Anyone ever try these stones, if so what was your experience? Japanese Natural Sharpening Stones, Japanese sharpening stones, Japanese natural stones
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Anyone ever try these stones, if so what was your experience? Japanese Natural Sharpening Stones, Japanese sharpening stones, Japanese natural stones
I don't have the koppa, but the larger ozuku asagi that they sell should be in my mailbox today ( this one is second hand and was tested as a razor finisher) . I'll let you know what I think about it. You are always taking something of a risk if someone has not tested each individual stone as a razor finisher. Do they have a return policy for the hones?
If you want to be sure you are going to get a good stone, buy it forma reputable vendor that tests on razors. Remember you get what you pay for.
Especially with Japanese Natural stones....Quote:
Originally Posted by mainaman
I had one (from cktg). I cut it into naguras. It was definitely capable of finishing razors, especially with a skilled user's hands. That doesn't mean they'll all be that way, though, but mine was fine and second only to known razor stones that I have that are very very fine.
Let's put it this way, it was a much finer stone than my arkansas stones, and both coticules that I've used.
It's maybe a bit too hard for the naguras I cut it to, but it's fine and I wanted one for some of my other stones since asano naguras that are anywhere close to as fine seem so hard to find lately.
On average. I got a really nice (eventually) oozhuku Suita in the 15K range for $30 once. But, on the other hand, I also once got a very nice Narutaki paperweight for $100.Quote:
Originally Posted by mainaman
If you can afford to spend that money and potentially lose it on a useless stone, that is your prerogative. If you do buy it, you will then be in a position to help others on this forum make a more informed decision in the future. That is basically how we all learn as we go - some courageous fellow plonks down their own cash to try out an idea. If that is not you, then yes you should go with a known vendor. However, if you are an intrepid kind of person get out there and explore! :)
James.
see my reply on the other forum.
Well the example that I received is an awesome finisher (again this is the larger size Ozuku Asagi from CNTG, and was tested with razors by previous owner). YMMV however, so if you can ask CNTG to pick out a razor finisher, and see if they have a return policy. If not it is a risk and you are better staying with a seller who tests each stone with razors and offers return if you are not satisfied with its performance.
If they have a return policy that allows you to send it back, then you pretty much have no exposure other than time and shipping.
I personally will probably go to alex for any other wants I have, because I've never gotten something from alex and felt like "well, that's not what i was expecting". My two favorite stones are from alex, one for woodworking and one for razors.
BUT, if you're looking to spend minimum dollars, I seriously doubt you have a lot to lose buying a koppa from CKTG for $70. As I said above, I've had one, I only cut it up because I have so many stones. Of all of the japanese stones I've ever gotten, the only japanese razor stone better than that one as a finisher was an antique that I got from alex. I've used two cotis, and a bunch of the other classic razor stones, gobs of synthetics, four different finishing arks, slates, and a charnley and there is no way that someone could finish a razor with a coti and not turn around and make the edge better with the koppa from cktg. I couldn't better the edge off of the CKTG stone with a charnley either, and the ozuku koppa gets to the same point faster.
If you were unlucky and got one coarser than I did, you could send it back, but to assume that they are all coarse and unsuitable to finish a razor would be wrong.
the problem is the stone has to be lapped to make sure the top crusty layer is off and one hones on fresh grit. Once the stone is lapped does the return policy still work?Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveW
@OP from personal experience after ~60 Jnats, it is better buy from a reputable seller that tests on razors and can guarantee the stone is good, otherwise you run the risk of spending your money on a prepolisher in the best case scenario or a door stop if you are really unlucky.
I would recommend Maksim from JNS Japanese Natural Stones, Toishi
he will find you something good and at your price point that will work for razors.
Well, there are several comments in their sections of different stones about how they are for razors. they've been in business for a while, and I've personally had very good experience with them (I have bought more woodworking stuff than razor stuff). They probably know enough now to know which stones are going to be good razor stones, and in reality, the criteria isn't that difficult for a good razor stone. For a superb razor stone, things are a lot tighter and there's a lot more subjectivity.
But for a good one, the particles need to be relatively small and dense, and the stone needs to be hard enough to give you the option of slurrying it or having it hold all of its grit tight.
If someone told me they were on a budget, I would tell them to take their changes with CKTG's stone. If they were on a budget, but it wasn't as strict, I'd tell them to go to alex and ask for function over beauty, and if no budget at all, I'd tell them to go to alex and ask for the nicest to use superfine stone he has.
But I stand by my comment that I wouldn't be at all afraid to order from CKTG, because I have used ozukus that are graded as finishers for woodworking, and I've used razor ozukus and the stones from CKTG are much finer than the woodworking finishers I have. If I only have one lament, it's cutting the mine into naguras and then finding out it's really too hard and fine to work without me further scuffing or cutting across the surface of the stone as naguras.
But, anyway, at this point, probably enough people have ordered stones from CKTG for razors for them to be able to tell you what people are happy with. they can certainly identify stones that are too fine to be practical for knife use, and that are not scratchy. Any stone that meets that criteria will be a pretty easy natural stone to use.
Problem is the reviews are for a particular stone from the many they have had for sale, as we all know with naturals no two stones are alike, the ones with biggest disparity being the Coticules and Jnats. So if a newbie reads the reviews and they know nothing about Jnats, they will think the reviews,much like for synthetics, apply to every stone that is sold under the name; that would be an incorrect assumption.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveW
In general if a newbie, when it comes to Jnats or natural stones in general(may be except Thuringinas/Eschers), wants to get a stone he should ask the seller to test on razor and guarantee performance and return in case the stone does not work as advertised. Buying stone not suitable for the task could be rather frustrating to a newbie. Imagine a new guy trying to get a top notch edge when certain stone just can't produce it.
One other thing we forgot here is to ask the OP has his experience with honing and using synthetics. Jumping into naturals if there is not enough experience with synthetics in most cases could by a daunting task.
Definitely true. Especially if someone goes from an edge that's not got the bevel set correctly and tries to keep rubbing their razor on a super fine and super hard stone.Quote:
Originally Posted by mainaman
I can personally vouch for this from experience myself, as a newbie who jumped into jnats. What i know from that buying experience - Every stone is different, the stone itself needs to be tested and reviewed. Buy from a reputable dealer, and make sure you can return it. But then again, in order for this to do any good, *you will need to have the ability to judge if it is a good stone as soon as you get it*, something most newbies cannot. It is safer to go the synthetic route at first.Quote:
Originally Posted by mainaman