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I was just thinking about the hanging hair test for the razor. If you have a shortage of hair like some of seasoned men and after you've tested your arm slick how would you test a razor your honing? now some of us have wives with hair brushes some don't. just a question on the lighter side.:rofl2:
I hear you! I am fortunate that my 16 y/o daughter has lots of long hair that is exactly like mine. There are other tests. If your bevel is set correctly (most important test imo) and your scratch patterns are clean in the progression, I would be confident to shave test it. If I didn't have a supply like I do, I would just test shave it. I haven't missed an hht is a long time. Its almost useless at this point as I know what its gonna be.
I think Geezer uses a real hair wig as a hair source. Seems like a great way to go about it, if you can find one on the cheap.
For us baldy's you soon realise arm hair is a finite source so you start using your arm hair for the HHT instead of deforesting your arms . :)
Any beauty salon has a ton of it. I found this out after the neighbors dog started looking a little mangy :<0)
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Agree that arms are infinite. Pick one hair test, repeat on another portion of blade. Each razor takes less than 10 hairs...how many do you hone?
HHT is not going to tell you anything about how a razor shaves. I have plenty of hair and do not use it at all, so if I had no hair I'd do as I do now, I shave to find out how the honing turned out.Quote:
Originally Posted by rhensley
I agree that the HHT does not surpass the shave test but it does tell a lot about sharpness once you know how to interpret the results. And in "most" cases if the razor is sharp it will shave well.Quote:
Originally Posted by mainaman
-john
I use the hht. But its certainly not necessary to get a good shave. It reveals nothing about smoothness though. If you can learn to use it and have a supply of hair( I use my daughters) then it wont hurt but the shave test is supreme. My shave test is a 5 pass shave.(I can get it all off with 3) If I am not irritated and Im clean as a whistle, it passed. It tests the edge as well as technique as a bad stroke with a well honed razor and a good stroke with a harsh razor will result in irritation or cuts.
If you learn how to use a scope or a loupe you will not need HHT to know if the edge is going to be good or not. HHT has to be calibrated to hair type, optics does not not.Quote:
Originally Posted by ocelot27
This actually is a very good point. Guess I'm on a kick lately with incomplete bevels, but if one side of the bevel is incomplete and you finish your honing regiment, you can pass an HHT and not get a comfy shave. The microscope or loupe really helps prevent this.Quote:
Originally Posted by mainaman
Have fun.
The thumb-pad test can tell you a lot about the quality of an edge, too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mainaman
I use a microscope to look at my edges but unless you have an SEM you can't really tell how sharp an edge is. I always use magnification to check the length of my edge on both sides at the bevel setting stage. Unfortunately, other than the shave test the HHT is all we have. Once you learn how to "calibrate" it for your hair I think it can be quite usefull - just my opinion!
John
What is SEM? :thinking: and why would you need one to be able to tell if the razor is shave ready or you need to hone it more?Quote:
Originally Posted by ocelot27
You do not need to see the edge to know when you are ready to move to the next grit. All it takes is to hone a decent amount of razors and observe scratch patterns and color characteristics of the bevels and close to the edge. With time one can develop a correlation of what the bevel looks like and how the shave will feel.
I tend to rely heavily on visual cues but ideally you could use multiple tests to confirm the edge.
Just like the stock market using multiple indicators make for a safer trade than just one. :)
I've been teaching all my razors to sing "Can't Touch This" by MC Hammer when they are shave ready. Makes honing far more interesting. The biggest problem is that razors have a terrible memory for a tune, so it's a bit off-key sometimes.
:p
MC Hammer - U Can't Touch This - YouTube
James.
Last I heard you were shaving shaving brushes and carpets oz.Quote:
Originally Posted by onimaru55
I find that it is really easy to segue you can't touch this and ghostbusters. Sorry irrelevant I know.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimbo
Scanning electron microscope, which IIRC gives you a resolution down to single molecules. A razor edge viewed with an SEM looks round and harmless, that's how much zoom you get :)Quote:
Originally Posted by mainaman
I use optics, feel of the razor on the hone (mainly to see if the bevel is even along the entire length) and TPT. I only use the HHT, with my girlfriend's hair, after stropping to test if the edge is even along the length and as sharp as my other razors. I cannot (yet) distinguish between shave sharp and nearly shave sharp with anything other that HHT and shave test.
SEM = Scanning Electron Microscope...Quote:
Originally Posted by mainaman
For me the ultimate test is whether or not a razor can tree top my arm hair. I have very fine arm hair and if a razor can tree top my hair I know it's as sharp as it will get.
I think the point is that sharpness does not always equate to shave ready - a razor may not pass various objective tests and still shave great.
-john
Additionally, it may pass tests and still scrape your face off. This discussion comes up once in a while and most people agree in different terms that tests are just tests and shaves are shaves and they're not the same.Quote:
Originally Posted by ocelot27
Sharpness is easilly obtained in the early stages of honing, same for tree topping hairs. The combination of sharpness and smoothness is what we all strive for. Im not against the hht, if it works for you great,but ultimately the real test for sharpness and smoothness will always be the shave test.Quote:
Originally Posted by ocelot27
+1 on that!Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin103
Exactly right.Quote:
Originally Posted by ocelot27
While HHT tells you sharpness it does not tell you how well the shave will be.
Looking at the bevels and close to the edge for certain indicators, with experience, tells if the razor will shave well or not. For that to work one has to have experience honing, know what to look for and know their stone progression very well. Even then a shave test is necessary because there can always be a surprise coming from faulty HT of the razor or edge not stable enough etc.
A lot of variables but with time all comes in place very nicely.
I had one razor score very well on my HHT and wouldn't last through one pass shaving - turned out the bevel was not set well and a rehone fixed the problem...Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurens
-john
The bevel was the problem with a razor I had. it would pass the hanging hair test and scrape and cut me every time it used it. sent it to a friend and he had the same problem. he found it with a jewelers loop. the bad thing is when I got the razor in the 70's I was told it was new and never honed. my friend found a double bevel. since then I have acquired a clip on the glasses mag. 10X at any rate I hope the razor serves him well for that blade will never get me again.