My first time honing... one good, one not so good

Greetings Gents. I tried my hand at honing for the first time on a Norton 4/8k (thanks Speedster). I have read a ton of useful info on SRP and watch a bunch of videos that were all helpful. I decided to try my first hone with Lynn's circle method (the 40 circles, 10 X strokes with pressure, the 40 circles, 10 X strokes with no pressure on the 4k side and 10 X strokes on the 8k side) I also used one piece of tape. Well my Wade & Butcher went from dull to shave ready first time and shaved excellent! Now my Cattaraugus Green Lizard... I wouldn't try to cut open a box with it! I did the circle method 4 x's over and nothing. So I've been reading a bunch more on here and I am guessing that maybe I need to get a lower grit stone and work my way up the ladder to the 8k? Is the Green Lizard a different kind of metal? Stainless? any advice for me is appreciated. Thank You

Good job on the WB. That Green Lizard is American steel, which is probably a good bit harder than typical Sheffield steel. I don't suppose you have the Norton or other 1k stone, do you? It would make setting that challenging bevel easier.

If you can connect with a mentor (and I believe there are several on LI) you will get through months of trial and error in a few hours, and get to try some different rocks at the same time...

Elbow up, good posture, stable work surface along with some time with a mentor.
You have studied the process so it will come together...

And you will like it...

Good advice already, would just add that if the Green Lizard is a fairly thin hollow grind, it will flex under pressure and cause you to hone behind the edge. Use a permanent marker on the bevels and then do a couple of laps with light pressure and check to see if you are honing to the edge. If not, ease back and try again. With thin blades, you must let the stone do the work. Also, since you are just starting out, a single layer of electrical tape on the spine will protect it from wear as you learn the ropes and will also move the contact point further towards the edge. If you are using tape, check it periodically and replace whenever you see visible wear on it - this will maintain the honing geometry and keep you honing at the edge.

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Originally Posted by ScoutHikerDad

Good job on the WB. That Green Lizard is American steel, which is probably a good bit harder than typical Sheffield steel. I don't suppose you have the Norton or other 1k stone, do you? It would make setting that challenging bevel easier.

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Thank you for the info on the steel. I do not have another stone other then the Norton altho I did find these packed away in one of my boxes from years ago...
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...but I dont think I want to run any of my razors across them. They are Arkansas stones that used to sharpen my knives on years and years ago with oil not water.

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Originally Posted by sqzbxr

Good advice already, would just add that if the Green Lizard is a fairly thin hollow grind, it will flex under pressure and cause you to hone behind the edge. Use a permanent marker on the bevels and then do a couple of laps with light pressure and check to see if you are honing to the edge. If not, ease back and try again. With thin blades, you must let the stone do the work. Also, since you are just starting out, a single layer of electrical tape on the spine will protect it from wear as you learn the ropes and will also move the contact point further towards the edge. If you are using tape, check it periodically and replace whenever you see visible wear on it - this will maintain the honing geometry and keep you honing at the edge.

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I will try the marker. Thank you. I was using tape and will give it another go

The Norton will cut that steel just fine. As I mentioned before, go easy on the pressure and check for flexing.

How about a pic of the razor and the stones?

What did you lap the 4 & 8k with?

What did the edge look like when you started, any chips?

Yes, you can set the bevel on the 4k. 2 layers of tape on the spine and do circles on a freshly lapped 4k until the bevels are meeting fully.

60X magnification will tell you when you get there.

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Originally Posted by Euclid440

How about a pic of the razor and the stones?

What did you lap the 4 & 8k with?

What did the edge look like when you started, any chips?

Yes, you can set the bevel on the 4k. 2 layers of tape on the spine and do circles on a freshly lapped 4k until the bevels are meeting fully.

60X magnification will tell you when you get there.

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- I did not lap the stone.
- There were not chips that I could see with naked eye
- The only camera I have is on my phone so Im not sure it will be of any help
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- as I said the Wade & Butcher came out great in the first pass around
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Having a 50% success rate from the beginning is pretty good!

Did you change the tape regularly while you did the honing?

Hi where on Long Island are you? I am in Islip and would be more than happy to help you out. I have a spare King 1000 to set that bevel on. Could be fun.

Well, first you want to lap your stones flat, to ensure there are no rough spots.

Get a couple sheets of 220 and 320 Wet & Dry, and a steel cookie sheet from the dollar store or thrift stone.

Mark a grid with a pencil on the stone, wet the sheet and sand paper and lap it till the pencil grid comes off. Keep rinsing all the grit off the paper.

Remark the grid and it should come off completely in 2-3 laps, if not keep lapping until it will come off in 2-3 laps. Mark a new grid as often as needed. Then finish on the 320 grit. Make sure to bevel or round the corners of the stone.

A diamond plate will make lapping and resurfacing your stones much easier, you should resurface the stones each time you use them and occasionally if they load up. You can buy a 400/1000 grit plate for $35 from Chef Knives to Go.

You are riding on the heel stabilizer on the Green Lizard and that is keeping the heel half of the edge off the stone.

There are several threads, one recently on correcting heels. Re-shaping the heel will move the heel corner of the edge forward of the stabilizer and allow the edge to sit flat on the stone for you to hone an edge on it.

Once you lap the stones and correct the heel, it should hone easily with the 4k.

Sounds like Hacker can help you out.

@Euclid440 -- The stone was already lapped flat and corners beveled from previous uses before I sold it to DD (basically, each and every honing with a DMT325 as Glen does). That Norton 4/8 was the stone that I used up at Glen's north woods retreat when he first taught me how to hone. Of course, he subjected to me to his YouTube limelight torture and filmed the session. Nothing in life is free, eh? ;)

@DupreesDiamond -- Definitely take up Hacker7's offer to help you one on one with some honing guidance You will no doubt risk getting the urge to buy a 1k hone and a diamond plate for yourself. Welcome to the rabbit hole! :D

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Originally Posted by Utopian

Having a 50% success rate from the beginning is pretty good!

Did you change the tape regularly while you did the honing?

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I did change it when I saw where.

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Originally Posted by Hacker7

Hi where on Long Island are you? I am in Islip and would be more than happy to help you out. I have a spare King 1000 to set that bevel on. Could be fun.

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Thank You Hacker I sent you a PM

The Wade Butcher also, could use some heel re shaping as it looks like the edge ends, right at the stabilizer and that you are honing on the stabilizer, the heel may not be fully honed.

A few strokes on a diamond plate will fix both of them and allow the edge to sit flat on the hone.