Full Double Hollow dressed in unobtainium :<0)

So I had this razor for a looong time. You know how it is when you see a deal on the bay and you know you can just fix that thing right up and get rich quick.

Piece of cake right ?

Attachment 228412

The makers mark is gone with the tang cover of course so getting rich is out of the question but still I knew with the right material this thing could be sought after again. At least pleasing to the eye. I thought about horn, and bone, and acrylic but nothing I thought of made me want to pull it out of the pile and dress it up. So a couple of weeks ago I was shopping around for something totally unrelated and I see this material I had heard about but never seen used before. Here it was in almost scale thickness and on the clearance page. Now the sticker price would make a smart man click away without thinking twice but before I knew it, I got a confirmation e-mail and it was on it's way. Now I had forgot about it by the time it arrived and so this big box that felt like it had nothing in it had me stumped.
Well when I opened it I went right to town on this stuff. Got play with it and see if what I read is all true. Can't be because this stuff is only 0.050 thick. Hacksaw bounced right off it. Sawsall bi metal blade made it shake like a dog poopin' a peach pit, until the teeth rounded over. Hmmmmmm. Set it down and do some more reading, which I did without finding anything promising to try.

The title is a little misleading because it's not THAT hard to find. I think it should actually be called something like Unworkablulium or Don'teventrytanium.

Well today my buddy Wolfpack shows up and he wants to make some scales.

So we get him set up and goes at it.

Attachment 228413

Looks like fun so I grab the Unubtainium bound determined to do something with it.
I have been making some RSOs with a 4 1/2" grinder doing the cutting so I got the idea of using my rotary tool with a small fiber wheel on this stuff. Well it worked. Not the fastest way but it was cutting this stuff.


Now I learned a few things right off the bat.
1. The sparks are hot. I mean real hot, white hot. The keep burning until the flying material is all burnt up. Which means if they land on something they don't just burn they burn through.
2. Your going to go through a lot of fiber wheels to get where your going. 1 six inch cut used 2 wheels. I decided to cut the other scale the same and try some grinding at this point.
3. This stuff will fool you. I already mentioned the white hot sparks but the sheet itself really fooled me. Apparently it does not conduct heat that well. I other words you can hold it close to where your cutting it and not feel the sheet getting warm. Long after you think it's cooled it's NOT. The little burn mark on my pinky is from touching the slot I cut which normally should have been maybe to hot to hold for any length of time but not burning hot still.

Attachment 228414

2 more Dremmel wheels and I got another scale cut out. I am running out of wheels and I still have to cut out the tang cover pieces. So out comes the big gun. I put a thin 4" fiber wheel on my Hilti grinder and cut a square, then the 2 smaller pieces to within a 1/2" of the lines in the worst spots. Guess I will grind them to shape.

Drilling holes was uneventful except it went slow and took a lot of WD-40 to get through.
The next task was getting these rectangles attached to the tang so I could grind them in to match. My good friend Tom (sharptonn) had sent me some pin material for covered tangs but it was small enough I could almost get 2 in the same hole. Toothpicks did the trick for awhile but when I got closer guess what, smoked em'. SO I did the unthinkable to the unubtainium and the tang. I bolted and clamped them together and drilled the cover pins out to 1/16 ". Yes, I got real lucky and that was also uneventful.
I countersunk the cover pieces and pinned with brass rod to the tang and went to town on the 2 X 72. Here is where I learned another thing. You need good belts to grind this stuff. If you use an inexpensive belt you will get sparks for about 3 seconds. Nice white sparks and they will disappear as fast as they showed up. When you shut down the belt grinder to see what's up you will eventually notice all the grit is gone off your belt :<0) Yup ! This stuff is brutal. And if your going to be grinding a lot of it you better have some good safety glass and I would suggest something polarized. This white spark is almost as bright as welding arc. No kidding.

Attachment 228408

The pic above shows the counter sink and pin. After this I tapered the covers while they are on the tang. I am shooting for full shape and then I am going to have to drill that out again to put a finish on those covers.

Here it is test pinned. It got late so I polished 1 scales threw the thing together just to see what I have to do next. The wedge has been a real PITA so far and why I think using the same material is good , I do not know. I started this thinking 3 pin but I am trying to get away from that now. The wedge is the key. I do not want the cover rubbing on the scale even a little or it will ruin the finish of both.

3 pics for your viewing of my progress and to see some of it in different stages of work. The back side scale is pure raw as it comes Unubtainium :<0)

The balance point is back some. This little anvil has a seam it is sitting on and it was rocking back and forth when I took this pic. I don't think it's going to be that noticeable in the hand though. Taking that stainless steel screw and washers out and finishing the taper on the wedge will change that some I am sure. It will be interesting to see how much.




The edges of this material de burr with the buffer and white polishing compound believe it or not. And what ever you do don't even think greaseless compound. So far black polishing compound on a sisal wheel is about as course as you want to go. Sanding had some surprises too but some of that may be from the fact I had nothing to eat or drink all day (after coffee with Mike) and I will have to play with that more to confirm what I think I saw. The experimenting with the finish on this stuff will need some explaining and pics if I can get them to show what happens.

Now I know some may be thinking " why would he put metal on a covered tang ??? " This material has a secret property that will change all that soon enough. I will do a video on that process. It's going to be fun and who knows how it will turn out?

Thanks for looking , I'll be Back.

Great job, with soul !!!

Pups let me in on the secret properties..... can't wait to see it!

GREAT job on the scales. This stuff looks like a bear to work with though!

I have been eyeballing some titanium for liners on scales and have bee hesitant about what thickness would be ideal, so at 0.050 does it easily flex or would you recommend it to be a tad thinner for a liner?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 10Pups

...snip...
Now I know some may be thinking " why would he put metal on a covered tang ??? " This material has a secret property that will change all that soon enough. I will do a video on that process. It's going to be fun and who knows how it will turn out?
Thanks for looking , I'll be Back.

---

I await your additional info. Titanium did you say?? Oooh pretty!
~Richard

I can't believe how much progress you've made Pups...when I left yesterday you had just finished the rough cut on the one scale. I won't give away the "secret"...

Great job my friend!

Makes me think of some heat treated aluminum sheets... Might not be as expensive, and if done right can be purdy darn tough...

I refuse to believe that the scales will not be lit up with color...somehow.

Awesome job on those scales and that razor!
Thank you showing the progress and the "heads up" on that material too......
The unknown and the gamble paid of using that material for those scales.
Magnificent job!

As the old saying goes "Nothing ventured, nothing gained."

looking good Pups great read along
look forward to the rest of this series.

is it some sort of a Damascus or Mokume-gane, made from titanium mixed with spent fuel rods from a certain Flux Capacitor, forged with the hell fires in the core of Orodruin???
just a guess?

I was up 'till 1:30 last night finishing this post and got up for work 2 hours later . That's how I got so far along Mike :<0) I started working it and couldn't put it down. I don't know if it was the learning or the beauty of the material. I love metal and never had a chance to play with Titanium before.

Off hand Shaun I don't know if .100 would bend any less than .050. I would guess, not much.

I was trying to remember to take pics during all this but I swear I just couldn't think of anything but " what next. try this , do that and see.

I did have the thought several times that I would be doing you guys a better service if I learned more about it before I started babbling on with each new surprise. What I will probably do is cut some pieces with the video running and show you some things I did discover. I had read a lot about this stuff while waiting for it to arrive and more after I got it. For all intents and purposes most of what I read was correct but the thickness I used and some of the tools I tried I hadn't seen in my quest for knowledge. What I watched and read was all bigger material and machine work. Which would be a lot easier and costly for sure. For our use of course there will be some experimenting. Unless you have a liquid cooling system set up for your Dremmel :<0)

Nap time, but I hope I have the energy to play some more tonight. I have to at least clean up my mess from yesterday so I will be very near the temptation.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Substance

looking good Pups great read along
look forward to the rest of this series.

is it some sort of a Damascus or Mokume-gane, made from titanium mixed with spent fuel rods from a certain Flux Capacitor, forged with the hell fires in the core of Orodruin???
just a guess?

---

No but the same guy that makes that is selling it :<0) He calls this stuff METI-TI-.050 6al-4v So far it's not glowing in the dark but if I find a way to make it do that I will send it ALL to you :<0)

10Pups it looks awesome! I need to get up there and spend a couple hours with you guys again. I learned a lot.

Somebody was hinting at a meet not long ago :<0) Soon I thought :shrug:

Nice work! Good job sticking with it, I might have given up after rounding off some teeth:)

Lol, 6al-4v Ti is pretty tough, but it sounds like you're making the job even harder on yourself by not slowing your tools down a bit. The belt speeds for sanders and RPM for drills as well as reciprocating speeds for saws all need to be dropped a fair bit or you will definitely destroy your cutting edges and abrasives. It is very tough stuff to work if you don't have variable speeds.

Looking good.
It can be anodized too if you feel like it. The color choices are plenty.
For me the dream scales would be made from Timascus, but that stuff is crazy expensive.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by eKretz

Lol, 6al-4v Ti is pretty tough, but it sounds like you're making the job even harder on yourself by not slowing your tools down a bit. The belt speeds for sanders and RPM for drills as well as reciprocating speeds for saws all need to be dropped a fair bit or you will definitely destroy your cutting edges and abrasives. It is very tough stuff to work if you don't have variable speeds.

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All this I have found out :<0) The only thing I have to cut it with is fiber discs for Dremmel and a 4 1/2 " grinder. For drilling I have the drill press set on the lowest it will go and use titanium drill bits.( No problem there) And yes the stuff is hard on grinder belts. Another thing I learned is the sparks are hotter than 'H" and will ignite any ordinary waste left under your grinder. If you use a dust collector on your grinder make sure you clean it before grinding too much Ti or you will have a fire. I am hoping to show some of this in a vid soon. Just been sick as a dog the last couple weeks and feeling about as strong as a 6 year old school girl.
Lots of advice out there on saw blades but like you say , from what I read, it's all about slow and push it through.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mainaman

Looking good.
It can be anodized too if you feel like it. The color choices are plenty.
For me the dream scales would be made from Timascus, but that stuff is crazy expensive.

---

Yes heating titanium can be fun and dangerous. Titanium's melting point is 3,034°F (1,668°C) BUT at that temp it does not melt it burns unless there is no oxygen or nitrogen in the atmosphere. Maybe why Timascus is so expensive and hard to get. I played with the torch method some but I am not crazy about the results. There is no color chart for titanium relative to temperature. At least I have yet to find one. I am going to color these pieces in the oven and see if I can get a nice blue. I did see a partial picture of a chart at a place that does anodizing and may get the blue I want at around 1200°F. More experiments to come as soon as I get time.

Sanding/polishing is a chore in itself. The material I got has a pattern of little scratch marks on the surface and I played with greaseless some and polishing compounds on the buffers. I still have some scratch lines to take out that normally would have been gone on any other metal I have used.

1 more little fact... It is non magnetic.

I will try to get back to working with it soon and document things on video as I progress.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 10Pups

Yes heating titanium can be fun and dangerous. Titanium's melting point is 3,034°F (1,668°C) BUT at that temp it does not melt it burns unless there is no oxygen or nitrogen in the atmosphere. Maybe why Timascus is so expensive and hard to get. I played with the torch method some but I am not crazy about the results. There is no color chart for titanium relative to temperature. At least I have yet to find one. I am going to color these pieces in the oven and see if I can get a nice blue. I did see a partial picture of a chart at a place that does anodizing and may get the blue I want at around 1200°F. More experiments to come as soon as I get time.

Sanding/polishing is a chore in itself. The material I got has a pattern of little scratch marks on the surface and I played with greaseless some and polishing compounds on the buffers. I still have some scratch lines to take out that normally would have been gone on any other metal I have used.

1 more little fact... It is non magnetic.

I will try to get back to working with it soon and document things on video as I progress.

---

Blue, is not hard to get IME, an oven will work fine. I have done some on the stove top on high and a butane torch as a second source of heat. Another option is electro anodizing where all kinds of colors are possible. Blue is in the 25V range and that can be achieved with several batteries in parallel, the rest is very easy to do.
If you like shoot me a PM I have a set up for anodizing and can help you.

Wellll I started experimenting today with anodizing titanium. I watched all the tubes on both heat and electro and decided doing it my oven could wait. There is no scale for what temp makes what color with the heat method and I was looking for a blue. The oven seemed like an experiment in itself.
First I had to get a mirror polish so I went back to the belt sander and dressed up the edges and proceeded to go my usual route to mirror. 400g belt, to 600g belt to 800g belt. Then I go to compounds starting with black on sisal which does a great job on razor blades after grease-less , by the way. The green , white and blue to get everything perfect. Okay so first thing I noticed is flaws in the finish of titanium are very hard to see. Compounds or finger prints or the swipe of a towel leaves marks the look exactly like old grit scratches. In the end I called my finish "good enough" which is not my usual "perfect". I spent 4 times as long on these knowing full well titanium is abrasive resistant. It's one of it's better qualities. I had had enough, which goes against my patient nature but ,what can I say.

I hooked up 3 9v batteries in sequence (27v)
Attachment 232194

Used a piece of tool steel for the negative piece that goes in the jar. It was as long as the scales and just as wide so I figured that would do it. About 2 1/2 tablespoons (measured Rachel Ray style) of TSP for the electrolyte.

Attachment 232195

Now the test pieces were not clean or sanded or anything but I saw what I wanted to see. Purple comes quick with 3 batteries and dark blue with time. With 4 (36v) I got a nice light blue (less purple hue) better....quick. I did the square second piece to make sure I had it right.
The first was anodize over anodize and so that left a doubt.

Attachment 232197

So I made a little hanger out of copper wire to hold everything in the jar at once. My thinking was they would all come out the same that way. I left the scales together at the wedge end. I made sure everything was clean by wiping it down with denatured alcohol and dropped it all in. I hooked up the positive lead and watch the bubbles start coming up. Most of these were from the negative bar and the stainless steel screw I used to test pin the scales together at the wedge end. After what seemed like forever (after watching the you tubes) I pulled out the pieces to see not much color and mostly purple around the edges. I added another battery to the power supply and let things sit longer. Still not much color. 5th battery and walked away for a smoke and when I came back I got the purple and gold you see on the 3 pieces. The show side of course had some areas that looked like they were grey and not anodized. DANG. I took some Maas and wiped it down and a lot of the color disappeared. Hmmm not very good as far a longevity goes. I took it to the buffer and then hung it by some wire and went at it with a torch a couple of times.

This pic shows the final. Sort of. It does have a light blue hue to the whole piece with the spots showing much better.
Attachment 232198

This was the first torch experiment.
Attachment 232199
I loved the blue part that has the waves to it but good luck duplicating it. Maybe after doing a 100 scales I could get it down. After this first set I am not to anxious to get to the next set :<0)
More experiments to come until I am satisfied with the finish. May go to a satin finish and then color. Still haunted by the not so great mirror finish.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 10Pups

Wellll I started experimenting today with anodizing titanium. I watched all the tubes on both heat and electro and decided doing it my oven could wait. There is no scale for what temp makes what color with the heat method and I was looking for a blue. The oven seemed like an experiment in itself.
First I had to get a mirror polish so I went back to the belt sander and dressed up the edges and proceeded to go my usual route to mirror. 400g belt, to 600g belt to 800g belt. Then I go to compounds starting with black on sisal which does a great job on razor blades after grease-less , by the way. The green , white and blue to get everything perfect. Okay so first thing I noticed is flaws in the finish of titanium are very hard to see. Compounds or finger prints or the swipe of a towel leaves marks the look exactly like old grit scratches. In the end I called my finish "good enough" which is not my usual "perfect". I spent 4 times as long on these knowing full well titanium is abrasive resistant. It's one of it's better qualities. I had had enough, which goes against my patient nature but ,what can I say.

I hooked up 3 9v batteries in sequence (27v)
Attachment 232194

Used a piece of tool steel for the negative piece that goes in the jar. It was as long as the scales and just as wide so I figured that would do it. About 2 1/2 tablespoons (measured Rachel Ray style) of TSP for the electrolyte.

Attachment 232195

Now the test pieces were not clean or sanded or anything but I saw what I wanted to see. Purple comes quick with 3 batteries and dark blue with time. With 4 (36v) I got a nice light blue (less purple hue) better....quick. I did the square second piece to make sure I had it right.
The first was anodize over anodize and so that left a doubt.

Attachment 232197

So I made a little hanger out of copper wire to hold everything in the jar at once. My thinking was they would all come out the same that way. I left the scales together at the wedge end. I made sure everything was clean by wiping it down with denatured alcohol and dropped it all in. I hooked up the positive lead and watch the bubbles start coming up. Most of these were from the negative bar and the stainless steel screw I used to test pin the scales together at the wedge end. After what seemed like forever (after watching the you tubes) I pulled out the pieces to see not much color and mostly purple around the edges. I added another battery to the power supply and let things sit longer. Still not much color. 5th battery and walked away for a smoke and when I came back I got the purple and gold you see on the 3 pieces. The show side of course had some areas that looked like they were grey and not anodized. DANG. I took some Maas and wiped it down and a lot of the color disappeared. Hmmm not very good as far a longevity goes. I took it to the buffer and then hung it by some wire and went at it with a torch a couple of times.

This pic shows the final. Sort of. It does have a light blue hue to the whole piece with the spots showing much better.
Attachment 232198

This was the first torch experiment.
Attachment 232199
I loved the blue part that has the waves to it but good luck duplicating it. Maybe after doing a 100 scales I could get it down. After this first set I am not to anxious to get to the next set :<0)
More experiments to come until I am satisfied with the finish. May go to a satin finish and then color. Still haunted by the not so great mirror finish.

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As I said in my PM , use a Ti wire, and make sure the scales are very clean. Your cathode may be good size but it may need to be bigger, you'll find out on your next run.

From another solar system but here are some guys that do some incredible things with anodizing titanium: Firefly Bicycles

Quote:

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Originally Posted by WW243

From another solar system but here are some guys that do some incredible things with anodizing titanium: Firefly Bicycles

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Very cool bikes !
I haven't done any TIG welding in a long time. Way long time. I used to weld .025 SS to .005 inconel. encapsulating rotors and stators for pumps used on ships carrying liquid gases like oxygen, nitrogen, ammonia, etc.

http://straightrazorpalace.com/attac...0-100_9688.jpg

Thinking you should just pin that up! I think it is cool! :cool:

I would have Tom but the show side had some major flaws. I don't know why but big grey spots like contamination of some kind. I cleaned the heck out of everything too. When I tried the flame method I started with polished piece and little spots showed up on it twice in different places. It's very hard to get pics of this stuff as the direction of light changes everything.
The burnt purple was looking cool and as you can see it looks kinda gold in different shades of light. Fun stuff :<0|

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mainaman

As I said in my PM , use a Ti wire, and make sure the scales are very clean. Your cathode may be good size but it may need to be bigger, you'll find out on your next run.

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I'll double down on this, your cathode needs to be at absolute minimum the same size as the piece you're working on, so if it was the size of one scale (if I read it correctly) and you put both in. Then its probably about 3 times too small. Interested to see your further experiments though. Another note though, titanium is (relatively) easily cut with a fine tooth hacksaw blade, it's much easier than cut off wheels, and as you've discover, any moderate to high speed saw will destroy itself.

I am searching out some titanium wire for the next run for sure. Got a list going for other stuff too. Maybe do a vid next time. Like I said I just took a shot this time to see what I could get away with. Too lazy to go to the store and my storage building for better set up. The only thing I can't seem to improve on will be the power set up. I just don't have anything DC besides batteries.
Do appreciate the help here. Watched tons of vids of guys with nice DC converters and set ups but I am not going into the anodizing business. I found the 4 1/2" grinder cuts my shapes good enough for a 2x72 50 grit belt to finish the shaping easy enough. And once agian I don't think I am going to be using titanium much right away. Having fun though. Love doing something different.

Here's some ideas for sourcing parts. You could look into scavenging parts from heat sources (ie space heaters/hot plates). Some of the simpler ones just convert DC current to a wire/rod to heat it up. They usually have the added benefit of a dial, which may/may not control the heat with current/voltage control depending on the construction. Secondly, Ti wire is getting popular in the ecig industry, many places are starting to carry 22g to 32g wire. Whether it is the proper wire for you set-up....:shrug:

Some plating may be done with a wall plug in charger. Up to a half AMP or so.
A relatively modern Electric Train Transformer with a DC output or an old one with a rectifier added into the line would be best. A cheap Voltmeter attached could check the voltage.
~ Richard

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Geezer

Some plating may be done with a wall plug in charger. Up to a half AMP or so.
A relatively modern Electric Train Transformer with a DC output or an old one with a rectifier added into the line would be best. A cheap Voltmeter attached could check the voltage.
~ Richard

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I completely forgot about those! I think my new cell phone uses a 2 amp. I do believe the newest USB's can handle 3 amps, Apple's new laptops use them for charging I think. Probably safer than my suggestions.... Might be able to cut a usb cable to connect your leads?

I picked up some titanium wire at the welding shop today. The guy said he didn't have any but after some chit chat and he found out I wasn't using it to weld he walked in the back and came out with a 3' stick of C.P Ti AMS4951. He said it was from an open package and that made it worthless to weld with. Seems it has a flux coating on it I will have to sand off. At least I got 1 more piece of the puzzle together.

I am going to give the batteries another try simply because me and electricity usually result in lighting when we get to experimenting. I do have a box full of wall chargers with different voltage so I may just give it a shot if they aren't to hard to dig out of storage. Some for dart boards, cell phones ,old cordless phones. Don't ask me why I save them. May have paid off this time.

Thanks for the ideas :<0)

Truly incredible 10 pups! You sir are a mad scientist. In a good way.Lol.:chapeau