Jende industries is not Shapton & is just voicing an opinion.
I can't remember where I got this chart but pretty sure it's info that came in the Pro boxes.
It says the 320 is for SS, Swedish Steel & even Japanese swords. Hardly only for Stainless.
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Jende industries is not Shapton & is just voicing an opinion.
I can't remember where I got this chart but pretty sure it's info that came in the Pro boxes.
It says the 320 is for SS, Swedish Steel & even Japanese swords. Hardly only for Stainless.
I have the Shapton Pro 1.5k. Apparently it's not usable for anything.
I guess I should throw it away.
Oops, I just noticed the right side of the chart. I guess I can keep it for sharpening my rose shear.
No good for that--I think my knife was made in the winter.
Yeah I should have written according to jende.. :) But I had a few beers and, well, thats the result. I pulled it out of my posterior.
However. I have seen this "trend" on several forums. That the 320 and the 1500 might be different somehow, than the rest of the pros.
Also that SEM guy with all the good SEM pics wrote that the 320 was made out of alu oxide and silicon carbide here https://scienceofsharp.wordpress.com...big-of-a-jump/
https://scienceofsharp.files.wordpre...ppro320_01.jpg
And to be honest why even make a 1500 and a 1k and a 2k?? and then nothing until 5k? and then nothing upto 8k?
I wonder why the gray carbon specific glass stones are gray. Is it possibly so simple as this: if they put SiC in the stones now they classify them as corbon stones? Do the gray glass stones contain SiC?
Jigane, don’t sweat it. Most of what we use is designed for something else, partly because the Straight Razor market is so small.
You can over think a lot of this and it can lead you to stagnation. But if you get a consensus from folks that are using tools meant for other things with good results, you will probably have good results as well.
Really with Sharpton’s and most of the manufactures that we commonly use the results are pretty much the same. One may be a smidgen, faster, harder, softer or finer, but unless you are doing a lot of Pro/Production honing, it does not matter.
Enjoy
Those of you that own the 320 and 1500 pros; if you simply send them to me I can dispose of them for you in a safe manner. :deal:
Anyway all my new stuff arrived today, only took like 2 weeks.. iwasaki from hawaii, strop and diamonds from srd, and coticules in plural, and a blue 2 jap knife. I guess christmas came late this year :)
The iwasaki has a muted tip. Is that they way they do them these days? I was going to do it myself but not that big. Its about 2mm diagonally.
Wow I'm unpacking my stuff now as I write and to my surprise I was sent a coti slurry stone that is a natural combo stone.
I like my glass 2k. I have feeling it will never wear out with my limited number of knives. It feels a bit coarser than my pack of 3m 1500 perfect-it 3 sandpapers though. micro fine 1500 it says.
I believe they make so many similar grits because the matrix is different for different steels. They kind of say so on the 'obi' around the box and other references above. The 320 does not look or act like the 2k, it auto slurries a little beating a Gold Dollar into shape on it, more like the Chosera 600 or 1k.
Cheers, Steve
The coticules I was sent seems plenty fine to me at least. I also have a spyderco "unlapped" (only took the particles sticking up off it with a spyderco white triangle rod), its going to be fun comparing those.
I'm also starting to look into usb microscopes. to quantify the results.
Shooter, while honing is far off in the distance for me as I just got my first straight on 1/23/16, I was just curious. You mention less than 3% of razors can handle the 30K. Is that due to steels or is it just little imperfections in the manufacturing process that preclude most razors from benefiting from the 30K?
Also, with regards to the edge...too aggressive? FWIW, I learned on a shavette for 3 months before coming to the SR. I can take a feather in the shavette and get BBS shaves all over my face save for the chin and under the nose (DFS on both them) without razor burn or even a cut, so long as I do not try to rush anything. Is such an edge comparable to the 30K?
First, lets put things in perspective, but remember that we are talking about synthetics. A normal whisker, for a razor, is literally the equivalent of cutting a pure copper strand of the same diameter. Now, lets look at the cutting edge of the razor, the finer the edge, the more fragile the edge is & starts chipping away. So in a nutshell, the GS30K will make the edge on most razors just too fine, with just 2-3 light x strokes. Even if you have a hard razor that can handle the edge, the shave from such a razor is what I consider quite "crisp"...almost spooky to shave with. I personally like a semi crisp edge, but that edge is too much for even me and I shave a lot during the week with feather DE blades now days.
I passed my 30K around a bit for others to experiment with and ended up selling it to a machinist up north.
From my experience, talking synthetics only, the G20 is about as fine of a hone as a normal every day quality razor can handle. Natural stones are a whole other ball of wax & IMO should be approached only after you are a seasoned honer.
I substantiated my findings with some of the more experienced honers & their findings were the same, you will find some conversations on the stone if you use the search box at the top right of the home page.
Now that is an interesting observation, and really one worthy of a separate thread.
While I don’t have a Shapton 30K, I have experienced much the same with film and too many laps on a GS20 or high grit nano grit pastes.
Feathers are not for everyone and for some razors high grit stones and paste and too many laps will cause edge failure. Sometimes you can get a handful of great shaves, then they fail.
Really I too think we are talking about the edge of performance of a synthetic hone/paste, add in a vintage razor of unknown history… It would be interesting to see what number of razors that can handle a synthetic of that caliber.
Probably why, old Sheffield’s seem to prefer old Slates so well.
Anyone have a good lapping protocol for the glass stones? My 500 has been acting very strange and lost a lot of cut post lap. Only lapped at 220. Final refresh with something coarser?
Mine did that too, I looked at it under the microscope. I found that the slurry had filled the stone as I was only using a little water. I re-lapped it under constant running water and the problem went away. Rinse it off real good, under the sprayer if you have one.
I will give it a try. It been really inconvenient. I lapped it coarsely to true it and remove swarf and I don't want to say glaze, but the stone went into some very odd halfway state. Odd binder, but maybe to be expected to be able to sell such a thin hone and have it be viable.
My 200 (or 220) is dished and I have left it that way because of this. I only use it when freehanding a new knife or razor, but even then not much any more. These stones excell imo from 2K up.
There is a lot to like with the glass stones. They are hard, don't load with metal the way regular Japanese waterstones do, very generous surface area, small form factor, pretty much splash and go, the lapping issue is just horrible though
Thank you very much for this info! :)
I remember seeing one of Nick Shaves' videos where he was with somebody that did a hone on GS Shaptons in the sequence of 1k, 4k, 8k, 16k, and 30k. I'll have to check it out again, but I am certain the guy was honing a stainless razor. Since I have a carbon steel razor, this was especially useful information.
As I said, honing is still a ways off for me as I only have had my razor 4 days now. But even if I was ready to place an order for a set of Shaptons, I saved myself over 350 dollars alone by learning it was best overall for me to skip the 30k. :)
This is why there is nothing that beats a Japanese whetstone in shaving edges- the edge retention and top shave quality are due to the refined edge without deep damaging stria- naturals don't over hone. They heal and they refine well past what any synthetic can do. That's why I was none to impressed with my 20k. which for the record IIRC has smaller particles than the shapton 30k.
I like the Shapton Glass, I have the 1000, 4000, 8000, 16000. I like the feel when sharpening on them. The stone maintenance is about as minimal as it gets. As for wearing them out I think if you sharpened knives professionally maybe, but as a hobbyist I won't wear them out. Their lapping plate/stone is really nice too. I will get the 30000 eventually but at $400 I just finished with half micron diamond on a strop which is a similar finish. So to me the flatness and the minimal maintenance and easy of storage are really the selling points.
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Was it mentioned that some Shapton Glass exist in two versions, HR and HC? I have the HR 1-16k glass stones (white color), which I love. I also have 4 and 8k in HC (grey color, I believe a 6 exists too). I get a better polish with the 8k HC than I do with the 16k HR....go figure (anyone else have same experience?). You can see and read about the HR (and HC) glass stones at Dictum and Aftramestokyo.
https://www.dictum.com/en/sharpening...rigPageSize=12
SHAPTON Glass Stone High Carbon 8000 grit (HC model)
The grass is greener :D
The video you are speaking of was the Perfect Edge with Howard.
I have all the Shapton stone’s including the HC . I think the Naniwa snow whiter and gouken fuji are better 8 k stones. I also have the suehiro 20 k which I like more than the Shapton 30 k. I started out with the Naniwa but got tired of the warping issues and seldom use any more.
I just bought a Yurii consul 11/8 from a seller in USA, he shipped it to me in Italy, I used it as soon as is arrived. The bes shave of my life, the Stirling Alcoholic Splash I used it was like fresh water on my face, absolutely not hurting.
I asked the guy that sold me the razor how he honed it before to ship it.
Progression of Shapton GS finishing on 16k.
I just bought the Gs, AMAZING SHAVE!!!!