Long Hones?

Hey Guys,

Just wanted to find out if any of you have really long hones? I've at some point seen a very long coticule on the forum, but I don't really think I've seen any others through the years. I know the standard lengths were devised as such due to the economics involved (unless there are other benefits to shorter hones??), but what are your thoughts on long hones then? I'm talking like 15-18 inches..
I'm thinking longer strokes equals less return trips which would make honing more leisurely. Thoughts?

- Mike

My longest hone is about 11" long, Mike, so it doesn't really qualify. The only thing I would hesitate about with a much longer hone is keeping the honing stroke equal throughout the lenth of the stoke.

Regards,
Neil

I've had stones/hones up to 12 inches long. I didn't figure after about 8 inches or so, or even maybe a little less with a full width hone that it really was any advantage.

I'd call full width anything that covers the entire razor edge on the surface with classic stroke leading the inside edge of the razor. That's probably around 2.25".

With much narrower hones, another couple of inches might be nice, but sometimes it's a little harder to keep track of flatness on the bigger hones. Flatness is not a big deal if one razor only ever gets used on one hone, and it doesn't see lots of wear between that razor's trips to it, but when you start mixing razors around all over the place on different stones, it's nice for them to all be flat so that you *only* do the honing that needs to be done to remove the wear at the edge of the bevel.

I have used a 14" CF before, as Neil said above the consistency of the stroke might be questionable on such length. May be with practice such issue will self correct. For me 10" is probably the, max that I would go for.

The stone on bottom of pic is 13 inches long,i would say everytime i use it i do a 10 inch stroke, feels more comfortable that way.
Attachment 106415
I would think a perfect size would be 8 X 3 IMHO.

Funny you ask. Another member and I have been corresponding via PM as to the 5x2 1/2 being the 'optimum' size for a coticule. I've noticed that barbers from the old days of frequent straight razor shaving had that size of coticule more often than not.

Barber hones, such as the Swaty and variants, were usually 4x2. I'm wondering if the stroke the 5" hone forces the honer to take isn't a more efficient stroke for honing straight razors ? That said, the longer the hone the faster because the steel is in contact with abrasive through a longer stroke ..... if the honer utilizes the length of the hone.

My longest is an 11 3/4" x 2 1/2" vintage natural coticule. With eschers they made a 10x2" IIRC, but I've yet to score one of those.

I do have few long hones. Longest is 45cm long. Do not use them much as they are too cumbersome to work with an pain in the backside to lap. In my opinion up to 10" is usefull however it also depends if you hone in hand or on the table. To hold 10"x3"x1" is pretty tiring.

I think determining hone length is just an optimisation problem. The trick is to determine the objective function: the rule that defines your objective - profit, ergonomics, surface area, whatever, in terms of the variables; and any constraints on those variables. Then you just optimise (find the max or min) with respect to the variables, subject to the constraints.

I'd wager that the standard sizes we see in the vintage hones like, say, the Eschers were determined through considerations of maximising profit subject to ergonomic considerations (ie how many stones can we get out of this chunk of rock and not have people complain that they are too small?)

James.

At one time I had a 14" Washita. It was really too much stone. Over the years I've found that 6"x2" seems to be perfect for me.:)

Hello Mike,

my guess for stone size is 8" x 2" 1/2, I think this size play good for me,you have to consider the weight and relative shipping cost.

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Originally Posted by Theseus

At one time I had a 14" Washita. It was really too much stone. Over the years I've found that 6"x2" seems to be perfect for me.:)

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several years ago, I had one of the halls 12x3 black stones. It was for woodworking, but even for that it was FAR too big.

Thought mine was 2 1/2 wide but it is 3'". Just 'cause I know some say, "If there ain't a picture it didn't happen" .......... :angel:

I've been thinking about cutting this into a 5"..... a 6" and slurry stones for each one. Don't hate me ...... :shrug:

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Oh my.

Before you do something goofy like that, I think I'd put it on ebay for $800 or some nutty number. Where is anyone ever going to see another one like that one?

I've never had a long hone; I'm content with the fact, that I have to make due with a short hone. :shrug:

A wise honemeister once told me, "It's not the size of the hone that matters; it's the angle and pressure of the stroke." :)

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Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

Thought mine was 2 1/2 wide but it is 3'". Just 'cause I know some say, "If there ain't a picture it didn't happen" .......... :angel:

I've been thinking about cutting this into a 5"..... a 6" and slurry stones for each one. Don't hate me ...... :shrug:

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Dont hate you?! You are making it very hard, one, I am jealous of the stone secondly you are threatening to cut it up! You cad!

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Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

Thought mine was 2 1/2 wide but it is 3'". Just 'cause I know some say, "If there ain't a picture it didn't happen" .......... :angel:

I've been thinking about cutting this into a 5"..... a 6" and slurry stones for each one. Don't hate me ...... :shrug:

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Cut it into 12 slurry stones Jimmy, but get a good distance away before posting the result... :)

Regards,
Neil

Yeah chop that baby up!

I personally like a hone that is between 5 and 8 long and 3 wide. The width seems to play a larger part in my experience with the hone........... This whole thread sounds wrong. It's like we're a bunch of women talking about lengths and girths...... lol

8x3 is great imo

I agree with Jimmy. Like Rooster Cogburn said, “Too much gun!”

http://i.imgur.com/RxlO4.jpg

Just right! 5 x 2.5
http://i.imgur.com/K4hJQ.jpg

Thanks guys for your thoughts and comments. I asked about it since I've taken some slabs of my own hone stone to be cut, and I decided to mark out some 15" lengths for my own keeping :) sort of luxury thing I suppose in the end, since as you guys correctly say - it's more about the consistency and levelness of the stroke - and admittedly you are more likely to maintain good form on short trips rather than long ones.
Still, I think that for a finisher - where little to no pressure is needed, it should be rather easy to maintain an even stroke assuming the hone is supporting enough of the blade. I will say that on narrow hones (which I'm partial too) a long hone would be a bit of a balancing act.. but on a 2.5 - 3" finishing stone it could be quite fun and effective to use... nonetheless, I'm gonna do it because I can :)
It also got be thinking on how we don't have the same concerns when stropping.. I mean you don't worry about a long strop and the potential of bad form in the strokes..? Although I actually do prefer the smaller paddle strops - and maybe that is in fact due to the increased control of each stroke - so I reckon there is some science to this whole thing..

Anyways thanks again, if anyone else has images of super long hones please post them.

And Jimmy, please don't cut that beautiful hone - it just seems wrong, you know?

Cheers,
- Mike

I've got a 3" x 16" Chinastone that I mess with from time to time. A couple of things go on with such a long stone. First, lapping it flat is REAL tough as most sandpaper & my DMT is 11" max. I ended up having to lap with a cut belt sander belt & get a new lapping plate. Second is that the range of the elbow movement while honing. If you have to move your elbow...well, I would be willing to bet that the pressure may not be right while honing.

I measured what I would consider my effective stroke on this stone and I would say approximately 9.5-10"...so I would say that for me a 11" stone would be all that I would ever ask for as it would be all I could effectively use.

Lastly, storage and shipping of such a large stone is a total PITA as well.
Scott

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Originally Posted by MichaelC

Hey Guys,

Just wanted to find out if any of you have really long hones? I've at some point seen a very long coticule on the forum, but I don't really think I've seen any others through the years. I know the standard lengths were devised as such due to the economics involved (unless there are other benefits to shorter hones??), but what are your thoughts on long hones then? I'm talking like 15-18 inches..
I'm thinking longer strokes equals less return trips which would make honing more leisurely. Thoughts?

- Mike

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Well, I love it long, too!

Among the thuringians I have in my collection I only use the 9 or 10 inch ones for razor honing.
But the largest hone I have is a 13-5/8 long and 3 inch wide yellow lake stone.
It's simply a pleasure to hone on....

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Originally Posted by Martin103

The stone on bottom of pic is 13 inches long,i would say everytime i use it i do a 10 inch stroke, feels more comfortable that way.
Attachment 106415
I would think a perfect size would be 8 X 3 IMHO.

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Oh man!! If it were mine It would just be 12 inches long and I'd have a really nice slurry stone.;)

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Originally Posted by adrspach

I do have few long hones. Longest is 45cm long. Do not use them much as they are too cumbersome to work with an pain in the backside to lap. In my opinion up to 10" is usefull however it also depends if you hone in hand or on the table. To hold 10"x3"x1" is pretty tiring.

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That ain't a hone ...it's a patio:rofl2:

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Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

Thought mine was 2 1/2 wide but it is 3'". Just 'cause I know some say, "If there ain't a picture it didn't happen" .......... :angel:

I've been thinking about cutting this into a 5"..... a 6" and slurry stones for each one. Don't hate me ...... :shrug:

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that's what I would do