Creating Patina

Hi, I've been interested in old razors with nice patina lately; and shaving with them essentially 'as is' after honing; as much as possible (i.e. leaving them as original as possible). I haven't actually started yet (in the process of buying some patinatious razors (nice made up word, there)).

Ages ago I read somewhere a thread about creating 'patina'. I also around the same time read a thread where someone 'suspected' that Aloe Vera pre shave oil or cream stained his razor. I said at the time that I'd do a little experiment, to see if Aloe Vera could be used to introduce 'patina' to make a razor look old. I said I think it'd be cool to be able to use a natural product (I can't remember what could also be used). That was weeks ago. I did a small experiment last night where I smeared Aloe Vera 'juice' straight from a plant I have onto my De Pews razor. The result is below.

Basically, it created a brown stain. The razor was clean, though I always wipe them with Eucalyptus oil before putting them away. This oil is VERY light. I left the razor on my desk in my bedroom overnight. It gets cold in there at this time of the year and a little damp. The picture is the razor when I got up at 06:30. It took quite a bit of rubbing to remove it this evening, using Eucalyptus oil, a rag previously used with 'Brasso' (a metal polish), i.e. impregnated with Brasso years ago, and Turpentine.


So, what I learnt was:
* If you're using actual Aloe Vera as a pre shave oil it MAY not be a good idea and it'll be important to clean your razor, and
* I guess it COULD be used to 'introduce patination' esp with repeated applications, of via a dropper or toothpick, etc
* The colour is definitely brown. I myself would like a more grey-ish colour if I did want to make a razor look old.

PS, this post fits in two places, I think, here and the pre-shave section, so I'll put it in both locs if that's OK. Also, if anyone knows where those other threads were (about aloe vera staining a razor and introducing patination) it would be good linked to here, I guess.

Carl

Attachment 101982

On chefknivestogo.com they have a vid where he "forces" a patina using yellow mustard.

Michael

The razor in the pic below was done using warm vinegar, I quite like the colour it gives.
Ferric Chloride is another good method. Here is one thread on the subject
http://straightrazorpalace.com/works...ed-patina.html
If you type forced patina into the search button you'll get a heap of threads to look through.
G.

Edit: Here's another interesting one http://straightrazorpalace.com/works...ing-steel.html
Attachment 101986

Not really relevant to the original thread but many of the Ebay razors from Eastern Europe appear to heve been dipped in something that results in an overall dark grey coating - I suspect it's to disguise pitting and rust. Personally, I wouldn't touch one with a barge pole.

Lemon juice is quite often used to force patination as well.

Thanks for all the input. I may try some of the ideas on the De Pews. Not as nice as 'real' patina, of course, but nice nevertheless...

Try hot, white vinegar. I believe that's what Charlie uses to colour his razors. That's also what EPD used to colour the one he made for me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Maxi

Try hot, white vinegar. I believe that's what Charlie uses to colour his razors. That's also what EPD used to colour the one he made for me.

---

So...white vinegar in the microwave for a minute, soak the blade for 20 minutes? What's the process? Sounds interesting and I've got a few blades to test...

I have had luck using 1/2" of vinegar in a 3"x8" ish tupperware, microwave for 30 seconds then soak for 30-60 seconds per side. Repeat until you have the desired colour.

Its real important that you clean with acetone, and wear rubber gloves. Also wear glasses and maybe a respirator, microwaved vinegar has a violent ammonia stink.

I saw in Charlie's video he uses steel wool between dips, I never tried it but im sure it would help even out the finish.

Here is his video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DRtEPDzCa2A

Well, gave it a whirl this morning. I'm sure lots of guys are much more skilled than I at this sort of thing but I like the result. I got a few cups of vinegar, probably about 1/2 a cup of lemon juice (I didn't measure anything, unfortunately) threw the razor in the bowl for a bit, realised I was supposed to be using warm vinegar, took the razor out, warmed up the vinegar, then left it for a few hours.

I liked the look after maybe an hour; and I'm not sure it actually changed much after that.

I did note the return of some brown rust where it used to be. I liked the fact that all of the blade was blacker, and decided to re-hone it, using the now blackened edge like one uses a Texta (magic marker) on the edge when honing a razor. It really helped. I used only the Shapton 16k, but needed to do some circles on the toe to even it out. The blackened edge was really helpful. I didn't count the laps, just kept going until the edge was evenly bright and shiny.

I do like the result, it basically accentuated the patina that was already there and darkened the rest of the razor.

I'm going to shave with it tonight, with the newly refreshed edge.

The last photo is a 'before' photo..

Attachment 102352Attachment 102350Attachment 102353Attachment 102354Attachment 102355

OH gosh do not rush the process....
Just shave with it for a month and wipe it
dry with tissue each time....

For carbon steel kitchen knives I have been known to slice lemon,
or apple as thin as possible. Wipe it dry with tissue, rinse after
a moment under very hot tape water, make one more slice... Since I get 50+ slices out
of a lemon the process takes a bit of time for the rinse and dry per slice...
The acid starts oxidation (rusting) and by doing it a little by the steel develops a thin oxide layer and
no longer imparts that 'iron' flavor to some things. I only have one carbon steel kitchen
knife anymore but even stainless has a moment after polishing where
it can smell/ taste like iron so I also wipe and rub with a little bit of something
slightly acid (vinegar, fruit, onion.... gets sacrificed).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by niftyshaving

...OH gosh do not rush the process...

---

I always rush every process, and I always overdo everything, which can make me rather manic. If I were to do this again I may either try and protect the edge of use an applicator. Has anyone noticed if the process F's up the edge, or is it just me? It seems to me it's logical that it would F up the edge...

With you on this one Carl - a year or two ago I was all about scouring off every last remnant of pitting, patina and rust in order to blind passing airplanes with my shiny shiny instruments - nowadays I much prefer a bit of history to show (though I'll happily do the sandy thing if there's active rust that needs terminating).

Carl,

I was using a dietary aloe vera gel. I am doing a little experiment with it too. I just dumped some over a blade I do not use. I also mix tea tree oil and aloe gel so it could have been the EO.

Attachment 102795

Attachment 102796

update...So after 30 minutes the blade turned out like this:

Attachment 102801

I am thinking the citric acid might be the culprit.

Urine. Age old method of aging almost all metals. First found out about this in an art class I took in college. Used by both artist and forgers!

Acid dip is all that is needed for creating patina, easiest acidic source is vinegar.

Yeah, the vinegar worked really well for me. Mephisto, try the aloe without anything else. As you saw from the picture using the raw juice squeezed from the plant, the result was very brown.

However, I soaked a Swedish Eric Anton Berg for hours in the vineagar with little result. May have been due to the different steel or maybe the vinegar had already 'reacted' fully when i put the first razor in (I added the second to the bowl an hour after the first).

I'm buying two Swedish framebacks in original condition, original scales and all and will leave them just as they are. I'll hone them of course. Have I already mentioned that? I may have already mentioned that...

Vinegar worked for me the best too. Heat it up, put the clean blade in it, leave it for 10 minutes, take it out, clean the blade, and repeat until the color you are after appears. Reheat the vinegar if it cools meantime :)

In my experience, about 3x10 minutes in 20% vinegar makes the blade almost black.