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Hi, i currently own 2 combo stone : 220/1k norton + 4k/8k norton. I am fairly new to honing and I dont want to spend a tons of money on a new sharpening stone for multiple reasons. Do you guys think I could be ok with those stones, if not what would be a good stone not too pricy for polishing ?
How are the shaves off the 8k going ????
I am still practicing on a old razor (that I can not shave with because it need a restauration). I have a brand new straight razor but I don't feel confortable honing it yet. So I can't tell if the 8k is doing the job :S That is why I am asking.
Basically the real truth is simple, until you can get a decent comfortable shave from just the 8k level, then anything higher is a waste of time and money...
When you realize that you don't NEED a finisher is when one is going to make a noticeable improvement :)
When you reach that conclusion, then it is really hard to beat the Naniwa 12k at a good price point, in fact they are hard to beat period
+1 to what Glenn said. When I finally got consistent comfortable shaves off the 8k, the 12k Nani just brought them to another level.
I recently followed exactly that advice, and it paid off. I stuck with 8k (in my case, Naniwa 3k/8k combo) until I could reliably get good shaving edges from it, and only then did I get a Naniwa 12k. The 12k is an excellent stone, but to get it to work well you do need to achieve a good lower-grit edge first.Quote:
Originally Posted by gssixgun
Mac, the scoop you're getting from Glen, JF, Oscroft - will not be improved upon. You have everything you need for great shaves already. I couldn't agree more about the Nani 12k also.
One thing that can cloud the path to progress is how one chooses a blade to practice/learn on. Bravo for using something other than a costly vintage razor in good shape. But if its a fleabag special that needs restorative grinding before honing - you're taking the hard road. You can be doing everything right - and still get lousy results because the edge isn't ready for honing. The magic marker test is your friend. Coat the edge w/ high-contrast felt-tipped marker - black, red, doesn't matter and take a couple of your lightest, smoothest strokes and see if the marker is evenly removed on the whole length of cutting edge. If there are any gaps in the marker removal - I'd shop around for a Pro who will do the resto grinding and send back a just a carefully done bevel - no more.
With a good bevel, you can get a much more accurate picture of your results. When successful, you can lightly dull and reproduce that bevel. This allows you to develop the memory in your fingers of what 'normal' is supposed to feel like. When that becomes regular and your 8k shaves are a pleasure - then and only then will the higher grit rocks bring anything to the party. Then you're also able to take on the more difficult tasks for restorative grinding on your 220 stone.
How about a Franz Swaty hone?
The Swaty works fine, but is no more fine than the Norton 8. 'A tad more smoothness from my experience. The honorable Mrsell has mentioned good results from a Frictionite 00.
I was under the impression that the Swaty was closer to 12k grit and that is why people buy them as a final hone or to refresh an edge. Can anyone confirm that? If they are no smoother really than my Norton 8k then I purchased the Swaty for nothing.
Can't confirm but that is the general consensus and thus the reason I have held off on a barber hone. If you find that it improves the edge then so be it. As they say YMMV. I wouldn't say you bought it for nothing though. I mean you can whip it out faster than the norton as it doesn't need soaking and only a few laps to refresh the edge. Plus they're neat and they don't make them anymore. Little bit of history that you can fit in your pocket.Quote:
Originally Posted by ProudMarineDad
That's true cosperryan. I guess my point was that if the Swaty was not much smoother than the 8k Norton then I would have been better off spending twice as much as the old Swaty and bought a Naniwa 12k.
if you don't want to watch the entire instructional video that Glen graciously did for all seeking knowledge start listening to him at 45 seconds in! Then he starts to talk about Grit Rating and his opinion!Quote:
Originally Posted by ProudMarineDad
gssixgun Barber Hone.wmv - YouTube
Okay, i'm in a similar position as the OP here. Except that I have a Belgian Coticule as well (but have found the 8k to give a nicer finish).
Looking at the 12k options I see I can get the Shapton at about the same price as the Naniwa. Is there any reason to prefer one over the other?
thanks
(getting fine shaves off the 8k)
"Looking at the 12k options I see I can get the Shapton at about the same price as the Naniwa. Is there any reason to prefer one over the other"?Quote:
Originally Posted by WadePatton
As with Everything associated with buying, using, honing, stropping along with soaps, brushes etc. It's all a matter of 'Personal Choice'!
Try one, then save some money up and then buy the other so you can compare side by side!
While one honer could put a different edge on your blades with the two stones, you will be comparing to what 'you' can do with them!!
I'm sure that the fans of each will join in! Be sure to listen to their opinions, but remember you and only you will be the one to decide which is what you like!! :tu
I have the Norton 220/1000 4000/8000, plus Swaty Barbers hone, and an Edlis Special Barbers hone. After the 8k I usually go to the edlis, then the Swaty. Under a loupe that seems to be advancing the keenness of the edge.Quote:
Originally Posted by ProudMarineDad
But I agree about the 8k is really all you need, if you know the right techniques.
I highly recommend a get together with a Mentor. I recently had the privilege of getting a lesson from the aforementioned Mrsell. My edges before were good, but now they are much better and takes less than half the time.
Lynn and Glen have mentored me well via the Tube, You. (thanks guys:beer2:)Quote:
Originally Posted by souschefdude
I have no problem shaving off the 8k. I had to hone to get started, never bought anything near "shave-ready" or "HHT approved". Doing is learning too, if one is careful.
The question is "what's next?"--as in "The professionals are finishing up on 30k's and I'm finishing up on 8k, there's a lot of ground in between so what is the next logical step?" That's the long version.
The OP was answered with 12k Naniwa.
(and then i saw the Shapton video series by Glen (and don't ever count Glen's stropping strokes, just don't even try it. :dropjaw:)
and saw same "street" prices on both the Naniwa and Shapton 12k stones. And i wonder if the gurus who have used both have a preference for, or feel a difference in one or the other, and why.
strop on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WadePatton
First thanks for the heads up on the Vids glad they are helping
Second I have said this a few times but being as it is personal opinion take it for what it is worth..
If I were forced to have only one set of hones in the house (it would somehow be the wife's fault) I would have to chose the Naniwa SS system, it just has a great feel while honing and it is my goto set when honing chippy, finicky, razors.. That system works well on all razors, and the edge is sharp and very comfortable without much fuss at all and the price is more than fair IMHO...
Thanks Glen, and (at this point in time) I present what you said elsewhere WRT Naniwa 12k vs Shapton 16k (sometimes you has to read 46 searched up threads to find the gold)
I don't expect to ever "run a system" bottom to top, but i'll keep trying diff't makers' rocks as i expand the collection. I'm going to re-try my Coticule to see where it fits (since i've learned more about them), but I'm shaving great off 1/4/8 Norton, no paste linen, leather presently-and I just started using the linen.Quote:
Originally Posted by gssixgun
I need more razors to play with...dangit!