What really is the best Finish Hone on the Planet ????

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06-11-2010, 02:44 PM
gssixgun

What really is the best Finish Hone on the Planet ????

Here are some rambling thoughts on why this is always such a hot topic..

First let me start by saying this, I either own or have at least tried way more hones then most, and way less then some...

From naturals to the Shapton 30k

Now let's purpose a test here:

Take one common Solingen made razor, and make it shave ready on say the Norton 1-4-8 then each day change the finish..

First day is the Norton 8k
next day we add a Coticule
next day we use a Thuringen
next day a Naniwa 10-12
next a Shapton 16-30
next an Escher
the next a Ch12
a Charlney Forest
a Arkansas super fine
a Japanese natural (OMG which one)
A Spyderco Ultra follows that
and
and
and

At the end of 2-3 weeks I say ok the best shave was X hone I tried them all and that is the conclusion..
Is that a true test of the hones???? Nope not even close, heck we didn't even use some of the hones correctly...

So now we change it and add in a few razors
a Sheffield wedge
a Spanish Filarmonica
an American steel hollow
A Swede
a TI
a Japanese razor
and
and
and

Now at the end of 1 year I say well I tested all the razors on all the hones and X hone is the best...

Was that an accurate test???? Nope, because all it told me was what my face liked so now we have to test everyones face on all the razors on all the hones and guess what the conclusion is????

Yep, that's right, quite a few different opinions out there
and that my friends is why on every single thread that we discuss this, all you ever really get is people's own favorite stone, just a simple opinion...

It makes for good discussion, but really it is all just personal opinion...

So in closing I must say that although there are tons of opinions on what to use, always remember that they are just that and nothing more... It is only your own face, that can ever decide what the best finishing hone is on the planet...

Now in my humble opinion that stone is.....................................:soapbox:

Heck personally I think the lower end of the spectrum is way more important anyway the bevel set to the sharpen stage... :)
06-11-2010, 02:51 PM
Slartibartfast

Similiar to "What is the best razor!??!!??" questions.

The best is whatever works for you.

Nice post glen.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Here are some rambling thoughts on why this is always such a hot topic..

First let me start by saying this, I either own or have at least tried way more hones then most, and way less then some...

From naturals to the Shapton 30k

Now let's purpose a test here:

Take one common Solingen made razor, and make it shave ready on say the Norton 1-4-8 then each day change the finish..

First day is the Norton 8k
next day we add a Coticule
next day we use a Thuringen
next day a Naniwa 10-12
next a Shapton 16-30
next an Escher
the next a Ch12
a Charlney Forest
a Arkansas super fine
a Japanese natural (OMG which one)
A Spyderco Ultra follows that
and
and
and

At the end of 2-3 weeks I say ok the best shave was X hone I tried them all and that is the conclusion..
Is that a true test of the hones???? Nope not even close, heck we didn't even use some of the hones correctly...

So now we change it and add in a few razors
a Sheffield wedge
a Spanish Filarmonica
an American steel hollow
A Swede
a TI
a Japanese razor
and
and
and

Now at the end of 1 year I say well I tested all the razors on all the hones and X hone is the best...

Was that an accurate test???? Nope, because all it told me was what my face liked so now we have to test everyones face on all the razors on all the hones and guess what the conclusion is????

Yep, that's right, quite a few different opinions out there
and that my friends is why on every single thread that we discuss this, all you ever really get is people's own favorite stone, just a simple opinion...

It makes for good discussion, but really it is all just personal opinion...

So in closing I must say that although there are tons of opinions on what to use, always remember that they are just that and nothing more... It is only your own face, that can ever decide what the best finishing hone is on the planet...

Now in my humble opinion that stone is.....................................:soapbox:

Heck personally I think the lower end of the spectrum is way more important anyway the bevel set to the sharpen stage... :)
06-11-2010, 02:52 PM
mainaman

Are we allowed to google the answer?:roflmao

In my opinion the second test is more valuable, there is this thing called "marriage" between steel and stone. Not all steels are going to behave similarly on one stone, the question is which stone of the myriad of finishers will give most consistent results with most steels used for razors? The one condition I feel needs to be kept constant is the stone progression before the finisher. I am not sure how variation in tempering of the same steel will affect the results, if at all.
06-11-2010, 02:55 PM
Stubear

Good post Glen!

But everyone knows the best finisher is the hone you dont have yet...! :D
06-11-2010, 02:59 PM
JimmyHAD

Cool topic Glen. As you and the posters who followed said, it is a matter of personal opinion and. if I may say so, isn't carved in stone. (pun intended) :) For some months now the yellow green escher has been my finisher of choice. I've got the Naniwa SS, Shapton pro up to 15 & 30k, charnley, and a good one, coticules and others. No J-nats but I have aspirations if the economy ever bounces back. All that said, next week or next month one of the other choices might be my favorite. Note that I'm saying favorite rather than best on purpose. I don't know about best. They are all good IME. :thinking:
06-11-2010, 03:00 PM
gssixgun

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stubear

Good post Glen!

But everyone knows the best finisher is the hone you dont have yet...! :D

HA !!!!! oh so true,,, the promise of the unknown hehehe
06-11-2010, 03:04 PM
gssixgun

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

Cool topic Glen. As you and the posters who followed said, it is a matter of personal opinion and. if I may say so, isn't carved in stone. (pun intended) :) For some months now the yellow green escher has been my finisher of choice. I've got the Naniwa SS, Shapton pro up to 15 & 30k, charnley, and a good one, coticules and others. No J-nats but I have aspirations if the economy ever bounces back. All that said, next week or next month one of the other choices might be my favorite. Note that I'm saying favorite rather than best on purpose. I don't know about best. They are all good IME. :thinking:

Jimmy Man it was you, Lynn, Randy, and Sham, that I was thinking about when I added the line "and way less than some" hehehe
06-11-2010, 03:28 PM
Lynn

Spot on Glen!!!

The ME factor will always be a variable both in technique and the feeling of the shave.

This is such a fun Sport!

Lynn
06-11-2010, 03:52 PM
Hawkeye5

Well, I'm way over my head in this company, but I agree the lower grit stones and bevel setting are the key to a sharp edge. I've proven such to myself more times than I care to admit. I must be a slow learner. :(

As to which finisher is the best, I again agree that it is the one that provides the final edge and shave you like on a particular razor.
06-11-2010, 05:21 PM
niftyshaving

Quote:

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Here are some rambling thoughts on why this is always such a hot topic..

First let me start by saying this, I either own or have at least tried way more hones then most, and way less then some...
...big snip...

Good post....

One thing that I have discovered is that sharp is
not key -- the shave it. I have found that
abrasive film ending up with 0.3 micron is just too
sharp and gives me nicks not unlike a Feather
is harsh. However by stropping with a light hand
on CrOx or CeOx that harshness can be reduced
and the shave improved.

So to add to Glenn's list there needs to be some
consideration on the strop. A second thing I have
discovered is that care while stropping is fully
as important as the final hone and from Norton 8K
and finer the shave depends ultimately on the strop
and the face being shaved.

I like to think that I am making the edge strop
ready when honing. The more I read from the
honemasters the more I notice their comments
with regard to final stropping. Stropping is
never discussed in cap letters but is so often
mentioned...

Which is a long winded way of saying that we must
include the finishing strop in this.

And then the day in day out strop comes to play too.
06-11-2010, 05:37 PM
gssixgun

LMAO Tom,
I was going to avoid the pastes and the final strop..:)
Way to toss more variables in the mix,, at this rate we will never find out what the best finish hone is :p :roflmao:roflmao:roflmao
06-11-2010, 06:32 PM
Memorael

Well if I have to choose one stone based on finish only not whether it is versatile or whatever I would choose a Jnat, those things give scary sharp a whole new definition. I don't think any other stone achieves the same result or comes close to it.
06-11-2010, 07:05 PM
niftyshaving

Quote:

Originally Posted by gssixgun

LMAO Tom,
I was going to avoid the pastes and the final strop..:)
Way to toss more variables in the mix,, at this rate we will never find out what the best finish hone is :p :roflmao:roflmao:roflmao

Well it is all part of the game if
you think "strop ready".

Bevel setting gets you hone ready.
Hones get you finish hone ready.
Finish hones get you strop ready.
Strops get you shave ready.

Stropping each day keeps you shave ready.

Back to topic, my favorite hone set this week is the SS12K
following a Norton 4/8K combo. To refresh an edge a short pyramid
on the 4/8K followed by a finish on the Super stone strops up very
well for me.
06-11-2010, 07:23 PM
thebigspendur

Of course some people's opinions on what's best are just more valid than others and some are down right astronomically correct and can never be refuted so if you don't agree with these people why your just inferior in every way.

Sorry, but Mr Sasquatch made me write this.:):):)
06-11-2010, 07:29 PM
huntmol

Great post! People tend to forget that YMMV

Some people shave straight off a Norton 8k and love it, while others won't let a razor touch their face until it's had 20 laps on a $1400 Nakayama. As always, different strokes for different folks.

The quest for the perfect shave is a dangerous road that just makes your significant other angry and your wallet empty! :rofl2:
06-11-2010, 07:38 PM
Joed

While I have probably used less than most as far as finishers goes I have been around tools and metal for quite some years. From my experience and practice I have found that it is not the tools that make the end product good but the craftsman behind them. A tool, or hone in this case, is only an extension of the mind and skills of the person using them. There is no magic bullet. The right tool for the right job is the easiest way to your goal having the skill to use it properly but making a silk purse out of a sow's ear is really a feat! There is no substitute for skill regardless of the tools at hand. ;)
06-11-2010, 07:42 PM
gary haywood

i was amazed when i finished on some cr.ox some years ago also coticule also the diamond spray. i have a yellow green escher to try out now thanxs to jimmy. it goes on.
06-11-2010, 07:55 PM
Piet

The best Finnish hone is probably the Wästilä whetstone.
06-11-2010, 08:30 PM
gssixgun

Good one Piet....:) good to see a "tongue firmly in cheek" sometimes....
06-11-2010, 08:44 PM
Jimbo

Best finishing stone? The answer is the same as the one I give when asked "Who is the best wife in the world?"

Mine.

I always think that if you can't be with the hone you love, love the hone you're with.

James.
06-11-2010, 08:49 PM
AFDavis11

I think the best Finnish hone is from Sweden.
06-11-2010, 09:38 PM
gugi

Quote:

Originally Posted by gssixgun

a Japanese natural (OMG which one)

OMG you bought another already???
06-11-2010, 11:17 PM
leadduck

Aw, man!!! And I just bought a couple of stones thinking this was going to easy!!
06-11-2010, 11:57 PM
niftyshaving

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piet

The best Finnish hone is probably the Wästilä whetstone.

Yes....Tampere University says a lot of fine
pointed things about these stones.
Study

I want one of those kitchen hones.
655 Wastila whetstone, Kitchen
https://www.brisa.fi/portal/index.ph...en&language=en
06-12-2010, 03:21 AM
dave5225

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joed

While I have probably used less than most as far as finishers goes I have been around tools and metal for quite some years. From my experience and practice I have found that it is not the tools that make the end product good but the craftsman behind them. A tool, or hone in this case, is only an extension of the mind and skills of the person using them. There is no magic bullet. The right tool for the right job is the easiest way to your goal having the skill to use it properly but making a silk purse out of a sow's ear is really a feat! There is no substitute for skill regardless of the tools at hand. ;)

Very true ! It's no so much , what you use . It's how well you use , what you have .
06-12-2010, 04:42 AM
holli4pirating

Great post, Glen; sticky it and wiki it. It's all relative - relative to what we measure with, what we measure against, and what the criteria of our measurement are.
06-12-2010, 05:13 AM
HNSB

What I got from this thread is that Glen is going to send everyone a different razor to shave with every day until we decide which one is the best.

Thanks Glen!
06-12-2010, 06:58 AM
gugi

Quote:

Originally Posted by HNSB

What I got from this thread is that Glen is going to send everyone a different razor to shave with every day until we decide which one is the best.

Thanks Glen!

no, no you got it wrong!!! what glen is trying to explain is that all of you must send him your best razors, then he will hone them on his best hones and send them to his best friend (yours truly) to shave with them in his best years and when he Finishes he'll tell you how each is best in its own best way.

so, everybody start packing your razors - glen's waiting.
06-13-2010, 07:27 PM
A_S

As someone who has developed a serious obsession with obscure honestones I've had the opportunity to play around with some much rarer articles and I have to say that Virginia Oilstone is about as close to perfection as anything I've ever come across. It is a species of novaculite, albeit somewhat softer than Arkansas Whetstones, yellow/ grey in colour with an almost imperceptible grain. The main quarry was some 5 miles NE of Louisa, but there were beds of similar material exposed in other locations in the state. I have two, one I use with CircleCut cutting oil, and one I've kept clean to experiment with. It is a great stone no matter what I've used it with, but it really comes into it's own with oil. Very fast cutter for something so fine, and if I wasn't so busy/ obsessed with experimenting with other stones, it would have been my go to hone a long time ago. I still want a Devonshire Oilstone though.:(

Kindest regards,
Alex
06-13-2010, 09:46 PM
hoglahoo

Quote:

Originally Posted by gugi

what glen is trying to explain is that all of you must send him your best razors, then he will hone them on his best hones and send them to his best friend (yours truly) to shave with them in his best years and when he Finishes he'll tell you how each is best in its own best way.

That sounds like a plan to me, because of course you'll need to send these out for shave-test standard evaluation in order to know how each is best in its own best way. And you know who has more profitable shave-ready standards of course :)
06-15-2010, 10:45 PM
stimpy52

Best stone to finish with

I want one of these.

http://www.interment.net/column/uplo...one-704138.jpg

A couple more days like this and I might consider field-dressing myself.
11-27-2010, 05:28 PM
offshoot

Quote:

Originally Posted by AFDavis11

I think the best Finnish hone is from Sweden.

You're propably right. Damn.