You've given me an idea for a potentially interesting thread. :) Here it is.Quote:
Originally Posted by sffone
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You've given me an idea for a potentially interesting thread. :) Here it is.Quote:
Originally Posted by sffone
This goes to show how little you know about guns & before you spout off at the mouth, you should know what you are talking about. I deer hunt with all of my AR-15's. Two are in .223, one in 7.62x39 (same as an AK, same ballistics as a Winchester 30-30), and one in .458 SOCOM. The SOCOM was developed just for our soldiers, but guess what, it has the same bullet and ballistics as a 45-70. It is the best deer and hog rifle I own out to 150 yds. One of my .223's is match built my none other than me. Check out Camp Pendelton rifle matches, the best shooters around compete there & guess what most use...that's right, a match grade AR-15 & they shoot just a little further than 100 meters:). I can place 10 shots inside of 1/2 inch at 100 yds & keep all 10 rounds inside an 8" pie plate at 600 yds as long as I do my part. Your car could kill people just as easily, just as fast, and just as many as one of my AR's. My tractor with the brush hog could be "converted" to a people killer, wanna outlaw it too??? Guns don't kill people, people kill people.Quote:
Originally Posted by AussiePostie
I know my guns pretty well, better know your stuff before you try to bluff yourself out of this one. My tractor IS dangerous too...
Quote:
Originally Posted by AussiePostie
Actuallly, it is somewhat more difficult than you might think, but even if it were easy, it is illegal. So your original statement that it is legal for ordinary citizens to own military grade weapons is still false. Individuals can own certain military grade weapons provided they have the appropriate firearms dealers license. It is expensive, somewhat difficult to obtain and it gives the government considerable access to what most would consider their private affairs. The semiautomatic AR-15 is in fact one of the most popular sporting rifles in use in the USA, used for target practice, competition, and various types of small game hunting. An AK-47 firing 7.62x39 (semi automatic of course) amunition is legal for hunting game up to dear size in many locations (though there may be some limitations on the magazine capacity used in this application). The 7.62x39 round is approximately equal to a .30-.30 round fired by lever action hunting rifles, and considerably less effective than the .30-06 (7.62x63) or .308 winchester (7.62x51) ammunition used in a great many hunting rifles (many of which are also semi-automatic). There is a semi automatic sproting rifle sold by Strum-Ruger that fires .223 Remingtion just like the AR-15, with screwdriver, about 30 minutes of time and a US$100 stock conversion kit it can be converted into something that looks very much like an AR-15, has this sporting rifle now become a military grade rifle? Was it always a military grade rifle?
Also, the standard sniper rifle used by the US Army and Marines is no more than a Remington 700 chambered in either .30-06 or .308. These same rifles are among the most popular hunting rifles available. Are they military grade? Better than military grade (since the military actually adopted them because of their superior accuracy and range over the military rifles previously used by snipers.
I thought this thread had lasted pretty well, but there is always a time when people get a little too involved. Oh well.Quote:
Originally Posted by shooter74743
I guess it's pretty obvious that I'm passionate about being a proud Christian & firearms huh? The moron part was uncalled for...but I stand by everything else. Will edit post...Quote:
Originally Posted by gregs656
Good man.
I don't think people are going to like this, but it's interesting. I do believe there is some merit in the idea that people should stand up against their governments, I also believe that you do not nessercerily need guns to do this, and the French are superb at getting the govt to bend to their will with little more than home made molotov ****tails, trucks, and sometimes a few big old boats. Anyway, it is interesting that in this country and probably in the states as well, you would now be deemed a terrorist for commiting a violent act against your govt. One mans freedom fighter truely is another mans terrorist.
Here is my overall impression after having lived in the US for two years. Before that I lived in Norway and Ethiopia for five years as a kid.
Any society wich already has got a lot of guns is really hard to "demilitarize" and if an effort is made to take away the guns, you will end up with only the criminals having guns. So we have a dilemma there, cause the americans here seems to think europeans should stock up on guns while the europeans thinks the americans should get rid of theirs.
There is a major difference in culture and thoughts when it comes to guns: in the US a gun is primarily a weapon and its uses are: self defense, target-practice and hunting, in that order.
In Europe a gun is a tool, people use it for hunting primarily, then target-practice. Some people will use it for self defense inside their houses, but for most people it is a tool and they won't even think about using it for defense.
In Ethiopia a AK cost around $10 and they were all full auto. you would see people everywhere carrying and it was generally ok. But they had a lot more shootings and stuff, especially in the big cities, we even had to have bulletproof shades in front of our windows during night. We would hear full auto fire every few nights when the people would stand up against the government in the spirit of the second amendment. The strange thing is that when my american friends see this kind of stuff on the news, they start talking about "damn commies, we should go over and get them" so it is not ok for the people to bear arms if they are poor or if they have leftist politic views?
I agree with you completely here.Quote:
Originally Posted by flyboy
[/QUOTE]So we have a dilemma there, cause the americans here seems to think europeans should stock up on guns while the europeans thinks the americans should get rid of theirs.
There is a major difference in culture and thoughts when it comes to guns: in the US a gun is primarily a weapon and its uses are: self defense, target-practice and hunting, in that order. [/QUOTE]
This is obviously your opinion and not American's as a whole. The best weapon for self-defense is a prepared mind. The most dangerous weapon in the WORLD is the mind. THE FACT IS more triggers are pulled here in the U.S. daily in THIS order: target practice, hunting, and very minimally in self-defense. Yes, we shoot a lot, hunt quite a bit, but will defend ourselves if NEED BE. I'd defend my family with whatever I could put my hands on at that time, no matter if it's a umbrella, kitchen knife, hammer, you get my point.
[/QUOTE] In Europe a gun is a tool, people use it for hunting primarily, then target-practice. Some people will use it for self defense inside their houses, but for most people it is a tool and they won't even think about using it for defense. [/QUOTE]
I'm no European, but those that I do know aren't pansies & would defend themselves and their families just as I would.
[/QUOTE]In Ethiopia a AK cost around $10 and they were all full auto. you would see people everywhere carrying and it was generally ok. But they had a lot more shootings and stuff, especially in the big cities, we even had to have bulletproof shades in front of our windows during night. We would hear full auto fire every few nights when the people would stand up against the government in the spirit of the second amendment. The strange thing is that when my american friends see this kind of stuff on the news, they start talking about "damn commies, we should go over and get them" so it is not ok for the people to bear arms if they are poor or if they have leftist politic views?[/QUOTE]
I wonder if your American friends are Veterans & have ever had to go "Go get them"? Why in the world would we want to "Go get them" just because they have a rifle? We have enough problems here in the U.S., spending lives & $$$ to impose our "will" on another country is, IMO, none of our business.
We have had movements in the USA that tried to go against the government. The Black Panther Party being a relatively recent example. They didn't make out very well to say the least. Not saying that they should have BTW... Our government has proved to have people working for them that are ruthless when they feel they have to be. The way the world is today I guess that is a good thing. The civil rights movement OTOH was by and large a demonstration of how passive resistance can change a society.Quote:
Originally Posted by gregs656
Sure, I'm not saying every 'freedom fighting' group is right, but stuff like the LA riots and the more regular french blockades and riots in Paris, episodes of civil unrest.Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyHAD
Things like that in this country, and perhaps in the states as well? would not occur with out the word terrorist being mentioned. The 'terrorist act' or what ever it is over here, would be endlessly cited.
I am not saying we are pansies, of course we would also use a gun in the last resort to protect our own, but what I meant is that it is very few people in Europe who would go and get their gun if it is a strange sound in the house. Here in the US that seems to be one of the first things many people would do.
And when I am talking about target practice I don't mean people with a .45 shooting at a man-shaped paper target. I mean people honing their skills using a .22 or skeet-shooting.
If self-defense truly is on the bottom of your list, is your gun locked in a safe? A gun beside your bed for spur of the moment target-shooting or in case a deer walks over the lawn?
if there is a strange house IN the house then yes that is what I will do. I've heard plenty of strange noises outside the house at night. My sister has come in my room a couple times telling me there was a strange sound outside the house...:shrug:...I didn't go grab/ draw my gun.Quote:
Originally Posted by flyboy
When that strange sound is IN the house that's a different ball game all together.
I thought that I asked reasonably politely for some constructive answers to my questions. I am certain I said correct me if I am wrong, not abuse me if I am wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by shooter74743
I have received a lot of informative feedback from people here.
But you go off the deep end, telling me I am shooting my mouth off,and that I am a moron.
Also I don,t actually drive a car.
I said nothing about outlawing them,I just didn,t see the need to own them for self protection.
You also seem to have a lot of enthusiasm to burn, you should try wild boar hunting with my mate,no guns involved, he hunts them on foot with a knife.Now that takes courage and skill!
PS What exactely am I bluffing my way out of?
I have actually done that, just about a month and half ago, but we did have dogs (my buddy typically runs 3-5). I have to admit, I was quite nervous with the first catch. I was scared poopless when I was trying to get to the dogs that had one hemmed up in a thicket and I was crawling (on hands & knees) in with flashlight. Light went out just before one of the dogs ran into me. I think that I squealed louder than the pig...but what a rush. You are right about the skill part, the actual catch & kill (one man) isn't something that I have done to date. We have a lot of wild/feral hogs around here and any way a person can get rid of them other than poison is good. They are so destructive.Quote:
Originally Posted by AussiePostie
First of all, let's keep the discussion friendly ok? If you have to resort to namecalling you've lost the argument.
About hunting: I never did. Personally, I think sitting on a platform in a tree, taking potshots at passing animals is not hunting. It's just sitting on a platform, taking potshots at passing animals. Other than being able to hit the target, there is no skill or risk involved.
Hunting dangerous animals on foot with traditional weapons (board spear, bown and arrow, knife, ...) now that is something I have a lot of respect for, because it requires a lot of skill and courage.
I concur & DID edit post. It was uncalled for.Quote:
Originally Posted by shooter74743
As far as the hunting, I do bow hunt deer, but the rest is usually with a firearm. Hunting & the way a animal is harvested is like firearms...everyone has their own opinion of how a animal should be harvested. I mostly hunt with firearms...
I am a city boy and I've only been hunting a couple of times many years ago. To be honest I would have a hard time killing a deer or whatever. Bambi, y'know. :shrug: OTOH, I wouldn't hesitate to share some venison that you harvested or to buy a piece of meat at a supermarket. If a person likes to hunt and uses the catch for food for himself or others I think that is cool. If it was trophy hunting I would rather do that with a camera and leave the animal to live out their life.
Down under here in Australia, we had our last Prime Minister Howard to quote" legislate against a part of the population who are lawabiding and are not a problem to society for the good of society as a whole" Howards answer to Port Arthur. It is hard to argue against 36 dead, but if firearms were not so heavily regulated there may have been an armed citizen who could have sorted Martin Bryant out before the butchers bill got so high. Unfortunately here in Australia firearm ownership and use are a privilege not a right as in your country. Proper secure storage I do think is a good idea. We are only just once again gaining legal approval for self defence, which must seem ridiculous to you blokes!! We are as nearly as bad as the UK as far as political correctness goes.Quote:
Originally Posted by shooter74743
I hunt with a muzzle loader most of the time, and believe in unfettered fire arm ownership, but if you stuff up you take the consequences at law. Here in
Australia since the 1960 we have been allowing more and more govt interferance in all aspects of our lives. Shooters have really been hammered over the last 20 years. Don't finish up like us.:soapbox:
Cool. Do you use compound, recurve, or traditional barebow?Quote:
Originally Posted by shooter74743
And what type of arrowheads do you use?
I shot traditional barebow for a couple of years, and got pretty good at it. And nothing beats the satisfaction of beating the guy next to you who is using a compound with all bells and whistles :)
When I moved to where I live now, the range was too far away and I dropped out.
I use a PSE Diamondback compound, it's about 5-6 years old & what I would consider middle of the road on the bells and whistles. As far as being a great shot...not hardly. WOuldn't take much to outshoot me with a bow, that's why I typically just use Walmart carbon arrows and whatever broadheads are on sale at the time. Didn't even break it out this year...couldn't find someone to restring it & I'm kind of afraid to use it due to some chaffing on the string. I'd hate that thing to snap on a release & cut me (probably my face) open...I'll leave the SR's for that one... I really just need to get rid of it considering how little I shoot with it any more. Gonna stick with the guns ;-)