Naniwa + abrasive spray?

Being hands-on, a stubborn control freak, and very curious, I could only muster so much interest in straight shaving without being able to hone my own razors. I got my first straight 8 years ago but only recently figured out the honing part, so mostly it's been DE. For years I had a little clip of Lynn talking about Naniwa hones playing in my head, so when it came time to get a hone that's immediately where I went (20k fyi). When I got my hone, though, I struggled with it loading up - it got grey streaks of metal and wouldn't sharpen satisfactorily. I tried to remove the loaded-up surface with a DMT diamond plate and discovered that the slurry on the stone kept it from loading up, and I can now get great shaves (also using CrOx pasted strop). However, I don't want to grind away some stone every time I hit the hone, so my question is, are there abrasive sprays that are-water based that I can spray on my hone to accomplish the same thing? Alternately, if my Naniwa is loading up, is there something else I'm missing? Does anyone else kick up slurry on Naniwa or other artificial water stones?

First we need to sort out what your hone is, as Naniwa does not make a 20k hone.

12k sorry, not sure how I let that slide.

If you spray an abrasive atop the hone, you're going to end up wearing stone away.

In fact wearing stone away is a foregone conclusion, even without working up a slurry.

The best way to make your 12k Last would probably be to obtain a lower grit stone. Or be satisfied with using it as a one-stone solution with slurry.

You could obtain diamond or carborundum sprays and balsa or some sort of hard wood to use as a base if you were dead set on sprayed abrasives. But I don't think spraying abrasives on top of a hone designed to auto slurry (to some degree) will really prolong it's life span.

I'd watch GSsixguns videos on youtube and use your DMT the same way he does to *freshen* your Naniwa. Yes, it does wear away the surface very lightly. Yes, the slurry keeps the hone clean and yes, the slurry wears away the top surface of your hone, just like a DMT does... that's why it stays clean looking.

Loading happens quicker when the hone surface is a solid, such as the Naniwa SS and Shapton Glass types. A porous hone will not load up as quickly, the swarf from honing falls into the pores of the honing surface, but eventually it will still load up and become less effective. The grit in *any* hone also wears from use, and the only thing you can do is remove the worn grit by either abrading it away with something like a DMT, a wet/dry sandpaper or loose lapping grit (slurry), unless the binder is so soft that it releases the grit by itself as it dulls. We often refer to that type of hone as an auto-slurrying hone. The same idea is used in grinding wheels, such as for hardened tool steel (these wheels are often white in colour). As soon as the grit dulls slightly, the increased grinding pressure causes the worn grit to tear away from the wheel and a new, fresh, sharp piece of grit, is exposed.

Wearing your stone is unavoidable, slurry may or may not be beneficial to the honing process for you, it's a personal thing, based on your style of honing. I frequently use slurries to speed up honing, but I always seem to finish with clean water as I find slurries produce less desirable results for a finish.

Your Naniwa is good for lots and lots of razors.... I know I'll never wear mine out in my lifetime, but guys like Lynn and Glen who hone for $, actually hone enough to wear them to the point of needing replacement.... but it takes a LOT of razor honing.

Regards

Christian

No, unfortunately that is the nature of that line of stones, the Super Stone, Specialty, or whatever they are now called.

But on the bright side, it currently has no equal, at the price. Just do a quick lap and your good.

You can eliminate some of the residue on the hone just by rubbing your hand on it; but your diamond plate still will occasionally need to be used to clear it off. The thing is, it takes very little abrasion by the diamond plate to remove the loaded streaks. Yes, you will "grind away some stone every time" but it will be a trivial amount. The Naniwa Specialty or SuperStone 12k probably will last you your lifetime even with regular refreshing unless you are honing professionally. I understand that you don't want to waste your hone but regular refreshing ensures that your hone works at its full potential.

Regarding your other questions...

If you do add some other abrasive onto your hone, it's quite likely that the added abrasive also will cause wear on your 12k. If so, it will defeat the purpose of trying to prevent your 12k's wear.

Your Naniwa is loading up because it is accumulating steel. Some hones load up and some don't, but the SuperStones do. It does not mean that you are doing anything wrong.

Like all stones, when used to hone then they will remove stone. I use Naniwa exclusively and finish with a Suehiro 20k. On all my Naniwa stones I do as Kaptain zero said, like gssixgun video, half a dozenfigure 8's before each razor gives you clean fresh stone to hone with. You really don't lose much stone. If you are a hobbyist your Naniwa's will last ages, no need to consider hones abrading away, just doesn't happen.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kaptain_zero

Wearing your stone is unavoidable, slurry may or may not be beneficial to the honing process for you, it's a personal thing, based on your style of honing. I frequently use slurries to speed up honing, but I always seem to finish with clean water as I find slurries produce less desirable results for a finish.

Your Naniwa is good for lots and lots of razors.... I know I'll never wear mine out in my lifetime, but guys like Lynn and Glen who hone for $, actually hone enough to wear them to the point of needing replacement.... but it takes a LOT of razor honing.


Regards

Christian

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IIRC, Lynn said his stones last about 2500 razors. That is a lot of honing!

And using those numbers plugged into a calculator shows that honing 1 razor, every single day of the year, the hone would last for 6.84 years. Drop that down to a more reasonable one razor a week, every single week of the year, and so on, throughout it's lifespan, you will have to replace that hone after 48 years (unless you drop and break it first of course).

Now, guys like Glen and Lynn will likely hone more like 4 to 8 razors a day and so they expect to go through their hones every couple years or so, and those replacements are included in the cost of getting your razor honed by these guys.

Regards

Kaptain "What me worry?" Zero