Hone ID; green hone; Charnley Forest or Llyn Idwal??

Dear all.

Some days ago the nice postman delivered this beauty to my door step. Bought via Ebay:

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The hone is greenish and had obviously been used with oil. I cleaned it with dishwasher first and afterwards soaked it in organic solvent to get rid of the oil.

The first picture is in the dry state and the second is splashed with water.

The seller suggested it could be a Charnley Forest. I have looked at several pictures both on this site and others. To me it could also look like a Llyn Idwal but what do I know :)??

In the thread "Charnley Forest Stone" JimmyHAD shows a picture of his two CFs and one of them looks more or less exactly like mine :-)

Anybody could shed some more light on this?

Thanks in advance.

Cheers

Peter

Nice looking stone, to me looks like a Llyn Idwal, the Grecian kind, check out this link:http://straightrazorpalace.com/hones...ian-hones.html

Thanks Martin. Yes, it could be a Llyn Idwal too.... but still...... The slurry using a small diamond plate is milky white maybe with a slight grayish tint. Would be so much easier comparing them physically :)

/Peter

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Martin103

Nice looking stone, to me looks like a Llyn Idwal, the Grecian kind, check out this link:http://straightrazorpalace.com/hones...ian-hones.html

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+1

Here's a pic of one that I have:

Top stone "Llyn Idwall", Middle stone "Grecian", Bottom "TOS"

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It is the LI variety called 'grecian oilstone' - but it comes from the UK (Wales) not Greece. Salmen's sold them, as well as Buck & Hickman (I think they had them in ther 1953 tools and hardware cataloge).

The slurry is as you descibed and to me feels a bit grainy - I don't like it.

Most are very fine finishers, but with a crisp rather than smooth feel. Some are coarser and probably best described as pre-finishers.

They are fairly common and although the patterning and colouration vary, most are green/grey with swathes or bandings of mostly small dots, of a darker, blue/green colour.

Regards,
Neil

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wolfpack34

+1

Here's a pic of one that I have:

Top stone "Llyn Idwall", Middle stone "Grecian", Bottom "TOS"

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That's an unusual, nicely patterned Tam - a bit like the Dalmore Blue banding.

Regards,
Neil

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Neil Miller

That's an unusual, nicely patterned Tam - a bit like the Dalmore Blue banding.

Regards,
Neil

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+1 I was thinking the Dalmore Blue as well. If it doesn't have the 'snakeskin' speckles it is probably a DB. Meanwhile, the "Charnley" does look just like the one I had. If it is, it came from a UK antique tool vendor. I had it awhile and sold it when I got the other from Sham. Sold that too because as much as they are talked up on the forums I found them to be similar to a good Ark and I have some of those for pocket knives. At the time I got that stone the Llyn Idwal had not yet made the scene. :shrug:

From the "Saturday Iron newspaper" 1876, the grecian oilstones description, as a cheap stone for plane iron and other edge tools.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Neil Miller

It is the LI variety called 'grecian oilstone' - but it comes from the UK (Wales) not Greece. Salmen's sold them, as well as Buck & Hickman (I think they had them in ther 1953 tools and hardware cataloge).

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Thomas Hazeon and Co was also a supplier of this stone and many others as well like.

Turkey Stone, Arkansas Stone, Washita Stone, Grecian Oilstone, Whittle Hill Stone, Welsh Stone, Canada Stone, Water of Ayr Stone, Kilburn Whetstones and various Holy Stones, Grindstones, Jeweller's Blocks, Polishing Stones, Rag Stones and Scythe Stones. Their trade label was Cutphast Incorporated.


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

+1 I was thinking the Dalmore Blue as well. If it doesn't have the 'snakeskin' speckles it is probably a DB. Meanwhile, the "Charnley" does look just like the one I had. If it is, it came from a UK antique tool vendor. I had it awhile and sold it when I got the other from Sham. Sold that too because as much as they are talked up on the forums I found them to be similar to a good Ark and I have some of those for pocket knives. At the time I got that stone the Llyn Idwal had not yet made the scene. :shrug:

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Neil and Jimmy...yeah it is a beauty and definitely a pre-finisher that I rate at about 6-8K. If you're very subtle when finishing on it you can get what I would call an 8K shave. I like it...but very seldom use it unless I'm going to finish with the Llyn Idwall which is all of 15+K. Very hard indeed...as you said Jimmy just like a fine translucent Ark.

It is most definitely a TOS, as I bought it some time ago NOS in the original 'Tam O'Shanter Orange Labeled Maroon or Dark Red box', and I think a very nice one indeed.

:beer1: WP34

As a footnote Neil: My LI 'Grecian' is definitely a pre-finisher as well. Milky white slurry that is 'gritty'. With a heavy slurry it will act like a 4-6K and once the slurry has broken down I would say it smooths right out and Tops out at about 8K. I have shaved off the edge from this stone...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Martin103

Thomas Hazeon and Co was also a supplier of this stone and many others as well like

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Yes, of course there were many others Martin. They are just rocks in the ground after all. Listing all the sellers would be like listing all the coal dealers. They were and still are commodities.

Regards,
Neil

It certainly is a nice stone, Wolfpack. I do have one that is similar, but the 'dalmore' type of pattern is so subtle that you can only discern it when the stone is wet.

Regarding dalmore blues, I have five that commence with a very striking pattern - classic db and then each one has a less distinct pattern. The last one in the series is a uniform dull grey, until you wet it, then you can see the banding - just.

Interestingly they all cut the same and give an equivalent edge, unlike the grecians which can vary quite a bit. The 'proper' LIs can vary a lot too, but the finest ones tend to give an edge that is a bit finer than the grecian hone as in crisper rather than smoother.

Historically they were quoted in most books as being a cheaper alternative to the turkey oilstone, but I think this was purely a question of price rather than superiority of the turkey hone, as the latter can vary even more than the LIs, there being some very coarse cutting ones around.

Regards,
Neil

Hi Guys.

Many thanks for all your interesting posts. So it seems it is a Grecian Hone I bought :)

Cheers

Peter