Vintage Hone, Was my great Grandads, And predates him by some years.

Hello this is my first post on here and I would like some help identifying a hone I was given after my Great Grandad died in the early 1990's. The stone was given to him already used by his father (my great great Grandad) I also assume he did not purchase the stone new as he was not a wealthy man. When my great Grandad died he was 99 years old born in 1895. So as a rough estimate I would place the stone as been at least 150 years old, perhaps more.

When I got the stone it was in pretty bad shape, And sat for many years as a knife sharpening stone in my old tools. It was never very good at sharpening knives. It is both too hard too slow to take away material, and at the time it was badly in need of lapping having about 5mm of wear giving it a heavy bow in the center.

Anyway I decided it was time the stone was made flat a few years ago. I started with 180 grit sand paper. The stone destroyed the sand paper. So I moved up to 180 grit wet and dry. Getting the stone flat took about 30 sheets. Then I used a couple more sheets of 400 grit to take out the scratch pattern.

The stone is stupidly hard.

It seems that it is a fine razor hone, And so I decided to pick up a cheap straight razor to see how well it works in it's real role. It's not a fast stone, But the edge comes up very polished.

I would love it if someone could tell me what they think the stone is. I'm planning on picking up a decent razor for Christmas, Using this stone as a finisher I'll probably need something with a little more bite to work with it. Without knowing where it sits in terms of polish I'm at a loss.

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Many thanks.

can you show the sides of the stone?

without more pictures, I am going to go with "some form of Noviculite"

Im pretty certain it is a hard black arkansas. Those specks in it look like mine and I like mine alot. You can use it as a finisher but needs to be dressed higher than 400 grit. Theyre ridiculous to lap amd once you get it lapped your great great grandkids might be the next ones to have to lap it. I dressed mine up to about 8k (I used my coticule which probably wasnt necessary and maybe didnt do anything) I then took a nice chisel and just went to town with it and now its nice and reflective. Not good this way for knives but works well on my razors. Eleblu knows better on how to dress these stones than I do. Make sure you use oil on it or smiths honing solution or glycerin. It is a slow slow slow stone so if you want to use it for razors be aware and prepared for that.

If on the other hand I am wrong then ignore what I said

I think regardless of whether you can get this stone to razor-honing smooth, it's a priceless heirloom. Oh, I'm sure that someone could put a dollar amount on it and it wouldn't even be that high; but let's face it, this has been in your family three generations and still going strong.

My recommendation is that you either follow cosperryan's advice and try to get it to razor quality or learn to sharpen knives. That stone deserves to be used.
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Those inclusions look identical to ones in my oldest arkie. It's a translucent. One doesn't see them in the recently mined stones. The standards for grading them must have changed and perhaps those inclusions are carefully sorted out.

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Originally Posted by Oakeshott

Those inclusions look identical to ones in my oldest arkie. It's a translucent. One doesn't see them in the recently mined stones. The standards for grading them must have changed and perhaps those inclusions are carefully sorted out.

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+1 for the translucent somewhat visible on the last pic.

I'll get the stone honed up a little this weekend on some finer grade wet and dry so I can see if it'll hold a more polished face, If it does I'll keep moving it up. I do have a glass block and some powders that I use for other things so if it gets up to that grade I'll be very impressed.

The pictures are a little misleading I think the stone is quite green in natural light, so once I get the face sharpened I'll put up some more images.

I'll be defiantly picking up a better straight razor for use with this stone, I have my eye on a nice Friodur Henkels wedge for Christmas, I think this stone should prove more than useful for what I have planned.

Edit:

Perhaps the glass block was a bad idea, The hone is harder than the glass :D

I've given it a 1200 grit wet and dry then run over it with CROX on a felt wheel.... I never knew this stone had metal particles in it and black spots!


I'll put up some images of the new surface tomorrow. It's getting a glossy finish as I work it.

Right I have an update in words to add about this stone so far.

I was very wrong with the previous post in regard to how close to finished the face was. The stone just keeps polishing more and more. ATM I can see the reflection of the light above me in it while I work. And if I hold it at the correct angle it's reflecting text from the monitor.... Worst of all I don't think it's done yet. I've spend about 3 hours with a chissel, And then I decided that I may as well put my el-cheapo razor on it, I then realised I was using too much pressure on the el cheapo and I had messed up the grind, making it shorter than it should be. So I then re-honed the razor edge just using this stone and no edge pressure..... It took about 4 hours.

The stone now feels sticky when your honing and your angle is set correctly. I think it's probably due to water suction. I can still feel parts on the face where the blade feels a little rougher. Those parts will hone in I think.

All I can say so far is wow, I thought I had some low grit very slow hone. I was planning on perhaps scrapping it, and picking up a norton 3K/8K stone.... I might still pick up the norton, But I think this stone is a keeper.

Like I said earlier, that sounds like a surgical black to me. I have one and love it as a finisher. They're slow but they work wonders. I would say that you have it polished enough when you can see text reflecting off it. Thats about where I have mine at and I think its a good compromise between speed and finishing ability. The smoother the stone gets the slower it works.

I just had a shave off el-cheapo and it's the best I've had so far. I'm going to get a better razor I think at Christmas, So i might post that off to Neil Miller to be honed so I have a benchmark to work from. It may also have something to do with my creme as well This is the first shave I have done with TOBS eton, I've been using the sandlewood one and there may be a difference, or it may be a scent induced placebo :D

I've got the camera charging now so I'll try get pictures up after work tomorrow in natural light. Lets hope it's not raining so I can use the garden table :D

On a side note, What stone should I look at to reset my bevel. I can't sit for a few hours every time I want to hone so what grit and make stone should I look at. I've looked at the norton 4K/8K stone, Is there anything else I should consider. At some point I will make the progression to vintage blades as well I think. So I'll probably need something that can work a shagged blade.

Thanks for sharing Iceni. It is good you are trying to repurpose this stone. When you say it is greener, does it look like the pic below? This is some form of Ayrshire stone. It is very hard and relatively thin. Just curious but when you say it is slow what are you comparing it to?

FYI; If you are working with Neil, he carries the King Icebear 1/6 combo that would set a spiffy bevel. Better bevel setter than the ubiquitous Norton 4/8.
MIke

http://i.imgur.com/wTKLYW7.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/78JI5pD.jpg

That Ayrshire stone looks far closer than any of the Arkansas stones I've seen. I should have said I live in the UK, And so have my grand/great grandparents. North Yorkshire to be more precise. And none of them went off to war since they were blacksmiths. Once I get some more images up I think it will be easier to place. I've stripped some of the gunk off the side of the stone, and found one of the ends of the wood block is actually broken and pops out so you can see the full end of it. It's a lot chunkier than I thought it was going to be, At over 1 inch thick. It also has that odd iridescence a little like tigers eye forming in the face, and it's beginning to gain a fingerprint in the gloss as well.

Got some pictures :D

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5492/1...52024702_o.jpg

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5527/1...ab927504_o.jpg

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5482/1...65b1fc17_o.jpg

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http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5523/1...99641c9f_o.jpg

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3767/1...e4e964ba_o.jpg

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7350/1...126d00ea_o.jpg

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3719/1...a486bd3b_o.jpg

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http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5501/1...94dc804a_o.jpg

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"IF" it's an Arkansas stone:

I have at least 11. I don't think it's a Surgical Black, because it's not really any shade of Black. However, the density of either Translucent or True Hard Arkansas is the same, so the color thing doesn't really matter much; except that visibly Translucent stones cost more. I think it's likely a dark murky shade of True Hard or Translucent. Those come in White, Grey, Pink, even Black. (I have 4 Black stones, and 1 of them is a Black Translucent.)

It looks like your stone is well worn. I'd like to see if the color brightens up any with continued polishing.

I think the face wear is actually the fact I used wet and dry paper to lap it. I think the deeper looking scratches are loose erratics from the paper. When you feel the stone it actually feels very smooth. It also doesn't help with the fact the pictures are taken pretty close and using pretty hard side lighting to try get that fingerprint to show up on the camera.

1KnifeGuy4U have any of your stones got metal flecks in them? Those last couple of pictures are actually of a very bright one in the face, there are others as well all over the stone. It's very bright metal, I need a microscope I think to have a proper look at them.

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1KnifeGuy4U have any of your stones got metal flecks in them?

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For the purpose of full disclosure; I'm a knife guy, but not a straight razor guy yet. (I have a beard.) I do however love the stones, and I mainly chime in when the thread is about Arkansas stones; but I occasionally post on other topics too.

None of my Hard Arkansas, Black Arkansas, or Translucent Arkansas stones have any metal flecks that I'm aware of.

However, I wouldn't be shocked if under high magnification my largest Soft Arkansas 8x2x1 were shown to have some surprising particles. It occassionally releases gritty feeling particles, and seems to be just a bit more coarse than my other Soft Arkansas stones. It exhibits some of the same "pitting" or tiny voids present in the surface of your stone. Though mine is a Soft Arkansas, and your stone is harder than that.