My new equipment.

My Norton 220/1000 and 4000/8000 stones arrived today. Lapped them and tried to hone my blade up. Shaves hair, but not near as good as I think it should. Will shave hair on my arm. Will not cut a loose hair from my wife's head. Shaved my face decent, but pulled a little. The edge looks good I think. But something clearly isn't as good as it could be. I should mention it would shave hear fairly decent from my last honing. Maybe a little better now.

Attachment 189606
I posted this on Facebook also. There are comments on Facebook, but I can't past all of them.

Do you have CrO or Diamond pasted strop? If so try a few laps and see if that will improve the edge further.

Just my thoughts ....
I think your stone is too high to get good consistent level laps. Your elbow is too low. Do you have a loupe ? Helps to see what your doing. Your Norton 1k may be a little rough being new. This means your going to have to spend more time than usual at the 4/8. Tape may be a good idea if your spending a lot of time on the 1 razor.

Now, are you using the pyramid method ? It is a great starting point to learn. Although like I said the 1k may cause you to need more laps or a bigger pyramid count. Just keep at it if the edge improves. If not better seek some hands on help.


You'll get it, it just takes some practice. Try to stay consistent and don't make a lot of changes at once.

Same with your shave technique. pay attention to angle and pressure. I am assuming this is all fairly new and you have a lot of variables going on :<0)

JustN, were you at the KC meet-up this fall? You look familiar.

What is the razor? You said you shaved with it before. Did you hone it previously or did someone else? Do you have any other razor to use as a comparative standard? Since you shaved with it before, what was your starting point for rehoning it? In other words, how did you hone it this time.

Regardless, congrats on the new toys! They are the basic tools so many here used first. Master them before bothering with anything else. More hones don't make you a better honer, except in my case!
:roflmao

Have you watched Lynn's honing videos? Your hone is too high and your seated position is too low for you to have the correct elbow height that Lynn recommends.

P.S. Use extreme caution when trying to cut loose hairs from your wife's head. Just sayin.

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Originally Posted by ChopperDave

Have you watched Lynn's honing videos? Your hone is too high and your seated position is too low for you to have the correct elbow height that Lynn recommends.

P.S. Use extreme caution when trying to cut loose hairs from your wife's head. Just sayin.

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Get samples from her hair brush -that's what I do - you can set up your own private HHT calibration. Compare the results to those obtained from your arm hair.

On a more serious note, the other contributors are right about the elbow height; it should be higher. It allows for better control and minimal down force strokes.

Hey Justin, good seeing you again. Congrats on the new stones. The 1k work is the most important. Also until your muscle memory is ingrained it's easy to make a bad stroke. There is a strong urge to pretend a bad stroke did not happen, but the reality is that it is a pretty major set back.

If the 1k work is close but not perfect the razor may seem pretty good, fooling you into thinking that the high grit work is the problem and the razor may even improve with more 8k work, but never reach great.

I use the HHT often, but be aware that it is quite subjective. Practice a bit with a known sharp straight or a palm stropped DE blade to learn what to expect.


My guess is that most of the elbow height problem is that it is a staged picture and your not really honing. If you are honing, you should be watching what you are doing. Just kidding.

Hope to see you and your wife in KC this year.

Victor

Whao! I just saw the microscope in the back round. Good move. I bought one the day after I got home from KC.

Which stones did you use and how many laps?

Don’t worry about cutting your wife’s hair, some hair just won’t cut.

Do you have hand held magnification and have you looked straight down on the edge, what did you see?

Most probably you bevel is not set completely. You do have all the stones you need for now.

I never could get the HHT thing to work with my hair, even with a professionally honed blade. The actual shave itself is really what matters and I have no complaints in that department.

+1 to what the rest of these guys are saying. It's hard to keep a consistent even stroke with your elbow down. I also had this problem until I moved to a different table that sat lower. Now my strokes are mirror images of each other which leads to a nice edge. Crox can boost the edge or you could fall back to a small pyramid. :gl:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Utopian

JustN, were you at the KC meet-up this fall? You look familiar.

What is the razor? You said you shaved with it before. Did you hone it previously or did someone else? Do you have any other razor to use as a comparative standard? Since you shaved with it before, what was your starting point for rehoning it? In other words, how did you hone it this time.

Regardless, congrats on the new toys! They are the basic tools so many here used first. Master them before bothering with anything else. More hones don't make you a better honer, except in my case!
:roflmao

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Yes I was at the KC meet. This is the razor that I worked on getting to a fair edge when I was there.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 10Pups

Just my thoughts ....
I think your stone is too high to get good consistent level laps. Your elbow is too low. Do you have a loupe ? Helps to see what your doing. Your Norton 1k may be a little rough being new. This means your going to have to spend more time than usual at the 4/8. Tape may be a good idea if your spending a lot of time on the 1 razor.

Now, are you using the pyramid method ? It is a great starting point to learn. Although like I said the 1k may cause you to need more laps or a bigger pyramid count. Just keep at it if the edge improves. If not better seek some hands on help.


You'll get it, it just takes some practice. Try to stay consistent and don't make a lot of changes at once.

Same with your shave technique. pay attention to angle and pressure. I am assuming this is all fairly new and you have a lot of variables going on :<0)

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Yes. I need to sit higher. I have a chair that will raise me up a little.
What is a Loupe?
I have been using the X method. Even using two hands to steady the razor (light touch). I'm a little wobbly still with one hand.

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Originally Posted by JustN

Even using two hands to steady the razor (light touch). I'm a little wobbly still with one hand.

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You probably were wobbly when you learned how to ride a bike, then your muscle memory was established after your brain re-wired. The same will happen for your honing. Regular practice will sort it out quickly.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bluesman7

Hey Justin, good seeing you again. Congrats on the new stones. The 1k work is the most important. Also until your muscle memory is ingrained it's easy to make a bad stroke. There is a strong urge to pretend a bad stroke did not happen, but the reality is that it is a pretty major set back.

If the 1k work is close but not perfect the razor may seem pretty good, fooling you into thinking that the high grit work is the problem and the razor may even improve with more 8k work, but never reach great.

I use the HHT often, but be aware that it is quite subjective. Practice a bit with a known sharp straight or a palm stropped DE blade to learn what to expect.


My guess is that most of the elbow height problem is that it is a staged picture and your not really honing. If you are honing, you should be watching what you are doing. Just kidding.

Hope to see you and your wife in KC this year.

Victor

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Good hearing from you.
I think I do need to go back to a 1k. My reasoning is that I can only get 1/4 the way through a shave before needing to strop again. I read somewhere that that means that the bevel is not correct.

The microscope I found for 15 bucks at an antique mall, and cleaned all the lenses. Not the best at all. It works, but I would like to have a better one.

Plenty of 30x jeweler's loupes can be had for cheap off Amazon. I think I paid $2-3 for mine. Works pretty well.

Attachment 189654
Listed on the bay $1.68 free shipping.

I shaved at the 1k level once. Won't ever do it again :<0) Just saying, your bevel set should be that good. Then move up. Shave arm hair then move up and do what ever test works for you. And make sure the whole blade shaves arm hair not just a section on one side.

Welcome to the joys of learning to hone

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JustN

Good hearing from you.
I think I do need to go back to a 1k. My reasoning is that I can only get 1/4 the way through a shave before needing to strop again. I read somewhere that that means that the bevel is not correct.

The microscope I found for 15 bucks at an antique mall, and cleaned all the lenses. Not the best at all. It works, but I would like to have a better one.

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Yes, short lived edges are a symptom of inadequate bevel setting IMO.

Hopefully the razor you are learning on is not too dear and you can just keep practicing until you get it. Going back is just more practice.

I have a honing partner where we are purposely dulling edges and re honing them and sending them to each other for evaluation.

I really liked Ron's wobbly bicycle analogy. Keep at it.

If I could chime in. Been honing with the very same set for about a year now.

1) I can shave just fine with my self honed razors, which is pretty cool (that is, being self sufficient)

2) I have endured many hours of frustration, and a handful of temper tantrums. They're far fewer now.

3) the best thing I ever did, after months of resisting it, was to master the 1k. I had to ditch the 4/8, pretend it didn't exist, and work every bit of sharp and smooth out of the 1k. This also helped with my stropping, which takes a critical role in making a 1k edge shaveable.

Best of luck dude!

JustN, I'll bet you could schedule some time with the master, Lynn in Cape Girardeau at SRD, and get some priceless training. Lynn seems to routinely invite folks to come for one on one hone training.

(that's my plan for when when I start honing)

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Originally Posted by AlexStLouis

3) the best thing I ever did, after months of resisting it, was to master the 1k. I had to ditch the 4/8, pretend it didn't exist, and work every bit of sharp and smooth out of the 1k. This also helped with my stropping, which takes a critical role in making a 1k edge shaveable.

Best of luck dude!

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Ding, ding, ding! Take the 1K shave test. It was a Eureka moment for me and many others.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 10Pups

Just my thoughts ....
I think your stone is too high to get good consistent level laps. Your elbow is too low.

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That was my first thought as well...

Might seem insignificant, but the body works in weird (wonderful) ways and getting in a more flowing, natural position makes things a whole lot easier.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Siguy

Ding, ding, ding! Take the 1K shave test. It was a Eureka moment for me and many others.

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I've never done this.. I commit to doing it on my next shave.