Takeda Club

You are missing the fact that the razor is probably going to get dull by the n-th member, for example. And that people might just dull it with stropping on the first try.

Also - while this razor might shave great, we have discussed variations between same model, etc. razors - so it is not guaranteed that the next razor (that you will want to buy after testing this one) will be as great. Of course, it may be even better :y than the one that was tested - this is the ideal scenario

Also - if we have 20 members or so - some will have to wait for months! I know where I want to be in the evaluation turns ;)

I am sure other things are missing too but this is off the top of my head

Having said this - I'd pay some $ to try one such razor. ($35 is ~ fine, $60 will be too much maybe)

Cheers
Ivo

And some of us would find an excuse to hone it :-)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mparker762

And some of us would find an excuse to hone it :-)

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I'd gladly have it after you hone it, Michael :)

Now, would I be able to dull it enough to try honing it myself before I pass it along? :shrug:

Cheers
Ivo

Well you know, specks of dust can look like microchips under the microscope, and you can't send the razor on to the next guy with microchips in it can you? Not after he's paid all that money to join the club. So you're really doing him a favor...

i am still in. this sounds like it would work. one concern that i have is that there are some people that arent experienced at honing (that would be me:rolleyes: ) but would still really like to get in on this. so one suggestion i have is for the line up- after a non-honing person make sure it goes to an experience honester just in case. or just exclude newbies like me until we get our act together and learn how to hone:D .

another thought on a razor is of course a williams or a chandler...

cheer and thanks for heading this up!
ryan

On the honing question: Given the hardness of the damascus steel and its edge holding qualities that I've heard so much about how often would it need to be honed?

Every time it's dropped.

Other questions:

1. Should we lower the amount of time each member keeps it to 3 or 4 days? That would reduce the total amount of time it took to get through all the members, obviously. I just want to make sure everyone gets an ample opportunity to try it.

2. Dulling by stropping: I think we'd want each member to be at least competent in stropping so as to not dull it. I don't know now to regulate that however.

3. # of Members/Time: That's going to be a big tradeoff. Part of the reason to do this is to make it as inexpensive as possible to try these really expensive razors. Maybe Lynn could see his way clear to give us the brother in law discount?

Potential Members So Far
JonEdangerousli
Izlat
mparker762
inawe

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mparker762

Every time it's dropped.

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That would fall under the "Potential Issues" category of damage :w

We'd need to see how many qualified honemeisters we had in the club and possibly alter our schedule to rotate it to one next after the damage occured.

That being said, I have been shaving with my various razors since March and have been careful not to drop any of them. I'd imagine I'd be doubly careful with the club's.

/going to use an old razor I don't mind dropping next time since I said that

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jonedangerousli

That would reduce the total amount of time it took to get through all the members, obviously.

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The time-in-transit remains constant at 2-3 days, so this doesn't help very much.

i shave every 2 days since my face feels a little sensitive if i shave everyday. at $35 bucks and a week to try it thats like $10 a shave...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by edk442

i shave every 2 days since my face feels a little sensitive if i shave everyday. at $35 bucks and a week to try it thats like $10 a shave...

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That's true. You should also figure in the chance to win a $600 razor at the end though. Not to mention being part of such an exclusive club. An original member no less. That's the stuff legends are made of...

Another Issue:

If a member decides to leave the club for any reason he donates the initiation fee to the club. No refunds.

Issue:
Do the same terms apply to those living outside USA? The extra delivery times will extend total time taken to go through every club member. Also, if the cost of shipping falls to the current user, then they're going to pay more to send it onto someone, say, in the UK than in North America.

Right now I'm undecided.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by majurey

Issue:
Do the same terms apply to those living outside USA? The extra delivery times will extend total time taken to go through every club member. Also, if the cost of shipping falls to the current user, then they're going to pay more to send it onto someone, say, in the UK than in North America.

Right now I'm undecided.

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I had considered international shipping as far as schedule was concerned, i.e. group the members so as to avoid shipping multiple times from the US to Canada. I haven't thought about the costs. It wouldn't be fair for me to pay $4.60 to ship from Atlanta to Chicago and then have the member in Chicago have to pay $20 to ship to Ottawa.

Ideas?

Another problem that might arise with international shipping... customs even if the razor is listed as a gift, the tax man might decide to want his cut. not everything gets charged but it could sour the deal quickly. best bet would be one limited to Canada/US and then a seperate EU group.

just an idle thought...

OK - this is getting crazy. We are making it harder than it needs to be.

I had suggested this before, and it was not noticed, it seems :shrug:

So, here I go again: doesn't it make sense for the custom makers to set aside one or several such razor and have a "demo" program. It would serve the customers great, and has the potential to increase orders / business. The maker / vendor may get a nominal charge of say $20 for 1 or so week, and then it gets back for inspection. Everything is insured, vendor / maker has little risk. Then it goes out again. There may be a waiting list of members who want to try... Or it may work with a customer deposit (refundable) - this should stop aspiring honemeisters from getting too excited and going apesh!t on the razor :roflmao (and, just to make this clear: I didn't mean Michael here and do not mean to offend any aspirants)

This HAS to work much better? I mean, the makers surely want to support us and make it easy for us? I also know that Lynn has sent personal razors for try-outs before (to serious buyers) - why not set aside a few for such purpose?


Cheers
Ivo

Quote:

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Originally Posted by izlat

this should stop aspiring honemeisters from getting too excited and going apesh!t on the razor :roflmao (and, just to make this clear: I didn't mean Michael here and do not mean to offend any aspirants)

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Don't worry, if I ruin the edge my parents have this cool electric knife sharpener widget that I bet would get it sharp again:w

i think the deposit idea or somethign similar would be a good idea

Michael, you surely understand what I meant and that I wasn't thinking about you :D

But for the record: if we are to go anywhere with my proposal, I need the support of smart people like you - better comment on it. And if you don't like it - don't feel bad for shooting it down, I was just blabbing anyway :D

Cheers
Ivo

I think its a good idea. I would be in.

I think it would be a great idea for the various craftsmen to offer a demo program. I don't think this club would necessarily be in competition with that. Remember, at the end of the evaluation period the club would hold a drawing to award the razor to one lucky member. That adds to the value of being a member.

The US/Canada vs. International thing could be a major issue. I don't want to exclude our members from around the world, but at the same time taxes/duties could be a deal breaker. Suggestions?

Have Expressed Some Level of Interest
JonEdangerousli
Izlat
mparker762
inawe
matt

Anyone that I've missed so far?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mparker762

Don't worry, if I ruin the edge my parents have this cool electric knife sharpener widget that I bet would get it sharp again:w

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we all laugh but in my box of shame is a 6/8 bismark that is in excellent shape everywhere but the blade an electric sharpener or bench grinder was used... from the crappy ebay picture i thought those undulating shiny spots were just odd reflections. somday i'll find a blade for the scales.

Other forums (non razor) do this kind of pass around quite often and they usually run fairly well. Items do travel from over here in the UK to the US and back and usually there are no extra fees afaik.
As to the shipping being different most people usually don't mind but then perhaps it depends on how well the members know each other and the atmosphere on the forum. Sometimes the items come from dealers/makers and sometimes a member will just donate something.

These aren't limited to a "group" with members and places are taken on a first come basis as people can then pick and choose which to participate in. Of course over here we don't have to worry about litagation as much as those in the US.

I can't see makers/dealers offering a demo service as they would probably worry about people paying the deposit and then disappearing with their goods.

Very interesting, Murph - may I ask what items? (just curious how they compare to a straight, with the honing and all, etc.)

By the way - I meant a high deposit, which would not make it cheaper for the person to just take the razor and disappear vs. just buy one

Cheers
Ivo

Other types of blade so the honing bit does apply to a certain extent. Obviously if your not shaving with a blade the honing doesn't matter quite as much but nobody wants to get a blunt item or have the next person mentioning they received one on a forum.

It certainly gives people a chance to try things out that they might not have thought about buying and you always have the chance of winning. You can always use something like lottery numbers for the draw which means nobody can cheat (well if they knew which numbers were going to come up in advance they wouldn't be worrying about winning a razor :) )

True, true :)

Cheers
Ivo

Regarding deposits: What I was thinking about might be a little over the top but I'm well known for that, LOL. I was thinking about having each member fill out a membership application, just like you would for any civic organization, Kiwanis, Lions, et. al. Part of the application process would be giving a credit card # authorized to be used if the razor disappears on your watch, so to speak.

Overkill?

Don't know about this... Who's going to keep the data, how is it going to be protected? If you persoally - then what happens if my identity gets stolen and misused? With a vendor at least there is a clear procedure, etc.

This does seem to open a lot of potential for trouble.

Cheers
Ivo

Perhaps there is some way we can work something out to use paypal. I use paypal for payments to my online business so as to not have to have credit card #'s for just that reason. But I don't know any of my clients there, nor do they know me.

There are a lot of issues that go along with this, that's for sure.

I've been reading all these post and think its a noble idea but I see too many problems. Maybe I'm too old and cynical. The first problem I see is what if someone hones it up and really screws it up. Also, your talking about a very valuable razor here what if someone sends it to the next person on the list and it "gets lost in the mail" and never appears again. Also what about proper sterilization proceedures as it going from person to person and what if someone catches something and blames the guy who started this whole idea? How about if someone leaves it lying around and it disappears or someones kid gets hold of it and there injuries or what if someone just drops it and damages it beyond repair?

When you really sit down and think about it there are many issues that need to be addressed and you'll think of many other issues.

That is getting me to think a little more about the idea in general. I don't see how more than a few people are going to jump on board here. Wouldn't a quick alcohol rub down and rinse suffice as sanitation?

I know it is a tough pill to swallow... Perhaps one person could simply buy the razor use it decide if they like it, if not list it on hte BST forum and the next person can buy it at say maybe $25 dollars off and then keep passing it around until somebody is happy with the razor and the price they paid for it and decide to keep it. since the razor would not be collective property you would be responcible for your own sanitation and honing just like you would with any other razor you own. You could even add a return policy to the sale so that if the next person thinks you buggered it up to much you take it back, no harm no foul.
Yes it is expensive for the first person but you will not always be that person.

One of the reasons behind doing the club was to allow everyone to try one of the custom premiums without having to take out a second mortgage or hire a divorce attorney. Some folks simply can't afford that kind of investment.

The other big advantage was the opportunity to win it at the end.

Like I said its a noble idea. Actually a good while back I was thinking of a similar thing where someone (me) would circulate just good sharp razors around on a list to newbees so they could experience a sharp razor and all these things came up and I realized it was impractical so it never happened. But its a good thought you have there.

Hmm, I still say we should give it a go. We need about 15 more members.

I would just reiterate what's already been brought up. If you're number one on the roster then you're getting a pristine, shave ready blade. Number twenty four would get a razor that's been through at least seventy shaves and any number of honings/stroppings by people of different habits and abilities. This would, obviously, make it difficult for everybody to have anything approaching a uniform experience. As far as international shipping; it would probably be best to group participants by country or geographical location to keep shipping costs to a minimum. Maybe rotate the batting order so that number twenty four gets to be number one on the next evaluation. One idea, although it would increase costs for each group member, would be for each member to agree to not strop or hone and instead ship it back to the vendor for inspection, touch up and stropping before it's sent to the next member.

Problems aside, this is a cool idea. I say we go for it, and if something happens, we all learn from it. We're all adults, and if we're going to kill each other over $25 and a piece of (granted, very nice) steel, there's no hope for civilization.

I'm in as long as the price stays in a reasonable range. I'd love to get the razor after mparker uses his 30K kitchen gadget on it... :)

Josh

I should mention that the razor had better come clearly marked; otherwise I might think it's one of my eBay purchases and wind up selling it to a newb for $35... :D

Josh