Another Chosera 1k Thread....

Ok so let me qualify my remarks by saying I had the privilege of watching and learning from Glen honing in person yesterday at the Denver GTG....an eye opening experience for sure. With that in mind, take everything I have to say here with a grain of salt as I am a fairly new honer, I certainly do not hone in high volume, and my technique when bevel setting still needs some work, though after yesterday I feel like I am still moving in the right direction....

I have a pretty typical setup for beginners....Norton 220/1k, 4k/8k, and a Naniwa 12k finisher. Since I have begun honing, I have found the 4k/8k and 12k to be to my liking, but have never been the biggest fan of the 1k side of the 220/1k hone. It seems to lose cutting "potency" very quickly, and to me seems slow. In fact, I find I spend a lot more time on my 4k to finish a bevel because I think I get far better feedback from that stone, and it also isn't as thirsty....as the 1k requires nearly constant attention with water even after a long soak.

So all of this brings me to the Chosera, which I watched Glen use with ease....not that this should surprise anyone, but there was some discussion about the amount of abrasive in one versus the other. I now, after some thought, am thinking about moving in that direction for my bevel setter. I know the Chosera is a well regarded stone, but I am more interested in knowing thoughts on the 1k and if I will really be pleased with the upgrade considering the up-front cost of the Chosera? I really don't like being on the bevel setter longer than is necessary and feel perhaps a faster stone will get me where I want to go. Am I correct in my observations? Might this be the path for me going forward?

Many thanks for your thoughts in advance! I have a couple of nice vintage razors now in the mail and want to get them dialed in right the first time (a lightly used vintage King Cutter, and a NOS Fili 13 DT JMP. All of this came with some frustrations on the 1k setting the bevel on a NOS DD Goldedge. Problem resolved on that one thanks to Glen!

-Ted

I recently moved from the Norton 1K to the Chosera. I am quite content with the move. I really like the feel of the Chosera over the Norton. It is faster but not crazy fast, which I also like. It does not require the same same soak time, which I also like. I do not feel that I know this hone well yet, I think I still have things to learn as well.

Yes I started with a Norton 1k but never seemed happy with it, as you say it has some thirst, I chose the Chosera 1K and been very happy with it, very easy to use and little water required in comparison.

I moved from the Naniwa Superstone 1k to the Nani Pro 1k quite recently adn I'm very satisfied. For me the feel of the Pro is much nicer. It's fast, but feel smoother to me and I really like that harder feel compared with the Nani SS.

I'm satisfied with my bevel when it 1) looks good and even and 2) is popping hairs all along. I felt that the results stepped up, and came more consistently when I started using the Nani Pro. Of course, since I'm not a seasoned honer, the results might have stepped up on the superstone as well, as a result of experience.

just my thoughts.

Best, Sedell

I have used a few 1K synthetics of various makes in the past and for the last few years I only use the Chosera 1K it's a great stone and I personally think it's the best 1K money can buy, I'm also thinking the Chosera 800 stone could also do the same job If given the opportunity.

If the cost isn't an issue, I cannot think of any reason not to get a Chosera 1k.

I have only used a Norton 1k once for a very short time at a meet. I immediately disliked both the feel and performance and went back to using a King with pleasure. I now use a Chosera (now called the Pro by Naniwa). I love my 12k but I regard my 1k and 3k as my most important stones.

So, the terms faster, honing and novice, used in concert, always seem to foretell, “Issues”. Setting a bevel, is not where you want to cut corners, on time or effort.

The Chosera is a fine stone, I have used one for years, but recently I pulled out my old Norton 1k after not having used it in as many years. It worked just fine and really, not all that much different than the Chosera, certainly not as different as many claim or I remember.

The Chosera feels smoother than the Norton, but both produce the same 1k edge, not better, just a different feel, because of the way the binder breaks down, both have 1k grits.

Trust me, the problems you experienced were not the fault of the stone. As have been said many times, a “Better”, (More Expensive) stone will NOT make you a better honer…

If it makes you happy, buy the Chosera, but you will just have to LEARN how to use it also…

I bought the Chosera 1K after using the Norton for four plus years. It just sits in a drawer because I use 1K so little these days and because the Norton works fine for me.

My first set of stones were the Nortons, singles, 1k,4k,8k, and they performed well. Ya the 1k Norton is thirsty and the feedback is not to my liking but the stones worked well for me.

I have since moved on to Naniwa stones for my synthetic progression up to 8K, using the Professional P310-1K and the P330-3K (new Choseras) in my lineup.

I find that I like the feedback of the P310 much better than the Norton 1K and appreciate that it's a splash and go stone that's a fraction as thirsty as the Norton 1K.

I also would echo the idea that speed in setting bevels should come low on the list of priorities when it comes to choosing what stone you might choose.
I want to set the absolute best (straightest) bevel I can, then achieve the smoothest scratch pattern before moving on to a higher grit.
I have experience with only these two 1K stones so far, and for me the Naniwa Professional P310, 1K stone is the better stone for what my needs are.

I would not hesitate to use the Norton 1k stone on any razor that needed that coarse a stone to set the bevel, I just prefer the feedback, and other characteristics, of the Naniwa stones better.

I absolutely agree that (better), (more expensive) stones will not make anyone a better honer.

If you want to become better at honing razors, HONE A HUNDRED MORE RAZORS, on the appropriate stones that you have!

Will you enjoy the experience more with different stones? PERHAPS



FrankC

Glens signature says it best, look it up. Tc

Well a lot of people talks about hones, but almost every time only on the finisher. The real key to honing is the bevel setting. I to moved from King to Naniwa SS 1 K. The chosera should be a little better, but the SS 1k is really, really great.

A great bevel setter will improve every hone result. The progression from there is open to experimentation, different hones, methods of honing, pressure, strokes, naturals with/without slurry, water, oil.... You get the picture.

However nothing will work if you haven't set the bevel correct.

I find that going all the way with the SS hones 3k, 8 and 12k is great when honing af new razor. The same progression gives me complete control over the process and I'm free to concentrate on the razor.

When I have learned what I need about the razor, hardness of steel, defects, ect.
If the razor is my own, and I want it in my rotation, I go back to 8k, and finish on the preferred finisher for that razor. A coticule, mostly, but sometimes I use a Escher instead.

That gives me a smooth and comfortable shave. I shave everyday, 3 passes. So my razors needs to be in top condition or I'll have razor burn. It's a great feeling, to shave with a perfectly honed razor.

But back to the point. It's all comes down to the bevel.

I'm sure a Chosera will do you great, but just as sure a Naniwa SS will serves you too. Did you try Glens Chosera? Or did you just think it looked great? Every hone will look great when used by Glen. He's in a category for himself. One of the best honers in the world.

You need to try the hone first yourself, before buying. You will feel it instantly, if the hone suits your style of honing. It's just like buying a chef knife. You will need to try it, feel the weight in your hands, the balance. Everything needs to be perfect because, your bevel depends on it.

I hope this clarify things a bit. I'm sure there is someone close to you with the Chosera or Naniwa you could try. You could try mine for sure, but I live in Denmark, with is a bit to far away for a casual honing trip. :-)

I went from the Naniwa 1K to the pro 1K about a year ago and never looked back. I now just use the old Naniwa for knives. You will most certainly be happy

I ordered the stone so we will see what happens when it arrives. At the end of the day, it is a stone, and if I don't like it, I am sure I can sell it at a fairly marginal loss and call it a day. I got another vintage last night (Boker King Cutter from approx. '20s-'30s) that had some small chips in the blade. I am glad I was at the GTG to learn better chip removal techniques as they came into play for sure. Given the chips, I had to reset the bevel naturally...and to me the Norton 1k just feels numb. On the Norton 4k and 8k, and certainly the Naniwa 12k, I can feel and hear a sense of approaching a finish that then prompts me to stop and check the edge. On the 1k, I just don't feel or hear anything different when the bevel comes together....so I am hoping the Chosera gives me a little bit more of that feel. The Boker came out great, despite its extra toe wear (already present when I bought it) and I got a wonderful even bevel, as I do on most blades I attempt (a couple have given me a run fro my money). At the end of the day I can get where I need to be, I am just hoping for a bit more feedback from the stone. Will the Chosera do that for me? We will see!

Well your thoughts about being able to sell it easily if you don't like it are correct. There is a high demand for used Choseras because no one ever sells theirs;) I can't say that I've ever felt feedback from my 1k when the bevel comes together though.

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Originally Posted by bluesman7

Well your thoughts about being able to sell it easily if you don't like it are correct. There is a high demand for used Choseras because no one ever sells theirs;) I can't say that I've ever felt feedback from my 1k when the bevel comes together though.

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At least I know where to go locally if I ever decide to jump off of the Natural cliff....a few new sources now! I will need a basement hobby shop if I decide to get over my RAD and go down that path!

I'm trying to avoid the HAD. I think I did good job with that goal this weekend. To the OP, I do like my Chosera 1k. It has wonderful feedback. The two (I know that ain't much) razors that I have set bevels on it, I felt it on almost the exact stroke where the bevel was set. I think you will be pleased with it. But it does cut fast, so if you are honing incorrectly, you will make a mess before you know it (done that too)... lol

I love my choosera 1k. I had the naniwa ss 1k before and the choosera has a better feel and leavs a better finish IMO

This arrived on Thursday evening and I got to play with it a bit on Friday. I know the Norton and this Chosera are both 1k, but the grit on this one just feels a bit "finer" to me. I gave it a good lapping to get the course top layer off and get it flat. I have only honed a couple of razors on it thus far so I am still evaluating but it does seem to cut a bit faster for sure (especially c135 steel on a TI I put on it). Otherwise it is a great quality stone. Only time will tell if I have made a good decision here but either way I am confident that this one feels a bit better to me from a feedback perspective.

Well here we are a couple of months and about a dozen razors later (of my own stock) that needed work.
Among these razors was my first, which was a Whipped Dog Sight Unseen with a reworked heel and a bit of abuse I had subjected it to while I was learning, in addition to the pretty descent amount of hone wear it had due to use and age (3 layers of tape to get good stone contact).

Now that I have been on this stone for a while I can say with the utmost certainty that my honing has improved markedly. I know many have been skeptical about transitioning to this from my Norton 1k. Perhaps with the Norton I was not patient enough (because it was devastatingly slow), or it didn't have enough abrasive material in the stone....either way, this Naniwa performs above and beyond what the Norton did, and the remarkable edges I have been producing since its purchase is proof positive enough for me. For the record, I still use my Norton 4k/8k combo religiously in my progression and find that combo stone to be first rate...so whatever happened with my 1k is a mystery to me.

My bevel sets come fairly quickly and evenly. The rest of my progression flies by quickly after I get off of the 1k, as there really is very little work left to do at that point. The stone certainly has a "feel" when one is getting close to a proper bevel set...the feedback is excellent, even on heavier grinds. Moreover, the scratch patterns are very consistent and don't go too deep...getting back to my quick progression thereafter. Very consistent every time.

So in conclusion...whether it was the stone, my technique improving/evolving, or both....this purchase was very worthwhile and I would recommend this stone to anyone with the budget to add it to their progression.

There is no question that the Chosera is a fine stone with a smooth feel. But is it really that much better than any other?

I have a Chosera, Super Stone, Norton, King and Nubatama 1k’s, they all produce the same 1k edge in about the same amount of time, the Nubatama the fastest, surprisingly without deep stria or rough edge.

If you are new and money is no object the Chosera is a fine choice, but switching from any other stone to a Chosera, will not improve honing over any other 1k.

Recently I picked up another used King 1k, for a couple bucks and have been using it to lap other stones and because it is handy in the sink, have been using it to bevel set occasionally. It is a real nice stone, it likes water and self-slurries a bit, but for the price, not all that different from a Chosera in feel and certainly not in performance.

So yes the Chosera is a nice stone, but don’t expect dramatic results over any other 1k, they all produce 1k edges. The 1k’s job is to hog off material, they all do that well.

Where 1k’s do differ, is in the deepness of the stria and rough edge they produce, which can be an issue, if it is not completely removed, often the bane of the novice honer. Deep stria can easily be flattened and edge straightened by jointing, circles and/or side honing.

And that is the job of the next stone in the progression, transitioning from setting the bevel to straightening the edge…

I'd like to add.
I came from the Shapton Glass 1k to the Chosera 1k.

The Chosera feels nice n soft to me.

The Chosera 5k is my favourite stone though, It has a great feel.