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I am looking to replace my Norton 4k in my progression. I currently go from a Naniwa 1k, to a Norton 4k, to a Norton 8k, to a Japanese Natural for finishing. Any votes on what would be the best replacement for the Norton 4k? I really hate the way the Norton 4k feels compared to the rest. I'd love to replace it with a Natural stone, but I can't find a clear replacement.
A natural ? Coticule with slurry and then with water before you go to your J-nat. Even better a coticule combo and do the bbw with slurry and then the yellow with water before the j-nat.Quote:
Originally Posted by joes978
I have an Ohira Tomae on it's way to audition for that spot. Currently I am using a smaller version of the Tomae or my Aoto or both.
A good Aoto could replace the 3-4K slot, but good ones aren't so easy to find.
There are a huge number of synthetics in the 3-5K range. I think most here would send you to the Naniwa Super Stone.
I was thinking about the Coticule, but I heard the BBW was too slow and the Coticule is really a different kind of sharpening and not complimentary to the Suita stone. Plus SRD recommended I go with Naniwa or a Shapton instead.
Isn't Ohira Tomae considered a finishing stone? Most are estimated at around 10,000 grit. I looked at the Aoto, but the only good one I can find is in Germany and the shipping is outrageous.
I like the norton 4k i found after several serious lapping's the 4k feels a lot less grainy try and see first.Other than that the naniwa 3k 8k they have a nice fell to them. Me being a coticule user would seriously recomend just yellow coticule. I often use my dmt 1200 or 1k norton then rest with coticule . I recomend a nice 6x2 coticule eventualy you will find it is all you need from start to finish.
Has anyone tried to use a Japanese natural after a Coticule?
I am still playing with the progression. The Tomae I have is softer than the others and cuts very fast. It seems to remove the scratches from the 2K very quickly and leaves an edge that is refined by the stones that come after.Quote:
Originally Posted by joes978
I have no idea of its grit.
Echoing what Gary said, I like the norton 4k too. I dont know anything about J-nats. If you are okay with going synthetic instead of natural, as SRD said, the naniwas are really great stones IME. I mostly hone with those nowadays.
The 1k, 3k, 5k, 8k and 12k being the sequence I use. Lynn and holli4 get great results with the 1k, 5k, 8k, and 12k IIRC. They leave the 3k out but I just like to pyramid with the 3/5 before moving up in a progression. Different strokes as they say. :)
yeah, it's hard to fit a Coticule or any other Natural stone precisely in that 4K slot IMHO. Considering how much variation there is in each vein (and from stone to stone within the veins even), that's one thing that makes it tough. Also, with a heavy slurry, the grit rating would be lower than 4K. With a milky slurry, it cuts like a stone in the 4-6K range, but at a misty slurry it cuts like a stone in the 8-10K or so range... When working on a progression, I personally think you are introducing more variables than you might want by going to a natural like that...
As for Japanese Natural after Coticule, yes it can be done. However, when used properly, they both make excellent finishing stones. I personally don't see much value in using them together (and yes I've experimented with it). If I wanted to max out an edge off of one or the other, I'd use Chrom Ox.
If it were me, I'd just get a Naniwa 3 or 5K since you don't like the Norton. Best of luck :)
I tried looking for naturals for all spots after my 1k, and before long I got tired of hunting and spending money and messing with slurries and inconsistant results and spending so much time honing. I'm now using Norton 1k, Naniwa 5k, Naniwa 8k and then either a vintage Thurry or an Asagi. Granted, you've got to find what makes you happy, but when you say "best replacement" my idea of the "best" in the 4k slot is a synthetic, and at the moment my preference is Naniwa.
For what it's worth, a big part of why I like the Naniwas is the way they feel, they feel smooth and "soft", actually, they remind me of my Aoto but without the mess.
Well, I ordered a Belgian Blue, so I guess I'll see if its any good. I can always buy a $30 Naniwa later. If the Blue works well it might tempt me to get a coticule.
The BBW came in and I haven't tested a razor yet, but I sharpened one of my pocket knives that is made from the CPM-S30V ultra hard stainless steel. Its always had the grind marks from where it was obviously sharpened at the factory with a coarse wheel. The BBW removed the grind marks in very little time (with a heavy slurry). The Norton 4k hardly ever made a dent in them. On top of that, it felt alot sharper than 4k sharp before I moved on to 8k, and then the suita. When it was all said and done, it could shave arm hair, not as good as a razor though. So this stone is definately worth it with a slurry and sharpens fast. Doesn't seem to do much without the slurry though. Good replacement for a Norton 4k.
Great call on the BBW. Have you read the honing on japanese naturals thread on Barts website for coticules? It has fantastic information about the J-Nats which may negate you needing to use any stone other than your J-Nat. :)