If I were to buy just one hone...

Well, I'm still fairly new to using a straight but my razor is starting to pull a little and I'm looking for a hone to do touch ups on an already honed razor. I am not going to be doing any work on vintage razors or razors that are not shave ready so I don't need/want a set of multiple hones. I just want one hone that I can use to touch up the blade. Any suggestions? I need something not so expensive and I really don't think I need a 4k stone so norton 4/8 is really not needed. I was thinking 8k to 12k but not sure which is best for just touch up 8, 10, or 12k I was also wondering if im able to put .5 micron paste on the back of my strop the side that is bumpy, instead of buying another strop. But I'm not sure if this will damage the razor. I'm looking for cost effective ideas I have the 3 micron lapping film and it works good just want to have a better edge then what that gives me


thank you

Two possibilities, most "bang for buck":

1. A barber hone.

2. 1 micron lapping film (I think that will be comparable to a 15K-grit stone, but I've had my fingers stomped for saying that before).

And a suggestion:

I've shaved off 3 micron film, and wasn't happy at all. But using CrOxide (maybe around 0.5 micron) _after_ the 3 micron film gave a halfway-comfortable edge. So some CrOxide and a pasted strop might be enough for you.

I wouldn't use the rough side of your strop. Use balsa, or seat-belt webbing, or smooth leather.

. . . Charles

i am at the same stage, i have a few barber hones but am a bit wary to use them on my razors. Any advice as to what sort of edge i can expect from one? The name barber hone makes you think you are gonna end up with a good edge, but it seems not many people use them any more.

If you are looking for the most economical way to keep an edge, then IMHO you should go with paste and strop like CrOx. However, eventually, you would need a stone.
I have gotten consistent on reviving edges, setting bevels is another story. On several occasions I had to take them to the 8k stone and had one that did not revived until I did some passes on the 4k and on to the progression of 8k and paste ( .5 diamond, and CrOx).
Any of the ideas suggested would work. Barbers hone, a 12k stone, 4/8 norton or paste. I believe in buying once, although its not always possible or foreseeable.
I would buy first a pasted strop, like the hard wool felt that SRD sells with .5 diamond spray. Try that first, and see how long you could go with that. Then later the 4/8 norton or similar system. Double O

Barber's hone is the cheapest option to go for.
Other options that are more price intense are synthetic 12k , Natural such as Jnat/ Thuringian/ Escher, some English Slates.

Ive been maintaining all my razors with barber hones and a strop with cerium oxide for several months now. I havent needed anything else since!

Chromium oxide on balsa following the 3 micron film. That'd be all I'd spend right now if you're happy with how the film works.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Disburden

Ive been maintaining all my razors with barber hones and a strop with cerium oxide for several months now. I havent needed anything else since!

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Ramirez admits to being new and few have your level of skill at honing. I know that the barber hones vary greatly in grit level, price and performance.

I would suggest the Norton 4/8 and use the information/material available on SRP to get the maximum out of the 8K side.

I am by no means an authority on honing, but unless Ramirez picks the right barber hone, he might be disappointed.
Just my 2 cents.

Well, assuming you never ever ding the blade or bump the edge and kill it...You could go 10k and split the difference from what others have said, use the 3u film, then 0.5u crox and strop. Just a thought, but I do love the edge off my 12k naniwa and crox :chapeau

I use a real Three line swaty which is like 8-10K level..and follow with cerium on linen.

If you search for Sham's thread "barber hone characteristics" You will find all kinds of grit ratings for old barber hones.

Panama and Lakeside barber hones are over 12K level, near 16K.

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Originally Posted by Hirlau

Ramirez admits to being new and few have your level of skill at honing. I know that the barber hones vary greatly in grit level, price and performance.

I would suggest the Norton 4/8 and use the information/material available on SRP to get the maximum out of the 8K side.

I am by no means an authority on honing, but unless Ramirez picks the right barber hone, he might be disappointed.
Just my 2 cents.

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I also am just keeping an edge and I have been using a 12k form SRD for about a year and half. Followed by the cloth side then the leather side of my strop, hope this helps.

Get a coticule! Leaves a fine edge, and there's room for rougher work. If you need any more refinement, diamond or CO on linen will do the trick. And coticules really aren't terribly expensive if you know where to look.

I suggest getting something which will provide excellent touch-ups and will be a fine finisher if/when you decide to jump in and hone from beginning to end. You simply cannot go wrong with a Naniwa 12k and you can recieve much more useful help in using it as to the consistancy, popularity, and familiarity of them. Pastes and naturals vary in applications and grit. Advise on them will be quite varied! Cost on a Naniwa 12k is also reasonable. JMHO.
Tom

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Disburden

I use a real Three line swaty which is like 8-10K level..and follow with cerium on linen.

If you search for Sham's thread "barber hone characteristics" You will find all kinds of grit ratings for old barber hones.

Panama and Lakeside barber hones are over 12K level, near 16K.

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What is a three line swaty? I bought a swaty on eBay but haven't received it yet. Is there a way to tell what approximately the grit level is?

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Originally Posted by Scookum

What is a three line swaty? I bought a swaty on eBay but haven't received it yet. Is there a way to tell what approximately the grit level is?

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It's an old barber's hone that was made back in the day. It's called a three line because theres three lines of text on the stone that reads
"Franz Swaty,
Wahring Bei Wien,
(AUSTRIA)"

Copies were made and replicated to sell hones and say just "3 line swaty" on them ,etc and are not real swaty hones.
The way you find grit levels on a hone is to hone a lot on synthetic hones and find where the stone you are testing fits in the progression. This takes experience to know what you are looking at.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Scookum

What is a three line swaty? I bought a swaty on eBay but haven't received it yet. Is there a way to tell what approximately the grit level is?

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My understanding is that it refers to the number of lines of text stamped on the hone. For example, mine is a two-line:

Franz Swaty
Marburg Austria

As Swaty moved around and presumably changed their processes/formulae for making the things, their characteristics changed. Sadly, that's pretty much all I know about them, so hopefully someone much more knowledgeable than I will step in here...

EDIT: I see Disburden beat me to the punch. It's reassuring to know I wasn't out to lunch on this one. :)

Edit 2: lots of info here: http://straightrazorpalace.com/hones...aty-hones.html

Thanks for all the help guys. The 12k sounds like a good idea. Would like a barber hone but do you have to find a vintage one or is there a company that still makes barber hones? Do barber hones come in 3" wide. Want something wide enough for my blade so I don't have to do the x pattern while I learn to hone. Again thanks for all the advise guys

An X pattern is mandatory for honing. Watch some videos in the Wiki.
You can score a Naniwa 12k from Straight Razor Designs for a good deal

Assuming you are starting with a properly honed razor. The biggest bang for the buck, IMHO, for keeping a razor going is to use 0.1 micron CBN (Carbon Boron Nitride) on felt followed by 50 laps on leather strop. Using this setup like a barbers hone I am able to keep a razor at an extremely high level of keenness and smoothness for literally 6 months. The total setup will cost you about $60 USD.

Every couple of days I give my razor about 10 laps on the felt and then strop. About once a month, or when I still feel that there is a drop off in performance, I do 20 laps on felt, strop 50 laps, 10 laps on the felt and finally 50 laps on a leather strop.

CBN comes in a spray and a bottle literally will last years.





Take Care,
Richard

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Disburden

It's an old barber's hone that was made back in the day. It's called a three line because theres three lines of text on the stone that reads
"Franz Swaty,
Wahring Bei Wien,
(AUSTRIA)"

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Okay, the photo of the Swaty stone I bought has those three lines of text, the second stone is a Swotstein and comes in a little box. I have no idea why I bought them as I have naniwas...I need help :banghead:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Disburden

Ive been maintaining all my razors with barber hones and a strop with cerium oxide for several months now. I havent needed anything else since!

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Dude, you can't make slurry on a swaty! where did you go wrong? :))

You said that you don't need a 4k now, but you will need it in the future. Everyone messes up sometimes, new and experienced people alike, and in that case a 4k/8k Norton would be a good choice. If you insist on only one hone to maintain shave-ready razors, than I would go with a 12k nani, thuri, or 16k Shapton, and some crox pasted strop. They are easy to use, give nice edges, and are on the cheaper side.

I'd prefer not to have to deal with pastes and multiple strops. I'm leaning more toward a coticle or a barber hone. More so for the coticle. Is there a huge learning curve for coticles?

Ahhh their are so many options its confusing. Maybe I'm thinking too
Much into this. I think the 4k/8k stone maybe best for me right now since I'm new. After reading other posts on coticles learning on a 4/8 would be better. then maybe later getting a 12k to finish. Like I said I don't want to get extra strops and use pastes, so how many passes on the 8k side will give me a nice shave from a razor that pulls slightly

I say if you're going to start to maintain, use the 12k Naniwa or 16k shapton glass, then buy the norton combo 4/8. If you are careful with your edge, you can get away with the finisher. No dings, don't let the edge degrade to much before going to the finisher, and so on.
Yes, there is a lot to learn and remember, there is more than one way to skin a cat. Pick one method and learn it before trying different things. Double O

Alright nani 12k it Is!! Thank you guys, your a great help

You'll be happy with that. It's fast, like a barber's hone would be. Plus it's wide and long, like a barber's hone would not be. I've got one and love it.

Good luck sticking with one hone, many have tried and failed :)

If I was to restrict myself to 1 hone it would be a large natural finisher with a bunch of slurry stones of different grit.

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Originally Posted by Piet

Good luck sticking with one hone, many have tried and failed :)

If I was to restrict myself to 1 hone it would be a large natural finisher with a bunch of slurry stones of different grit.

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If I were stuck with one hone, it'd be an Escher and a rubbing stone or this new South African Zulu hone.

Seriously, To the OP. I think I would have stuck with the Norton 4/8, and picked up a cheap Chinese 12k from woodcraft here:Buy Natural Water Stone 8 x 2 x 1 at Woodcraft If you check out the page, there's also an 8x2 3/4 size as well.

The Naniwa 12k is a lot more expensive, If it's within your means, it's a much better stone. The The chinese 12k will get you there, it's just slow, so you create a slurry. If your going to maintain your own blades. You need a sharpener, 4k, a finisher, 8k, and 12k is like the icing on the cake.

You can maintain your blades with 12k's and pastes, but eventually you'll need something more, believe me, especially if you just use pastes. It's very easy to roll the edge of a blade by just using pastes. Balsa or a paddle would be the way to go there, but that's up to you....

Most experienced honer's can look at an edge, and tell if you've been using just pastes to refresh. Eventually you'll need the rocks.

These are my opinions.

Which stone is a hard choice.
I starting to think i rather have the wider stones so
i can do parrelle strokes with the razor.
and not to do The X strokes.

After looking at srd they have a nani set 5k 8k 12k. For $170 something. I think I may just give in and do that with a DMT stone for lapping

That would be a good solution. If you stack them carefully it'll still look like just one hone like you originally wanted. One unusually thick hone with many fancy colors.

Later you can add a 1k if you get into restorations need to do a bevel reset.

The DMT is such a good tool; you can use it on your kitchen knives, garden tools, whatever. I also use mine for final flattening of my wedge pieces when I make scales.

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Originally Posted by roughkype

That would be a good solution. If you stack them carefully it'll still look like just one hone like you originally wanted. One unusually thick hone with many fancy colors.

Later you can add a 1k if you get into restorations need to do a bevel reset.

The DMT is such a good tool; you can use it on your kitchen knives, garden tools, whatever. I also use mine for final flattening of my wedge pieces when I make scales.

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If you get the DMT 325/1200 you could bevel set with the 1200 side, but go slow with it, it seems to be much more aggressive than my naniwas 1k.

I started straight shaving over a year and half back. I started with a used razor that was honed and received a leather strop with it. Almost immediatly I started searching antique stores for a second razor to practice on and found a barber's hone for the honing. I now have a 3 line swaty to help out and have brought over a dozen razors back to life. I can't say that my honing or the barber's hones are perfect by a long shot but they do work. The work to get a razor sharp is very tedious and takes a significant amount of time. Keeping one sharp does not take so much time (6 or 7 strokes usually works). They are probably not as sharp as the paste or probably the other 'good' stones but do work to simply keep a razor from pulling. Good luck....

I started my mate out with a shave ready razor and a ch12k 200x50 from invisable edge For just £19...he does 50 laps every so many shaves and he told me the other day the razor is still as good...thats 6 months plus and still going , thats not bad at all for 19 pounds . For that money you have nothing to loose..Later on if you get A 4k 8k you have your finisher all ready ..
Gary