Newby Honing Question

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03-07-2010, 12:29 AM
ganboyi

Newby Honing Question

Ok, I know you guys get alot of honing questions so I will try and be as specific and clear as I can be in the hopes of an easy answer for those who know. I want to start learning to hone but am not sure exactly what hones I need.

First, I will tell you what sort of honing I would like to do. Most of my razors (all except for one which is one I was sent to practice honing on) have been sent to me shave ready. Since I live in Taipei I cannot find the Norton stones (I was recommended to get the Norton combination 4k/8k possibly with the 1k) and think I may be more successful getting the Naniwa since Japan is just next door.

1. Would a Japanese Naniwa Superstone 3000 & 8000 Grit Combo Stone be sufficient to get a a razor to shave ready conditions if it has already been professionally honed at one period in time?

2. Do I need a 1k stone? How do I know if I need to set the bevel. I.e. with the stone that has been sent to me to practice honing on?

3. Do I need a finer stone to finish on? I read that I may only need a coticule? Or perhaps a Barber's hone? Or (which would probably be easier for me to find here) a Naniwa 12k would do the trick? Or do I just need to paste the linen side (I only really use the leather side to be honest) of my strop?

So I guess I am really asking which of these options would you recommend:

A) A Naniwa Superstone 3000 & 8000 Grit Combo Stone ONLY
B) A Naniwa Superstone 3000 & 8000 Grit Combo Stone with a Naniwa Superstone 12000
C) A Naniwa Superstone 3000 & 8000 Grit Combo Stone with a pasted strop.
D) a Naniwa Superstone 12000 ONLY
E) Some sort of paste for linen side of strop ONLY (reccomendations?)

Or perhaps as Glen recommended I should just sit tight and shave and srop for about six months more - I'm into my 3rd month. I thought getting into honing would be something good to get into relatively early on and practice with razors I don't care too much for just so that when I really needed to later on I had some sort of experience with the motions - I've never sharpened any sort of blade before. Your thoughts and advice are most welcome. Thank you!
03-07-2010, 12:39 AM
gssixgun

Your set up B. would be perfect for everything but restorations

You can set a bevel on the 3k it just take longer than on a 1k so other than the bad ones yer fine...
03-07-2010, 12:45 AM
ganboyi

Thanks Glen,

Very helpful - I know EXACTLY what I'm looking for. Also, think this is the easiest one to get my hands on over here.

Cheers! :)
03-07-2010, 02:48 PM
ganboyi

Hi Glen - or anyone else actually,

Do you think getting a crappy double arrow / gold dollar (unhoned direct from a Chinese seller) and using that to practice on would be a good exericise that could be done with A Naniwa Superstone 3000 & 8000 Grit Combo Stone with a Naniwa Superstone 12000?

Thanks!
03-07-2010, 03:24 PM
JimmyHAD

The only way I learned to hone razors was by honing razors. More razors is better IME. :) You could probably make out okay with what you have. If not you could add a coarser stone or something in between 3 and 8 if necessary.
03-07-2010, 03:25 PM
gssixgun

With the fact that you are in Taipei thrown in the mix, I would have to say for you, yes it is a good option... Just make sure you understand that there are a ton of problems that come with some of them, so not getting a good edge might actually be the razors fault....
03-07-2010, 03:31 PM
jockeys

Quote:

Originally Posted by ganboyi

1. Would a Japanese Naniwa Superstone 3000 & 8000 Grit Combo Stone be sufficient to get a a razor to shave ready conditions if it has already been professionally honed at one period in time?

2. Do I need a 1k stone? How do I know if I need to set the bevel. I.e. with the stone that has been sent to me to practice honing on?

3. Do I need a finer stone to finish on? I read that I may only need a coticule? Or perhaps a Barber's hone? Or (which would probably be easier for me to find here) a Naniwa 12k would do the trick? Or do I just need to paste the linen side (I only really use the leather side to be honest) of my strop?

1. yes, although you will most likely want a little more polish on it
2. not unless you chip the razor or start doing resto work
3. need, maybe, prefer, definitely. a pasted strop will do the same trick, no worries.
03-07-2010, 11:09 PM
ganboyi

thank you guys, will let you know how i get on. cheers
03-09-2010, 11:00 AM
ganboyi

me again

hey there,

I wondered what were the pros and cons of getting a good barber's hone as a finishing stone instead of something like a 12k naniwa? I've seen that they are definitely cheaper - do they do the same job?

Thanks
03-09-2010, 01:03 PM
JimmyHAD

Quote:

Originally Posted by ganboyi

hey there,

I wondered what were the pros and cons of getting a good barber's hone as a finishing stone instead of something like a 12k naniwa? I've seen that they are definitely cheaper - do they do the same job?

Thanks

A good barber hone is meant to refresh a razor that needs a quick touch up. When I got started I used a Swaty as a finisher following the 8k because that was all that I had. Once I got a high grit finisher I used it. The 12k is 8" long and the average barber hone is 4". The barber hone will do if that is all that you have ..... and you get a 'good' one but if I could only have one or the other I would pick the 12k without hesitation. Just IMHO.
03-09-2010, 01:06 PM
ganboyi

and a coticule would be more like a barber's or a 12k? thanks.
03-09-2010, 01:11 PM
JimmyHAD

Quote:

Originally Posted by ganboyi

and a coticule would be more like a barber's or a 12k? thanks.

Maybe a premature diagnosis but I think you have the symptoms of the onset of HAD (hone acquisition disorder) :) A coticule is a different animal and is cool to have in it's own right. Grit rating is debatable and individual within parameters but in general a coticule with water only is a finisher. IME it is not quite up to a 12k on average but due to the shape of the garnets that form the abrasive it will provide a sharp and a smooth edge. With your setup I would still get the 12k for now and add a coticule later to experiment with and provide a bit of variety.
03-09-2010, 01:16 PM
ganboyi

hahahaha i was just about to say, does the HAD in JimmyHAD stand for exactly that... thank you. and another question while your here. is there a reccomendation on using say a norton combo 8k/4k with a naniwa 12k or should it be norton and norton, naniwa and naniwa. hahah random question i know
03-09-2010, 01:45 PM
JimmyHAD

Quote:

Originally Posted by ganboyi

hahahaha i was just about to say, does the HAD in JimmyHAD stand for exactly that... thank you. and another question while your here. is there a reccomendation on using say a norton combo 8k/4k with a naniwa 12k or should it be norton and norton, naniwa and naniwa. hahah random question i know

I sometimes use the Norton 4/8 and follow up with the naniwa 12k or a Shapton pro 15k. Sometimes I go all naniwa or all shapton pro. If Norton made a higher grit finisher I'd probably do all norton when I was starting with them but they don't so we mix it up. I also sometimes follow the nortons with naturals, coticule or escher. With the naniwas or shaptons I tend to stay within the brands during the progression but even there I will sometimes follow the naniwa with the Shapton pro 30k. No rules, just try stuff and see how it works for you.
03-09-2010, 02:02 PM
ganboyi

cheers jimmy, will do.
03-13-2010, 09:35 PM
mrmaroon

Im with glen on the barber hone, a swaty 3 line was the only finisher I had until I got my coticule. But when I did get the coti WOW did it make a difference. It is really easy to get a wire edge on a barber hone as well. They are fun to play with though.
03-27-2010, 09:07 PM
snakyjake

I'm have the same question, and trying to learn from others in the same boat.

I read the Wiki and it read:

"The Norton 4/8 Combo is still a good tool for a new person to learn to hone with, but the Naniwa Super Stones really seem made for straight razors"

"a set of 1K, 5K, 8K and 12K should provide a lifetime"

"Shapton Glass stones are certainly a good alternative to the Naniwa Super Stones"

Therefore it looks like the top choices are Naniwa #1, Shapton #1, Norton #2. Maybe DMT fits in there somewhere too.

Maybe someone can chime in and help narrow down the choices.

Jake
03-27-2010, 09:52 PM
gary haywood

I'd go for the combo plus 12k naniwa. thats all you will need. Like some one said add a coticule when you have masterd the naniwa's. then you will have a natural polisher.The coticule is'nt easy to learn on. And they can vary.
03-28-2010, 12:50 AM
BHChieftain

Quote:

Originally Posted by ganboyi

Hi Glen - or anyone else actually,

Do you think getting a crappy double arrow / gold dollar (unhoned direct from a Chinese seller) and using that to practice on would be a good exericise that could be done with A Naniwa Superstone 3000 & 8000 Grit Combo Stone with a Naniwa Superstone 12000?

Thanks!

Hi,
I think it is a very good idea to use a "disposable" razor to practice honing. It takes awhile to get the muscle memory down, and it is easy to accidentally lift the razor and mar the bevel on the edge of hone in the beginning.

When I started, somebody on this site sent me a double arrow razor for free, under the condition that when I was done with it I'd send it to somebody else to practice honing... I've already fulfilled my obligation, but I hope you can find a cheap or free DA...

-Chief