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Does anyone have this stone? What is the hardness of it? What is it like or comparable to? I would like to get my foot in the J-nat door and this seems an affordable option. Would it be better to buy a Asagi Nakayama koppa stone when available vs a type 100? J-bats have a ton of intricacies to wrap your head around it seems.
Hello, i have the shubo 100 as well as the full size. Both my stones seem to be exactly the same, just the size being different. I think its a great stone to start with, although theres a learning curve with all of them. An asano nagura set would help you there as well. You could go from bevel set to almost finish with it. A koma and a matched tomo nagura will allow you maximum versatility and the naguras are useable with any stone and will last a lifetime pretty much. So yes, i think its a great stone, i have it and have used it extensively.
I have one. It's a great little stone....or mine is. I'm no expert on determining hardness but i suspect it 4.5(?). It's a hard stone. That much seems true. It is a finisher. The edges off of it are very nice. You will need a set of nagura to go with it. I found it to be very easy to use as it was my first Jnat as well. The price is very agreeable. And if you don't get crazy with honing and stones (yeah right) it may be all you'll need moving forward. If you're looking for a nudge, this is it. Talk to Maksim about it and he can help you further. It's a good entry since the investment is minimal as far as Jnats go. And the nagura will work with other stones if you decide on more later. The edges I got from it were crisp and comfortable....very keen. My stone cuts a little with plain water and that is how I finish on it. I was very pleased with mine.
I don't know much about jnats but I do have a vintage kiita that was rated about a 4.5. From what I have read it is better for a person to start with a softer stone, like a 4.5 vs a super hard one. I know my kiita a very easy stone to use, but that's about the extent of my jnat knowledge. Maksim is very helpful though and should answer any questions you may have.
I'm mostly checking out j-nats as a finisher for now. Maybe down the road I will try a full progression but my current obsession is finishing stones. I'm leaning towards a j-nat but a Shapton 16k is also on the table.
If you go synthetic, seek out the Suehiro 20k. It's replaced everything for me as of now.
I don't love the shapton as a finisher, I think the learning curve with it (specifically not overusing it on an already near finished razor because it creates odd damage) is harder than using a japanese natural finisher.
I like tomonagura on a japanese finisher, and a prefinisher instead of a nagura progression. It allows me to keep the surface of my natural finisher very slick, and prefinisher to tomonagura to clear water is a pretty capable progression.
Type 100 doesn't tell us anything other than the size. Presume there is a retailer selling smaller stones (like type 100) by their size and their mine? To really know anything, we need to know what the miner graded the stone, the stratum, and the mine - as well as a general comment of about hardness.
But if an experienced dealer tells you a stone is suitable for razors, it will be. Likely fine and consistent. Type 100 and koppa are a great way to get razor stones on a budget. There generally should be no difference between their ability to hone a razor and the ability of a much larger stone to do so, just in surface. And price is almost exponential.
If the stone is a grayish fine stone coming from shoubu right now (I have a large one from takeshi kuroda), like many seem to be, they are very easy to use stones and fairly smooth to use compared to some of the very hard asagi stones.
The edge coming off of most of the very fine japanese stones is similar once you learn the stone, regardless of mine.
it is a natural stone and as such no two are alike. Just go by the description of the seller and that should give you the best idea.Quote:
Originally Posted by aa1192
Typically Shobudani are good finishers.
Maksim runs JNS right? Those are the stones I'm checking out since I have little knowledge and could easily be swindled I'm buying from a reputable source. As for details there aren't many if you check the site for the specific stone but other stones are more clearly defined. That is why I asked on here vs a google search. Thanks for the tips so far guys and please keep them coming. I may hold out for a koppa instead. I understand naturals are all different but I'm just looking for a ballpark. I have never heard anyone say "I bought a labeled Escher and it turned out to be 325 grit." Just round about answers are good for me. How does the hardness affect edge quality? Will a 4.5 give the same edge as say a 5+?
Quote:
Originally Posted by aa1192
Maksim runs JNS, yes.
I just went and looked at what's out there. They look much like the shoubu damascus colored stone that I got from takeshi kuroda, and it's a good stone. I would not hesitate to buy one of those were I in your shoes. I can't guarantee that they're like my stone, but my stone is a very capable finisher...very capable.Quote:
Originally Posted by aa1192
You literally could finish thousands of razors on that type 100 size, and maintain every razor you're likely to ever use again. Don't let the price fool you - mine is better than any thuringian I've tried, including labeled eschers, and cost more only because it is a full sized stone. Because small stones, even those of quality, are very common in japan, and large type 24 stones are not, the price difference between them is based on rarity and not capability.
I would suggest to talk to Maksim about the particular stone you want to buy, he will explain in detail how it works.Quote:
Originally Posted by aa1192
Hardness doe snot always relate to fine. It all depends on the binder of the stone. It is always good to test a stone or buy from a reputable seller so that you are certain what you are getting.
I would also suggest to use the search function and read up on Jnats, we have a lot of threads discussing the properties of those stones.
If you decide to go with a Jnat, watch these videos as they were very helpful to me. I hope Stefan doesn't mind me sharing them. It will help with the technique of using a small stone.
Nagura Honing 1 - YouTube
Nagura Honing 2 - YouTube
I'm wondering about the tomo now as I read more into it all. They sell a blanket tomo, but wouldn't you want a piece very close to your stone? Geez these things are complicated and honestly I never realized the price of naguras was so high.
Maksim will work all of that out for you. Just tell him what set up you want and he will match accordingly.Quote:
Originally Posted by aa1192
Awesome, I will shoot him an email when I'm sure of my order. Thanks again guys.
You want something soft enough to be a good tomo (tomonagura has to let go of its particles) and you want it to be fine and consistent with no large scratchy particles. That's pretty much it. For practicality, it doesn't need to be from the same mine as your base stone, but for cosmetic purposes, it's nice if it's similar to the base stone.Quote:
Originally Posted by aa1192
there are decent tomonagura around for about $35 in the US, and I see maksim has a listing for unmarked naguras in that range. Just ask him to match a nice one to your stone, something that complements it well.
You always have the option of a very fine diamond hone to raise slurry from the base stone itself, just don't use a coarse diamond hone because in reality, none of the japanese stone have particles that small, and agitating the surface of the stone and freeing up a whole bunch of fresh particles and creating grooves like you'll do with a coarse diamond stone will decrease the stone's ability to finish a razor temporarily.