what they were born into, or they can become drug addicts and lose their fortunes. The same way the poor can accept that they were dealt a crap hand and decide to make their life better. Are there other circumstances that make this more difficult in some situations, yes. The problem is we aren't just trying to help these people that give up on making their life better, we are securing that life for them.

Your one example of a poor old lady doesn't fully grasp the issue. There are millions of Americans who receive rent, electricity, cell phones, food, health insurance, and many more benefits all while not working and collecting disability. Then they realize they get even more money if they have more children, so now you have a poor person completely dependent on the government to survive, with 6 children from 6 different fathers. I don't blame these people, I don't even look down upon them. They discovered a flaw in the system and they maximize it to their benefit. The blame falls on the government.

These people are in for a rude awakening after this next election, and while it might be sad, or inhumane if your a liberal democrat, but it is necessary to ensure that future generations don't abuse the system as a form of survival vs a form of assistance to help get through hard times.

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Originally Posted by prodigy

Look, you get the cards you're dealt. Then it's up to you to do what's best. There are rich families that made their wealth generations ago, and these families haven't lifted a finger as far as work is concerned for generations. Now they can choose to keep investing what they were born into, or they can become drug addicts and lose their fortunes. The same way the poor can accept that they were dealt a crap hand and decide to make their life better. Are there other circumstances that make this more difficult in some situations, yes. The problem is we aren't just trying to help these people that give up on making their life better, we are securing that life for them.

Your one example of a poor old lady doesn't fully grasp the issue. There are millions of Americans who receive rent, electricity, cell phones, food, health insurance, and many more benefits all while not working and collecting disability. Then they realize they get even more money if they have more children, so now you have a poor person completely dependent on the government to survive, with 6 children from 6 different fathers. I don't blame these people, I don't even look down upon them. They discovered a flaw in the system and they maximize it to their benefit. The blame falls on the government.

These people are in for a rude awakening after this next election, and while it might be sad, or inhumane if your a liberal democrat, but it is necessary to ensure that future generations don't abuse the system as a form of survival vs a form of assistance to help get through hard times.

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If you read my post you'll see I make arguments for both sides. A welfare state is already on the road to self-destruction due to human nature, but a complete lack of charity toward the weak and the poor leads to situations such as the one that I described with the old lady.

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Originally Posted by puketui41

If you read my post you'll see I make arguments for both sides. A welfare state is already on the road to self-destruction due to human nature, but a complete lack of charity toward the weak and the poor leads to situations such as the one that I described with the old lady.

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Well I did read your post, and you are making a lot of assumptions that will never be known. The man with the Ferrari could have been a rich prick, or he could have been a philanthropist that donates millions of dollars to the poor, we will never know which, so why assume? Should the rich not be allowing to buy fancy things because there are poor people? I guess I don't see the point of your story?

A difference of opinion...

It seems that many people have confused two words

Charity vs Taxation

If you hire the Government to take money from one to give to another through no choice of their own that is no longer Charity


Being Charitable is a choice and in the past was not handled by the government, when you say the Rich need to be more charitable what you really mean is "I am jealous of what my Neighbor has and I want the Government to go take it and give it to somebody else"


Cue the argument that the tax laws are written to benefit the Rich :) even though those laws are written for everyone



ps: Time to go cast our votes here in the Northern Panhandle of Idaho (we are PST) last I heard it is pretty much between Cruz and Trump in ID which is to be expected... Cruz should actually be the winner here if ID votes as it normally does

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Originally Posted by gssixgun

A difference of opinion...

It seems that many people have confused two words

Charity vs Taxation

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For many, its best to keep those words confused. That way its a convenient jump to the next word, "rights". The transition between them is called "social justice".

Appears that Trump is, contrary to conservative values, a supporter of big government. So if you support him get ready for a lot more taxes.

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Originally Posted by gssixgun

A difference of opinion...

It seems that many people have confused two words

Charity vs Taxation

If you hire the Government to take money from one to give to another through no choice of their own that is no longer Charity


Being Charitable is a choice and in the past was not handled by the government, when you say the Rich need to be more charitable what you really mean is "I am jealous of what my Neighbor has and I want the Government to go take it and give it to somebody else"


Cue the argument that the tax laws are written to benefit the Rich :) even though those laws are written for everyone



ps: Time to go cast our votes here in the Northern Panhandle of Idaho (we are PST) last I heard it is pretty much between Cruz and Trump in ID which is to be expected... Cruz should actually be the winner here if ID votes as it normally does

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I have only two points here. For those who want little govt and no meddling by govt and little or no regulations you need only go to your local library and take out some books relating the life of the average joe at the turn of the 20th Century when all Govt was small and states rights were the law. Very few folks would want to live under those conditions now and obviously they didn't like it then because they did something about it.

When Romney made his boast that he pays every penny of his taxes and not a dime more and many folks cheered that, the reality was when he said that he was really sticking it to every middle class person. Guys like him and their agents are the ones who write the tax laws and they do it to benefit them not us. The rest of us take it in the shorts come tax time. The tax laws are thousands of pages long. If they only related to middle class and lower folk they would only be a couple hundred pages at most. The rest is just smoke and mirrors to allow the rich to keep as much of their wealth as they pretty much want. Most of the population have an idea the system is rigged but few really know just how rigged it is. I had an uncle who was a tax lawyer and we used to have these discussions about taxes. it was pretty eye opening.

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Originally Posted by OCDshaver

For many, its best to keep those words confused. That way its a convenient jump to the next word, "rights". The transition between them is called "social justice".

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I've always found it funny how when the issue of taking from the wealthy and redistributing it to the poor comes up folks are up in arms as if the rich need lower class folks to champion an issue for them. On the other hand when money is taken from the lower classes and given to the rich you hear....a pin drop.

As they say in Star Wars to those who feel that way "your training-brainwashing is complete"

Oh well it was fun :)

But Cruz took Idaho, our little county swung Trump however as of this point in time...

Don't laugh but the count right now is 282 for Trump and 279 for Cruz wooooooohooooooo

I was really hoping that the state was going to swing to Trump, we are pretty strict with voting up here, we actually require ID's and you have to be a Resisted Republican to vote in the primary.. I was surprised that they would allow you to declare at the polling location but that is what the rules were ..

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Originally Posted by gssixgun

we are pretty strict with voting up here, we actually require ID's and you have to be a Resisted Republican to vote in the primary.

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I figure it was a typo, but for some reason I like the term "Resisted Republican."