I have three hones, cushion strop buck, gem, and lithide . I have looked for these names but have not found much. Any info and or direction would be appreciated. Thank you.
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I have three hones, cushion strop buck, gem, and lithide . I have looked for these names but have not found much. Any info and or direction would be appreciated. Thank you.
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Well, they are barber hones that primarily are used for maintaining the edge of a razor that already is capable of shaving. Do you have any shaving or honing experience?
What is their condition? Are you able to post photos of them?
Attachment 252549Attachment 252550Attachment 252551Quote:
Originally Posted by Utopian
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I have only experience with knives and wood working tools. Thanks.Quote:
Originally Posted by RickWY
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Wow those look like they are in great condition, the one may be new old stock (NOS).
Basically as stated above they are used to maintain a shave ready edge. The premiss is that at regular intervals you will do a few strokes on the hones to keep your edge in great shaving condition. In theory, if you did 4 to 6 passes once every week or two, or perhaps monthly, depending on your beard and shaving habits, you could maintain your razors edge indefinitely. That of course goes with the pretense that you are stropping every shave on linen and leather.
I think the hones are new. Do I just use one or progress on each stone?Quote:
Originally Posted by RezDog
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They are pretty much all just finishers. There would be no progression. Just use one or the other. You will figure out which one you like better easily enough. It's all about the feel of the shave.
Very good thank you!Quote:
Originally Posted by RezDog
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They are probably all in the 8k-12k range and will be aggressive to very aggressive so don't spend a lot of strokes on them.
They do look very nice to NOS condition!!!
Thanks RobQuote:
Originally Posted by rodb
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IF you know how to shave and IF you can perform an adequate honing stroke and IF you have started with a properly honed razor, then any of those will be adequate for maintaining your razor(s) indefinitely.
When you notice any diminishment in the quality of your shave, do 4 to 6 very light (as in weight of the blade only) strokes on one of the hones. Then clean the blade, strop, and shave. Repeat whenever needed. That is all that you will ever need to keep your razors shaving sharp.
And I forgot to mention, those are very nice hones!
Modine, a member here, has reviewed many barber hones on Razorandstone.
Barber Hone Reviews
Thank you. I have been reading them. Rezdog sent me the same way. Found two of my hones discussed so far. Good info [emoji1360]Quote:
Originally Posted by Kees
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Here's a link to how to use those barber hones.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tP-GUeN_yBs
Thank you very informative.Quote:
Originally Posted by cudarunner
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If you avoid lapping your barber hones, they will perform better than however Modine described their performance.
I never saw the sense in lapping a barbers hone. The usable surface structure is not the same IMO as the center of the hone.
Thank you both!
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I think my hones are in really good shape.
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Making an attempt to save one that's too scratched up to use otherwise is about the only reason to imo. Getting them cleaned up and burnished well enough to perform like they used to...seems to be easier said than done. Still in the experimental/testing phase with a Swaty I have that needed one side cleaned up. I think next time I do a touch up I'll use the face I haven't lapped for comparison purposes, but in theory it should be the same material throughout the hone, the burnish just gets shot to heck when it's lapped.Quote:
Originally Posted by nun2sharp
It'd be nice to know more about how they were manufactured, that might make it easier to restore/resurface damaged hones. But whatever they did to the surface after kiln firing it to make them perform so well seems to be a bit of a lost trade secret.
Well it's not really a trade secret, it's just a matter of mechanics. Often the hones that degrade after lapping are those that were resin bound. The abrasive and resin are mixed and then pressed.
Just like concrete, it's an aggregate of multiple materials and sizes of material, and the top surface is usually the finest. Lapping these down too far can result in a coarser hone. The same goes for those hones that the binder softens on over time - they were never meant to release much of their grit - and if they do it can be disastrous for the razor edge.
The barber hones that have a clay binder and are fired as well as the silicon carbide barber hones such as Carboloy seem to be okay to lap/flatten as long as you bring them up to a very high finish afterward. Others I would be wary of lapping unless you don't mind losing the hone if it goes bad.
The ones with clay binders are specifically the ones I'm thinking of. If I had any idea a B. hone was made of resin I wouldn't attempt it for all of the reasons you mentioned. But I figure the clay ones had to be surfaced at the factory, and I imagine they had some simple/quick method of getting it done.
I doubt they spent the same amount of time surfacing each individual stone that I have sanding the Swaty flat, polishing it, then burnishing. Well, I'm sure right out of the kiln they'd really only have to burnish the hones, but my question is what method did they use for that? Sanding disc, stone grinding wheel, cloth buffing wheel with paste, good old fashioned Arkansas stone and elbow grease?
I'm not clear as to why one would buy a barber's hone when you can get a cut down 12k Chinese hone for $15 from WD?
As a wise old fart who lives in the boonies of Idaho says; "Naturals are a Romance, Synthetics are a Science". With the Made by the C. H. Ina naturals they vary. However the grits in the barber hones were precisely graded. I'll take a good barbers hone over any C. H. Ina natural any day (Including the one I own).Quote:
Originally Posted by gcbryan
Basically what cudarunner said. Naturals are a crapshoot, there are people with the Chinese "12K" that can't get anywhere near a 6K edge off the hone. Not all of them behave the same. Some are medium grit and not at all comfortable to shave with, some have inclusions that make them unfit for honing (or need to be dug out).
Barber hones are something of a crapshoot too. You'll notice most aren't graded by any form of grit rating. But usually you can count on them being somewhere in the 8K ball park, some a little higher, some a little lower, but most will leave you with an edge you can shave with if the hone's in good condition. A barber's hone will also get you where you want to be faster. 5-10 strokes on a barber's hone every couple of weeks and your edge will never need to see another hone. If you've got a good Chinese 12K, I'm willing to bet you'd do 10x that amount at a bare minimum when you need a refresh. I usually do more along the lines of 150 to 200.
Knowing what I know now, if I lost all my hones in some horrible boating accident and was given the choice between a barber hone and a Chinese 12K...give me the barber hone.
Would that logic not apply to Jnats as well? :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Marshal
Jnats are outside of my realm of experience. I don't own any, and haven't really had a chance to use them. So if you're asking would I choose a barber hone over a Jnat, yes - I would have to defer to the known quantity.
If you're asking if Jnats are hit and miss...well, they're still a naturally formed rock with no form of manufacturing quality control. They can have inclusions, and while the surface layer may make an excellent hone, you go down an eighth of an inch and there may be a very different type of material hidden beneath the good stuff you were using. But, it is also my opinion that Jnats are graded better than the Guangxi/Chinese 12K hones are. Sort of a you get what you pay for affair. Someone pays $400 for a Jnat, that puppy better work at least for a little while. Someone paid $40 for a Chinese hone? Exchange it for another rock and hope the second one suits them better.
I've had three C12K hones all very different, one fabulous, one very nice and one simply just ok. You will also have to do many laps as they are slow. Don't get me wrong, I love the edges from my best one, they just might not be for everyone and there is a learning curve just like any natural.
Barber hones and all synthetics are all very consistent
Quote:
Originally Posted by gcbryan
So it seems we have lots opinions and good reasons for them, but I got to thinking where do the tri hone set up and the Arkansas stones fit in?
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Norton Tri Hones are Only for Knives. At least in my humble opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by RickWY
As far as the Arks go, I've only played with a hard black so I'm unqualified to answer.
Ok thanks. So as bad as the edges get the razor hones like I have will be the go to hones?Quote:
Originally Posted by cudarunner
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Depends on the tri-hone system. I've seen a few variations. If it's the soft/hard/translucent-surgical black variety? You can get an edge on your straight that you'll love, if you burnish the Translucent/Black appropriately.Quote:
Originally Posted by RickWY
Some of the ones with a synthetic in place of the soft Arkansas can be used to set a bevel, but with a little patience you can do that on a soft Arkie too. I have a soft and hard 8x3 bench stone, and a few Translucents I use from time to time. They're good stuff.
Thank you
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If I understand your question correctly, then yes, in the right hands your barber hones can be all that is needed for maintaining your razors. Now, some elaboration on that is necessary...Quote:
Originally Posted by RickWY
I have maintained some of my razors with nothing but a couple of barber hones for almost 15 years now and they shave quite well. I COULD slightly improve their edges if I honed them on some of the other hones I have acquired over the years, but the improvement only would be noticeable to an experienced shaver but probably not to a novice. The reason for that is all of this stuff is a COMBINATION of tools and techniques. Neither can fully substitute for the other, but technique can get you a lot farther than a lot more tools.
Back to your question...
If you learn how to use them properly, then you can get very good edges using nothing but those barber hones that you already have.
Very well explained. Thank you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Utopian
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I maintained my two razors on a coticule and no-name Swaty barber hone for over 35 yrs before I bought a CH12K at Woodcraft. Mine is an incredible finisher but it takes A LOT of strokes. No worries though as I'm in no hurry.
Maintenance now is on a tranny that I drop and broke and was left with a 5 1/2" 'barber' sized hone. It works so well that I seldom have to go to the other stones.
