Frustration honing journey

So as the title implies a little journey for you, hoping someone might be able to spark something that I'm missing or just haven't thought of.

I'm nothing close to a honemeister, I have honed a few up so far from scratch (make my own). The first two I did were full hollows and the first razors I've ever honed. Looking back, they both went extremely well considering. The last two I've done one was around half hollow that took a little extra but I ended up getting it. But the most recent was roughly a 1/4 hollow, also the first stainless blade I've done.

I've spent hours upon hours, for the past couple weeks messing with this thing. I couldn't figure out if it was something wrong I was doing, or not doing. If it was because it was a 1/4 hollow and I just wasn't used to it. If it was because it was a stainless steel and I was used to the carbon going much quicker. I tried x-pattern, 45 x-pattern, rolling x's, you name it. Pyramids, circles, squares and even a rhombus or two.

I would get it to the point where it was ALMOST there but just no cigar, it would shave arm hair but not pop it above the skin. Everyonce in awhile it would catch a few and even sometimes HHT barely. But it would always give a very poor shave, mostly it was just too unbearable, and when it would shave it would leave stubble. I would always pick up the last razor I made and have to do the shave with it.

I began slapping tape on and really looking at my bevels (which I've learned alot from this), today I went up to 3 layers of tape and got it as close to shave ready as I have so far, so I gave it another go. This time while I was stropping I thought Im really going to give it a hard strop woven fabric then leather. I applied more pressure than I believe than is needed or I have needed up to this point, and low and behold, it actually shaved! It wasn't the most comfortable or BBS, but I could go to work with my face like this with no problem.

But still leaves me wondering what did I do (or not) that was giving me this problem? I have so many thoughts it's hard to parse them out. So if any of you guys are bored tell me your thoughts, anything is appreciated.

Thanks

I have yet to make my own razor but I have read on it for the last year almost. So if you discount my thoughts I wouldn't blame you one bit.
At first I thought it was angle and tape because I have honed a few and the wedges love a little lift at the spine. Then I started thinking heat treat and temper. If I recall stainless is a whole different animal when you start heat treating and even the temper can go wonky the first few times. I will be watching for those who know to chime in.

I can't remember the numbers right off my head but I do remember 1-2 layers of tap puts me right in the suggested sweet spot for angle so that I wasn't worried about.

A good portion of the time I was severely fretting about the Heat treat. Although I have been using 440c for quite sometime as knife blades so I'm pretty used to it, but obviously that doesn't mean I didn't mess up.

And also I know if I did mess up the heat treat, then it was my temper, because I'm 95% sure if anything its too hard by the way its reacting to the hones.

What are you trying to set the bevel with?

I would find one way to hone the blade and stick with it. If you alter it between grits or during the same grit, you can end up with multiple bevels. Or at least what it looks like on the loupe. If you are doing rolling x, then rolling x it is throughout the grits. Im not saying every blade should be honed the same way but the most effective way is what you have to determine for every razor. And some blades may require a different stroke on different sides, so keep that in mind.

I have the Norton 1k and 4/8 that I use. The only reason I moved up was because I got to the point where I couldn't seem to get to the point I usually do on the 1k no matter what I did. So I was just moving up for lack other options.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bill3152

I would find one way to hone the blade and stick with it. If you alter it between grits or during the same grit, you can end up with multiple bevels. Or at least what it looks like on the loupe. If you are doing rolling x, then rolling x it is throughout the grits. Im not saying every blade should be honed the same way but the most effective way is what you have to determine for every razor. And some blades may require a different stroke on different sides, so keep that in mind.

---

I completely agree with you, and I wasn't just stacking methods on top of each other. Each new method I started from scratch, I started over probably 6 different times. This process continued over a few weeks. Just starting over and trying new things. I know that if I don't get it to where it should be on the 1k I shouldn't move up, but I did it out of pure desperation lol

Weve all been there. Just keep plugging along, you will find your way. Visual imo is very important as you can actually see where the hone makes contact. Good luck.

Watch these videos by gssixgun;
gssixgun videos | Watch gssixgun videos | gssixgun online videos | Download gssixgun videos | gssixgun live videos

I watched each one a couple of times and then tried what I saw. I didn't go through the whole process in one setting. I would watch part of a video, try that out, watch some more of the video, try that out, etc., etc. It may be a bit time consuming but it is worth the time. Since watching these videos my edges have improved 100%. Glen does an excellent job explaining what he is doing and gives helpful tips.

Some great responses already :tu

Here is a great thread that might spark an idea it is a sticky at the top of this forum for future reference

http://straightrazorpalace.com/honin...bing-over.html

If you feel it is getting closer after you increase the angle with more tape, that's suggestive of the bevel not meeting at a close enough point before you've moved up from the 1K stone in the past. Assuming of course that there's nothing wrong with the blade in terms of temper.

Stainless can take more work; quarter hollow definitely will take more work; and I am pretty sure that guys who make their own razors (or even those that restore old junkers) have coarser hones than a 1K that they use in the early stages. I myself will sometimes use a 400 grit hone on recalcitrant wedges to avoid having to sit there for a day trying to get the bevel close.

So, a hand-made stainless quarter hollow having its bevel set from scratch with a Norton 1K hone - my money is on the bevel not being quite there.

James.

Thanks for the input guys, I guess the main thing confusing me is all the razors I've done till now I haven't had much of an issue, if at all. It's just this one that is giving me problems and it happens to be the first stainless one I've done. At first I thought I had it too hard because it was taking forever to get the bevel set, then I thought maybe it was too soft because once it would get really close to where I wanted it, it seemed to degrade after I went a little further. Then there were so many other factors that went through my head, well my brain just started to swim in confusion.

And another note, I'm getting close to finishing another razor, this one is a carbon 1/2 hollow, and I barely had to touch it to a 1k to get it popping hair... so I know I can't be that far off on my honing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jimbo

If you feel it is getting closer after you increase the angle with more tape, that's suggestive of the bevel not meeting at a close enough point before you've moved up from the 1K stone in the past. Assuming of course that there's nothing wrong with the blade in terms of temper.

Stainless can take more work; quarter hollow definitely will take more work; and I am pretty sure that guys who make their own razors (or even those that restore old junkers) have coarser hones than a 1K that they use in the early stages. I myself will sometimes use a 400 grit hone on recalcitrant wedges to avoid having to sit there for a day trying to get the bevel close.

So, a hand-made stainless quarter hollow having its bevel set from scratch with a Norton 1K hone - my money is on the bevel not being quite there.

James.

---

Sorry I suppose I wasn't quite clear, the 1k is where I really get my bevel set perfect (or what I can achieve that's close, I wouldn't be so foolish to call my work perfect)

I have a 220 and 675 as well I use during the grinding process to get everything ready and pretty much set. I can't imagine using just a 1k from scratch.

Well I solved atleast one of my issues, I had heat treated two blades of 440c at the same time. One of which is the topic of discussion, the other I got finished up yesterday. Coming off the grinder it took me literally 20 minutes to get it shave ready. So I know it wasn't the heat treat atleast.

I don't know the exact problem but I've narrowed it down to the initial grinding/pre-bevel setting process.