My first Japanese stone

HAD has hit me. I have a nice new set of Naniwas on their way to me and I just pushed the button on this:

Special natural Tomae very hard stone from Kyoto Hon Yama, hand-selected by Murray Carter. Best for razor sharpening.
GRIT: Approx. 30,000~ 40,000
DIMENSIONS: 5.4 X 3.2 X 0.8 inches
WEIGHT: 1.25 lbs.

I bought it as Murray seems to know a thing or two about sharpness and because it was inexpensive. So how did I do? Any opinions/experiences relating to Murray Carter's stones? What sort of finish should I expect in comparison to my coticule?

What does he know about razors?

I have no doubts about his abilities with knives and with sharpening them, and the stone looks nice enough in pictures, but my initial reaction to someone who puts a numerical grit rating on a natural stone doesn't really understand much about natural stones.

At the same time, I read that Murray has just got back from Japan where he talked to some Kyoto hone dealers himself, so if they told him it'd be good for razors I tend to believe it.

In my experience the price looks fair, at any rate.

Hmm, thanks for the reply. Guess I'll wait and try it out.

Judging by the pictures this hone is coarser than 30-40K.

I'm curious to know how you believe you can tell the coarse/fineness from the picture? I was there when those stones were purchased and held them in my own hands and I can't tell from the picture. BTW I'm not disagreeing with you as to grade since I didn't try them. I have, however, found that the feel of a stone much less it's picture can be very deceiving until you put it to steel.

I'm just curious if the stone came and if you've tested it yet.

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Originally Posted by namuh1

I'm curious to know how you believe you can tell the coarse/fineness from the picture? I was there when those stones were purchased and held them in my own hands and I can't tell from the picture. BTW I'm not disagreeing with you as to grade since I didn't try them. I have, however, found that the feel of a stone much less it's picture can be very deceiving until you put it to steel.

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The grit estimate was listed in the description of the stone of the site.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mainaman

The grit estimate was listed in the description of the stone of the site.

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Namuh was referring to Kees' post, where he said:

Quote:

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Judging by the pictures this hone is coarser than 30-40K.

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I'm curious about this, too.

For those of you who are interested in Murray Carter products I just learned yesterday that he is moving his facilities to new quarters. As a result, he is having the biggest sale on every product and service and course that he offers. This is a chance to purchase anything he has in stock at 40% off! The link is:

Carter Cutlery News - Special 40% Off Sale Update ARCHIVE

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Disburden

I'm just curious if the stone came and if you've tested it yet.

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I have the stone, but have not had the time to test it properly yet. It is a very heavy stone (in comparison to my synthetics and coticule) and the surface feels a lot finer to touch than my coti. I did make up a quick slurry with one of my nagura and began refinishing the edge of one of my dovo's but got called out for work and had to pack it all back up after 6 or so laps so, to be continued....

If a facility move is in process, the sale won't last long & the need to know how it works is urgent.

'Can't wait to hear how it does.

Pinklather I have to apologize. I did not realize that mentioning Carter's sale was equivalent to advertising, which I was told was not allowed when another post of mine yesterday was 'parked' by the moderator as disallowed advertising. Despite my feelings that I was simply passing on information and not placing an ad, if the moderators are in agreement that this violates the rules I must and will respect the rules. However, I have no way to withdraw my post in this thread so I feel that I must decline to answer any further posts about this subject. My apologies.

You give legitimate head's up on a time limited availability where you have no financial interest, and the interpretation is 'advertising', which censors you from talking about how the stone performs.

Moderators: this was not a good call - a bit above & beyond.


Any honesters that have experience w/ how a Karasi or a Tomae is used? Mr. Carter doesn't believe in slurries - just water. Can a Stone's potential as a final finisher be indicated by some laps w/ just water? Guys w/ Jnat experience - 'would appreciate your thoughts. Maybe this seeming opportunity is best let go - or a good way to get a worthy rock for a 2nd platform on which to finish. The priority for me is the smoothness.

Pinklather, I understand your feelings, but rules are rules. However, I don't believe the intention was to stop me from discussing the performance of stones etc. I recently posted a long and relatively complete discussion on the use of Nagura's, slurries, natural and synthetic stones on another forum. Unfortunately that forum is down with some kind of problems. If and when it comes back up I'll put a link here so you can read the posts. Alas I can't duplicate what I wrote because I can't get to the posts there either :(

I don't have any experience with those. Good luck.

Pinklather: That forum is available again and the link is:

http://www.knifeforums.com/forums/sh...d/888529/tp/1/

hope it helps

I appreciate the steer to some good input on the mysterious and costly rocks.

(as posted on B&B tonight)

Ok, so now I have something to report.

Since I have little a lot less honing experience than all the Honemeisters on here I figured no matter how I tested this stone my word wouldn't count for squat. Never the less, a little experiment was in order for me to prove to myself whether this stone form Carter was good or bad. However, to figure that out I needed a benchmark stone - my select coticule.

I am quietly confident in using my coticule and I have been shaving with razors I have honed myself and finished on my coti for the past 6 weeks.

My progression to date has been:
King Deluxe 1200
Norton 4k
Norton 8k
Select Coticule & Bout with slurry diluted til just water
Strop 60 laps on canvas the 40 laps on Ken Rups Paladin

I figured I would change as little as possible for this test so I substituted my coti for the J-nat I got from carter so my progression would be:

King Deluxe 1200
Norton 4k
Norton 8k
Tomae Honyama with Slurry (Produced with DMT8C) diluted til just water
Strop 60 laps on canvas the 40 laps on Ken Rups Paladin

I used my Dovo 5/8 on my Coticule and my Dovo 6/8 on the Tomae.

I have now blunted, sharpened, finished and shaved with each razor 3 times and I have to say I am having a hard time distinguishing between the two on initial shaves. I do think now that the coticule provides a slightly smoother shave and the Tomae is (for me) scary sharp and very unforgiving. Both are giving very close shaves. I guess only time will tell which edge holds longest and so from here on through I will only maintain them with stropping on cloth/leather.

Anyway, look back up at the title of this thread...... "My first JNAT" - HAHA Yeah right http://badgerandblade.com/vb/images/..._guys/w00t.gif Today I have placed an order with Takeshi for an Umegahata and have been speaking with Maksim re an Ozuku and will be getting one soon. I also have a couple of synthetic finishers en route - and so it begins.....

Marc , I see you're in Sydney. I f you'd like to do some comparison testing to my J-Nats just send me a PM. Maybe we can see why you find the edge "unforgiving"

Guys,

If you have a problem or question about a Mod decision the gentlemanly thing to do is bring it up with the Mod that notified you directly and by PM, not bring it up publicly.

Thanks,

Stuart

'Got it, Stubear.

Sincere apologies for breaking protocol.

I'd not had reason to object before, so what should have been obvious (the gentlemanly thing to do - write them directly) wasn't in the mental quiver - likely obscured by too much heat between the ears. The detail isn't critical, but the way it happened likely cost me financially, and definitely brought alot of extra work.

Each honing Mod in particular has profound respect from me, and I know the driver is mostly keeping it honest, which I support. Jimmy & Glen, pls. accept my sincere apologies. 'Would take a moral midget to disrespect the guys that shower us generously w/ knowledge and help so regularly. 'Bitter to think I've stumbled amongst them (the MMs). I believe you can count on me to know better next time.