Llyn Melynllyn Welsh Stone

I decided to try a vintage Llyn Melynllyn Welsh Stone; the highly respected seller feels that this stone is a 4k with heavy slurry, 8k with light slurry or clear water and even finer with oil. I got the impression that after a bevel set with the 1k, I might be able to go from the 4k all the way to the finished product with this one stone.

It came with a nice mahogany box. I ran a hone over it just to check out the feel. Very nice to the touch. To look at this stone and its slurry most would think it is a BBW but I have been assured that it is not.


If anyone has any useful tips on how best to use this Llyn Melynllyn, (aka Yellow Lake ), I would appreciate it since this is my first time with this stone. Thanks.....

Jerry

EDIT: Hang loose while Mr. Dummy puts up a photo .....
______________________________________________

Attachment 86348

Why don't you ask Neil himself. He is member on this forum. Information from him is reliable and more importantly can be speciffic to your hone as naturals can vary piece from piece.

I would be interested to hear what he has to say about it. Interesting stone.

Cool! I'm glad somebody else bought one, because I've been staring at them for quite a while. I don't need it of course. But curiousity is an insatiable beast. Please keep us updated.

A very good stone. With slurry it looks and cuts as BBW, but much faster, maybe 5x faster. With plain water it gives a mirror like finish, you can shave quite comfortably, and with oil it gets even finer. Using it with this progression, you will not need stones with grits from 3k to 12k. It works like any slate-shale stone, there are no special tricks about it. It will not wear easily, so, hone with it until you can say you know this stone. And the best thing is, the quarry of this stone has been abandoned, so there are plenty of stones if someone starts to dig. The next years I'm waiting for someone to start selling fresh stones again.

QUOTE=Vasilis;899770]A very good stone. With slurry it looks and cuts as BBW, but much faster, maybe 5x faster. With plain water it gives a mirror like finish, you can shave quite comfortably, and with oil it gets even finer. Using it with this progression, you will not need stones with grits from 3k to 12k. It works like any slate-shale stone, there are no special tricks about it. It will not wear easily, so, hone with it until you can say you know this stone. And the best thing is, the quarry of this stone has been abandoned, so there are plenty of stones if someone starts to dig. The next years I'm waiting for someone to start selling fresh stones again.[/QUOTE]
____________________________________________

Thank you Vasilis. I had a Geneva Special A with a chip near the point so I went to the Chosera 1k, set a new bevel and then started on the Yellow Lake with heavy slurry. Diluted down to clear and polished with glycerin.
Then shaved the right side of my ugly mug. Good shave. I think it needs more time on clear water and then polish again.

You described this stone just like Neil Miller described it. I'm glad you posted your thoughts.

Jerry______________

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vasilis

A very good stone. With slurry it looks and cuts as BBW, but much faster, maybe 5x faster. With plain water it gives a mirror like finish, you can shave quite comfortably, and with oil it gets even finer. Using it with this progression, you will not need stones with grits from 3k to 12k. It works like any slate-shale stone, there are no special tricks about it. It will not wear easily, so, hone with it until you can say you know this stone. And the best thing is, the quarry of this stone has been abandoned, so there are plenty of stones if someone starts to dig. The next years I'm waiting for someone to start selling fresh stones again.

---

Not likely to get new ones as it requires elbow grease, a good pair of legs and more importantly permission ( about that you can dream on) as it is in the middle of National Park. Also They are not uncommon to find for those who know what they looking for therefore dream prices hardly to happen to be worthwhile. What makes their price is more about their original packaging than the stones themselves.

That's unfortunate... (Not that I would like to see a National park destroyed for this reason). Regarding their price, for many many good stones, on antique stores and eBay, the sellers just sell "beautifully crafted" wooden boxes, that smells awfully, and you can't really store anything there, accept, there is also a stone in there that may worth a small fortune. all the antique yellow lake stones, including the salmens ones are sold for 20-30$ or so without shipping. I think those hones are very useful, very fine, and faster than most of the natural hones with similar grit that are sold for much higher prices.

There's a guy in the UK selling new stones listed as these. He's cut and lapped them himself and they have a purple slurry. If the originals came from a National Park surely the ones this guy are selling aren't the same as a Llyn Melynllyn Welsh Stone? At the price he sells them at I'm tempted to try one anyway, has anyone bought a new one yet?

So far i am still waiting to at least see one labeled or boxed purple coloured YL. But it does not mean that those hones are not good. Let us know how it will perform.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vasilis

That's unfortunate... (Not that I would like to see a National park destroyed for this reason). Regarding their price, for many many good stones, on antique stores and eBay, the sellers just sell "beautifully crafted" wooden boxes, that smells awfully, and you can't really store anything there, accept, there is also a stone in there that may worth a small fortune. all the antique yellow lake stones, including the salmens ones are sold for 20-30$ or so without shipping. I think those hones are very useful, very fine, and faster than most of the natural hones with similar grit that are sold for much higher prices.

---

Is this the same stone as a Salmen Yellow lake? i just got one of the Salmen and its almost black!

Yes, the yellow lake stones from salmens is from the same quarry as the purple yellow lake. I'm not sure if salmens mined stone from more than one quarries in that area, and named them all yellow lake like the next company that took the quarry, but most of the yellow lake stones are from the same mine. They say it's a little finer, but I haven't test a salmens one. What about the surry, what color is it? When we say purple, it's not the BBW purple. Much darker.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vasilis

Yes, the yellow lake stones from salmens is from the same quarry as the purple yellow lake. I'm not sure if salmens mined stone from more than one quarries in that area, and named them all yellow lake like the next company that took the quarry, but most of the yellow lake stones are from the same mine. They say it's a little finer, but I haven't test a salmens one. What about the surry, what color is it? When we say purple, it's not the BBW purple. Much darker.

---

I dont know yet about the slurry i didnt get the stone yet its on the way to me i cant wait!!

I'm not at all sure that the non-purple stones came from the same quarry. I have had two of them and they seemed finer to me than the purple ones, with a very different feel to them. I remember Ardsprach posting about the Dragons Tongue hone - they guy at the quarry (Inigo Jones quarry) said they used to cut stone for A. B. Salmen. I suspect that the change of stone had something to do with Salmen losing control of the quarry or just using the 'Yellow Lake' as an umbrella brand - the original blue box simply says 'Original Yellow Lake Brand' so you take that to mean a variety of things.

That they used stones from other quarries is known - see the advertisements below - and they also imported: I had a combination coticule/bbw with their logo on the side of it once (salmon + hook). Unfortunately they aren't about anymore - the company was taken over in 1926 by one calling itself 'Successors to A. B. Salmen) but they stopped filing returns in 1989.

Attachment 86641

This one shows an Aldgate address, the succesors had a Highgate address. The next one (earlier - 1890s) shows a Houndsditch address:

Attachment 86642

It is interesting to note the reference in the earlier advert - it says that A. B. Salmen was successor to S. Samuel - looks like a long line of 'successor to' in that line of work!

Regards,
Neil

Neil if you have one of the purple YLs with original label or box can you show them here please?

Here a pic of the stone i purchase same box and allAttachment 86647

I believe that one is not puple size is 8x2x0.5" normaly quite fine.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by adrspach

I believe that one is not puple size is 8x2x0.5" normaly quite fine.

---

Yes sounds right Looking forward to try it out!!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by adrspach

Neil if you have one of the purple YLs with original label or box can you show them here please?

---

I no longer have the hone, but here are some pics of it:

Attachment 86650Attachment 86651Attachment 86652Attachment 86653Attachment 86654Attachment 86655

From what I remember it was not in the same league as the dark ones - more around 8 or 9k, possibly more with some finesse and/or oil.

Regards,
Neil

This might be of interest too - the list of holdings attributed to A B Salmen (Albert Berl Salmen, son of Samuel Salmen who was a founder of the Stepney Jewish School in London):-

Attachment 86656

I expect that you are already familiar with the quarries, but the dates might be of some interest.

Albert died in 1907. In 1910 a crown advertisement appeared to sell off the firms holdings, lock stock and barrel.

Regards,
Neil

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Neil Miller

I no longer have the hone, but here are some pics of it:



From what I remember it was not in the same league as the dark ones - more around 8 or 9k, possibly more with some finesse and/or oil.

Regards,
Neil

---

Is there any green inclusions on this stone? Looks awfully close to this thread that i started a while back and still not quite sure
about it you can check it out here: http://straightrazorpalace.com/hones...ural-hone.html

Neil

Is there any chance that Mr. Salmen was connected in any way to the "SALM" coticule?

Jerry

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sasquatch

There's a guy in the UK selling new stones listed as these. He's cut and lapped them himself and they have a purple slurry. If the originals came from a National Park surely the ones this guy are selling aren't the same as a Llyn Melynllyn Welsh Stone? At the price he sells them at I'm tempted to try one anyway, has anyone bought a new one yet?

---

I just looked at his listing I'm wondering if his stones are the same as the Dragons Tongue from Inigo Jones ?

No - no inclusions. You will never be sure about that stone other than it is a purple slate - unless it learns to talk, of course! :)

Regards,
Neil

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Neil Miller

No - no inclusions. You will never be sure about that stone other than it is a purple slate - unless it learns to talk, of course! :)

Regards,
Neil

---

Whatever it is, it does a wondeful job as a finisher very smooth for sure!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by mrsell63

Neil

Is there any chance that Mr. Salmen was connected in any way to the "SALM" coticule?

Jerry

---

No Jerry,

The Salm coticule is found in an area called the Pays de Salm (or Pays de val de Salm), the "Old Rock" coticule came from there. The Salm name goes back to at least the 10th century - they were connected to The House of Luxembourg and ruled the Vielsalm (Viel-Salm :) ) area, which later became split between the Ardennes and the Vosges regions as Lower and Upper Salm.

Salmen did import coticules, though!

Attachment 86658
Regards,
Neil

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by osdset

I just looked at his listing I'm wondering if his stones are the same as the Dragons Tongue from Inigo Jones ?

---

That was my initial thought but he sells these as well as the Dragon's Tongue hones. He even sells a combi of the two and the slurry is very different. Think I might grab one tomorrow and see what it's like.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sasquatch

That was my initial thought but he sells these as well as the Dragon's Tongue hones. He even sells a combi of the two and the slurry is very different. Think I might grab one tomorrow and see what it's like.

---

If you do get one of his stones please report back as many are interested!!!

I have one of the purple YL slate. Not sure if it really goes with the black YL being discussed here.

http://straightrazorpalace.com/hones...lake-15-a.html

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Logistics

I have one of the purple YL slate. Not sure if it really goes with the black YL being discussed here.

http://straightrazorpalace.com/hones...lake-15-a.html

---

Thanks for sharing that. I'm still kinda confused about the new ones though, they must be different to the old ones looking at them. That's fine if they work well of course. I've always loved the idea of a natural to do everything after setting a bevel on a 1000, would this work for that starting with slurry and working through to clean water or should I just splash out on a coti and be done with it? The price and location is a bonus with the Welsh ones but I'd rather not buy one if it still leaves me pining for a coti!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Martin103

Whatever it is, it does a wondeful job as a finisher very smooth for sure!!

---

if your stone is as you say much finer then a 8k it may be a purple slate my little purple stone i think is a yl

I bought one from him, it definitely feels very fine and produces a nice purple slurry. Haven't honed with it yet, but soon, maybe this weekend I'll try it.
Trouble is I have too many fine unused hones to try them all on one razor.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by episaacs

I bought one from him, it definitely feels very fine and produces a nice purple slurry. Haven't honed with it yet, but soon, maybe this weekend I'll try it.
Trouble is I have too many fine unused hones to try them all on one razor.

---

Ha ha, nice problem to have! I'm the opposite. Let us know what you think if you do try it out please...