Hey, any linux users here? I'm kinda stoked. I finally got my wireless card working with fedora. :) Now I can completely disavow Windows :D
Printable View
Hey, any linux users here? I'm kinda stoked. I finally got my wireless card working with fedora. :) Now I can completely disavow Windows :D
Yeah, I use Linux at uni (as I mainly program in an extremely inefficient language called Matlab and windows just uses too much resources). I actually prefer it to windows although you might have a pretty bad time getting some programs to work properly on Linux. Im gonna get another PC and set it up at home as a linux only but I'm gonna put kubuntu on it rather than fedora.
I use Debian linux. Matlab eh? Max are you an engineer?
Mark.
Quote:
Originally Posted by max_incognito
I'm a mathematician, I use it [Matlab] mainly for neural networks and simulations applying chaos theory to real world data (like heart beats). I use Matlab as basically it gets complicated enough without having to think how to program it all in C++ too.
The setup we have at uni is debian, its pretty decent.
I used to use Matlab for signal processing, and communication systems during my undergraduate days... For solving general mathematic solutions to engineering problems I used Mathematica. Man, I miss those days!
Mark.
Quote:
Originally Posted by max_incognito
Are you an engineer then? I use mathematica occasionally, especially as it has a proper parallel processing capability rather than using the Matlab hack. I do generally prefer Matlab though, it makes the neural network implementation extremely simple
I am a electrical electronic engineer in the process of becoming a intellectual property attorney. Only one year to go! I used to love school, then I went to law school. I am about had it up to my ears with the socratic method... :)
Are you a student or a professor?
Quote:
Originally Posted by max_incognito
FUD - That is totally cool! I had a rough time getting my wireless up, took me about three days.
I have not used Red Hat, does it automate the installation of programs like Debian?
If I am not mistaken it uses a Gnome desktop, is this correct?
Mark.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FUD
red hat rocks in some areas, sucks in others. you can customise installation and then automate updates if you want. I do a "complete" install then use yum for updates and additional software. A lot of wireless cards are supported by standard and those that aren't usually are supported by ndiswrapper, but I've been trying to get the gnome internet configuration wizard to recognize my WPC54G so I don't have to run a script everytime I want to use wireless. I've been thinking of adding a debian install on the multi-boot just to compare. The thing I like about redhat is that it isn't always cutting edge in as much as they allow some of the riskier projects to be tried out by others before testing it in their config ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by mslovacek
FUD,
Just curious, the linux post started me to wonder. What is your profession? What made you pick linux over winblows?
Mark.
A profession? Ha!Quote:
Originally Posted by mslovacek
I'm professionally unemployed due to outsourcing ;).
Seriously, I do whatever it takes to pay the bills. I have 2 college degrees and 4 semester hours away from a third. I'll probably finish that one this summer. Though my "profession" is Computer Services and repair (networking, hardware, scripting, and even programming if I have enough time for the job). I've been trying to run my own business for a bit now.
Why I chose Linux:
I started in computers when Dos was the craze and I had to program everything in. there were no premade portable programs on the market. When Linux came out it sounded like an affordable alternative to the "power machines" (unix systems). The more I read about Linux, the more I realized that Microsoft was just reading linux code and modifying most of it just enough to legally claim they weren't sponging and selling and then calling it their own stuff. Unix has had 64 bit hardware/software systems for YEARS now. Windows is touting this as if it's a major new technology.
The Major decision maker for me was when I heard the story of a major insurance company in Akron, OH that had remodelled in the early 90s. Long story short, they were going through buyouts, changing owners, etc. During the confusion a room got boxed in and all its contents. 3 years later they were tracing cable so they could put their water/electric/phone/computer network systems on paper for record. they traced a line into this room everyone had forgotten about. Their LINUX EMAIL server had been running in that room without error and without flaw. It came back up after power outages, it ran steady, it never crashed.
Now consider this, every major application You typically get for windows at a high cost, you can get in almost all linux distributions absolutely free.
***warning. shameless plugging***
Are you a graphics designer? Love Photoshop? Hate the price? Linux has GIMP! does more, and it's free, standard in the linux install. Don't want to lose Your Instant messenger? GAIM is similar to trillian but in linux, it supports several major instant messengers including AIM, Yahoo, ICQ. Love your Microsoft office for some strange reason? OpenOffice.org Software Suite in Linux! It overpowers Microsoft office EASILY. and it's FREE! Need a SQL server/client system that rivals Microsoft and other expensive database systems? Linux MySql! Yep! it's FREE. Or maybe you just want to play games and browse the web? Linux has ports of MOST major games, including quake, doom, Duke nukem, and all the other popular games.
DVD Player/authoring? CD player/ripper? sound editing? Major programming software? pdf authoring? multiple graphics editors? picture management programs? Email? Web Browsers? MP3 Players/editors? All this and much much more absolutely FREE in LINUX
Want to run an OLD windows program (that won't run under windows xp?) WINE runs MANY windows programs, both new and old. The beauty of it? you DON'T have to have Windows installed on your machine to run the program! you can configure wine to remember which version of windows each program has to be "run" in.
These are just a very few reasons to become involved with linux. Is it perfect? no. It's made by humans after all. As much as I hate to admit it, I still don't see any machine rivalling the pre-intel Macs for graphics, animated/still/movies. You still have to be somewhat technically inclined, or have a technogeek friend for some of the linux stuff.
If, however, you're satisfied with programs that come standard with windows or standardised for windows at an extra cost, like a web browser, email office suite software, networking, instant messaging, etc. Then WHY pay for windows software when you can get everything in linux in a nice friendly graphical user interface that gives you similarities to your windoze comforts while giving really nice additions.
I have some friends here who are blind. They have to pay over $1500. for a windows screen reader and they each want their own computer. Every major upgrade requires them to come up with major cash. Most windows systems milk people right and left of their cash for their needs. "Speakup" in linux is absolutely free. I'm writing to a blind technical guru in New York who has come up with a customized version of Fedora Linux that works wonderfully with Speakup. He's working to find software speach synthesizers working on Speakup so my friends won't have to buy a hardware speach synthesizer. If we are able to get something going, you know how much it will cost my friends? zero.
If I can buy $200 to $300 worth of hardware and add linux and then have a computer that would cost over $1500 just for the tower in windows. I'd rather save my money. Linux isn't perfect. But I've learned that with a little patience I can have a much more stable system Than windows. Thus I've switched to Linux and I'm in the process of learning it.
My neighbor is 90 years old this month. when he was 83 I built his first pc. a few weeks ago he upgraded it himself. Now he's talking about switching to linux and learning linux.
Go figure ;).
Sorry for the lengthy post.
P.S. I'm I Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer and I'm switching to Linux :p
One more post. Sorry. Want to try linux but don't want to install it or change your current system? KNOPPIX runs from your CD and does not change anything on your computer.
FUD
FUD,
It's certainly no mystery that Linux is so popular... it's essentially free while Microsoft continues to raise the prices of their products. Linux, after all, is rooted in the concepts of UNIX (which pre-dated Windows by what-- a decade? ). However, UNIX wasn't very successful commercially (because of it's high cost) when it was owned by AT&T... ultimately, wasn't that why Linus Torvalds created Linux?
In all fairness, though, even with its high cost, Windows currently IS the industry standard, like it or not. It was probably before your time, but IBM used to rule the roost in a similar fashion... and they stayed on top for a long long time against fairly formidable competitors like Honeywell, Wang, Data General, Digital Equipment, etc. They did so because they had lots of money, lots of customers, were good at marketing -- not because they had the better products. And least we forget, if it were not for IBM's PC there probably wouldn't have been a Microsoft. Later, when they realized Microsoft was getting too powerful, IBM tried to counter with OS2. It was (IMHO) clearly a better Operating System, but by then Microsoft had built up so much inertia (and was holding so many users captive with proprietary functions) that the die was cast. Even Apple couldn't unseat them, and they, for all practical purposes, really invented "windows".
For those of us who still need (for whatever reason) to use Windows, but want to avoid the high cost of many of those programs you mentioned (eg, WORD, etc.), free versions of many/most of these programs are available for Windows, too.
I personally use the Windows version of GIMP, OpenOffice, etc. And I have refused to upgrade many of Microsoft's compilers to their latest versions since I have no need whatsoever for their "new features". Eventually Microsoft started using "incompatibility" as a leverage to force users to upgrade (as they did eg, with Access)... when they did this I simply elected to port my applications to utilize non-Microsoft products, many of which were free. Microsoft will eventually go the way of IBM... all companies that are the top dog in their industry are doomed fail. Why? Because every one of their competitors is working at defeating them, and the little guy is more nimble and can change directions to meet market needs for less cost.
Joe, you will also remember that OS/2 Warp was a bastardization of the Microsoft/IBM venture. After the fallout, IBM continued the development process and created Warp while Microsoft developed their own strain of "true" 32-bit OS code and developed Windows NT 3.1 (New Technology for all you young-uns ;) ) Since that time, (by the way OS/2 which was a great OS, flopped) M$ and their marketing giants have made a fortune touting the "new and improved" 32-bit operating structure. Just a little more history behind the M$ OS juggernaut that has the head of Bill Gates.
FUD, I am also an MCSE, but to be fair, I started long ago. Did you know that MCP IDs are sequential? Most of those still around today are 7 digits (1 million+). By the way, my MCP ID is SIX digits and begins with a 3 :D That's right, I was in the first 400,000 certified professional from MS. When I was an actively practicing MCSE, it actually MEANT something.
....and to stay on topic, I've been using Linux OSs since Slackware 2.1. I then moved to RedHat distributions and never really looked back. I've used RedHat 5.x to 9.x and now Fedora since RedHat went enterprise and started charging for the "packaging". I love it and can't get enough!
Sorry for the long post, but I had to do SOMETHING special for my 100th post and Honemeister :ziplip: title....
It's estimated that 90% of the computers in the world are running one form of windows or another. There's nothing "fair" about it ;).Quote:
Originally Posted by azjoe
Bottom line is, until linux or someone else comes up with a system that's as user friendly as windows and idiot safe as windows, windows will continue to dominate.
The trouble with linux is many of the developers are still enjoying the "linux is a technogeek's OS" mentality. There are many that are coming around though and are, like you said, starting to eye the evil giant and are becoming more willing to topple it.
After all, as you said Windows IS rooted in unix. Even today I see many things that have already been implimented in unix/linux that are just starting to come out in Windows. I.E. it appears very strongly that windows is sponging and selling ;).
Oh well. such is life.
Yea that's another thing that burns my butt, I'm not in the first half million I started right after the first million. I studied my brains out for weeks and then went and took all my tests at once. When I got done some kid says "did you use braindumps"? "Brain what?" I ask. then he shows me a website with over 80% of ALL the test questions I just took and ALL of them answered correctly (I know. I aced all but the networking, which I only missed one on).Quote:
Originally Posted by dawill
I had just spent several thousand dollars on training that essentially was worthless, I realized at that point. Talk about getting hit in the stomach. Tha'ts one thing I will say for cisco, It's not so easy to study "test questions" and pass the exam with them. Even the Novell exams were tougher than the MCSE. Microsoft still hasn't done what's necessary to make their certification worthwhile. I had one guy turn my bid down and tell me he wouldn't talk to me about work for his company until I upgraded my MCSE to 2003. I asked him how many MCSE's he had working for him that were worth the money. He just stared at me and said he was an mcse. I asked him to explain the OSI model to me and relate the TCP/IP stack to it. He couldn't even summarize how tcp/ip works. Then I asked him to explain how IP addresses work. He couldn't do that (think zipcodes class, think zipcodes and mailing addresses :p ). I asked him how much of the MCSE training he could honestly say he uses. he admitted he didn't take the training, only the tests.
Sorry for the rant. I gotta quit. I'm going to get ulcers if I don't give up this distain for microsoft. :nono:
Glen F.
LOL, I used to be an MCT and I trained a LOT of the boneheads out there so I know exactly what you mean. I used to tell my students that what I was teaching them was only a small percentage of what they would truly need to know. I also told them that as a field engineer (where I got my start and continue to this day), that they have to strive to be the person I want to work with when there's a problem at 3AM the day before a major launch or upgrade. That's the place you want to be, otherwise, you're just as disposable as any other 7 digit MSCmE
I got a degree in Maths with Computer Science and I am not gonna say what I think of microsoft.
Not trying to hijack the thread or anything, just curious if any folks are using any of the *BSD flavors here.
I first installed Slackware Linux back in 1994. I've played with SuSE, RedHat and Mandrake since then. One of my former employers used FreeBSD for our DNS servers. They were bulletproof -- uptime was close to 2 years until the UPS for the datacenter was interrupted. Let me tell you, when the uninterruptible power supply (generator, battery strings) gets interrupted it's an ugly day. The whole datacenter, a constant near deafening whirring of fans fell totally silent... well, it's just eerie. I haven't played with any of the *nix distros the past few years, there just isn't enough time in the day to have playtime for that anymore.
I will say that Linux has come a *long* way from back in '94. Xfree86 was it, and that was if it worked with your graphics card. Now there's Gnome & KDE, the help files are a lot better. I can't tell you how many hours I spent reading FAQs & HOWTO documents, but in the end it was well worth the time invested. I love the way you can customize the kernel, even moreso now with kernel modules. You'll never see a Micro$haft box do that. I'm pleased to see the market penetration, and hopefully more commercial apps in the future.
With respect to certifications: there are a lot of MCSE's out there -- Minesweeper Consultants and Solitare Experts. I've met a few who were exceedingly sharp, and I've met the other end of the spectrum who didn't have a clue about IP & the OSI model. Most certifications seem to be in high demand initially, and the pay is often more but as the market becomes saturdated does it make any appreciable difference? Cisco used to have only the CCIE (top level) certification. Once they figured out there was big money, now there's CCNA, CCNP, etc. etc. Lots of paper tigers out there.
I worked on a project where a company that was bought out used freebsd. I didn't get to mess with it more than necessary to port the data out using company software tools but it reminded me a lot of the linux/unix architecture when I booted them up.Quote:
Originally Posted by sensei_kyle
You're the first person I've actually heard that had more than just a passing acquaintance with it. I've always assumed that it wasn't up to the portability and reliability that keeps the linux flavors going.
Quote:
Originally Posted by max_incognito
Being gentlemanly around Microsoft only gets you bankrupt ;)
Way before Linux, there was Minix. This was a home grown OS built on x86 machines that was used as a teaching tool when the old 386 machines started to support non-segmented memory. I had to use this in my MS degree program and it was pretty cool for it's day - probably the late '80s or so. Booted off a floopy, had it's own compiler and everything. I think we had to write device drivers or some such nonsense in C. It used the standard Unix APIs way before the term POSIX appeared. That was when computers were fun. Now it's just pain and suffering watching our knowledge and experience just "drift" overseas along with the jobs.
For this Linux history buffs, I think Linus mentions Minix in one of his first "comments" upon starting the Linux adventure.
By the way, I moved to Apple. It's based upon FreeBSD and the Mach kernel - I feel more comfortable with the Unix world than dealing with the dark arts of M$.
Now, back to straights...
Actually Minix was one design so it could legally sell.Quote:
Originally Posted by bach9135
Wikipedia:
"Minix is one of a number of "Unix-like" operating systems that includes Idris, Coherent and Uniflex. Some of these were written because AT&Ts initial licensing of Unix precluded it being sold to organisations for commercial use. The "Unix-like" OSs were written from scratch without any AT&T code."
For whats it's worth I've been a linux user and abuser for about 5-6 yrs now, starting with dead cat moving to SuSE and then onto Debian which is what I run on most of my pc's . I also have a Mandriva machine a Mandrake machine and also a Slackware box just for fun .. Played with Ubuntu but prefer Debian .. sadly my Risc6000 machines run Aix ( unix ) they're too old to get linux installed to a state where it would be useful .
Just in case anyone cares.. This site runs on Linux :)..
I personally use Ubuntu on two machines.. One notebook and one server... I have the wife running Ubuntu.. And if she doesn't bitch about it, it's good enough for the average user.. :)
I still have MickeySoft for those times when I have to run Windoze software... But it's getting rarer and rarer...
I still haven't found a compiler for C++ that runs on Linux that I like.. But I'm still looking..
Since we have all the hardcore geeks in here... I'm in need of some HTML/Graphics help if anyone is interested in a new project... There will be money involved.. I'm fine with all the coding/backend/database work.. But I'm not an artist..
Oh, all you Math people.. Someone come and help me with Discrete Math.. :)
I've dabbled a bit with Linux over the years. I started with Yggdrasil's distribution when the Linux kernel went 1.0. I never did get X working on my $3000 Gateway 486 (with 16M memory amd a 340M HDD!). I went through a couple of Redhat distributions over the years, but always went back to MS for the games and multimedia. These days, I have a Mac and feel like I'm getting the best of all the OS worlds.
BTW, this all brings some other fun memories to light like BeOS, the BBS listing from the back of Computer Shopper, and the dead tree version of the Walnut Creek CD catalog that always seemed to be sitting on top of my toilet :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by dwessell
I think Gawker is the person to ask. He helped Bill with a video embedding issue he had a while back. I'd say he's probably your best shot to start at least.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dwessell
How does Ubuntu compare to red hat?
Also, what on earth would you need from windoze that you cant get running in wine? Everything I need/want that was microsoft has a version that works just as well in linux outside of 2 utilities. I haven't found a text editor like textpad (which works fine under wine) and I have QVWIN version 4 on wine. I have really good sound editing software, dvd editing software, picture editing software, office suite software, and much more under linux. I haven't compared the GCC compilers to windows versions but hey, if you don't like what it does, add the libraries to suit yer needs right? plus you can pull libraries from one compiler and add them to another to suit your needs.
Oh, graphics design. what software you want it done in and what you want done? I used to do graphics design for an automated process company, designing the gui systems for customers systems so I think I'm pretty good with it. Send me an email if you want the help.
Glen F
I used Red Hat a few years ago.. The Shrike release if I remember (Also a character from my favourite set of books)... I didn't dig it very much.. Although I hear it runs great on servers...
I don't want to spend more then a day, mabye two setting up an OS to run.. That's why I like Ubuntu.. On two laptops I only had to work on configuring a NIC.. And on a desktop, I had to sweat on ATI drivers, and a sound card.. Over all no more then a few hours work for all of the comptuers in the house (3).
As soon as I find a decent c++ compiler for Linux, I think I'll be all set.. Well, unless I have to code in Assembly (GOD PLEASE NO MORE!!)..
dw