Dovo honing issues

So I have mentioned before that I have a newer (maybe NOS?) Dovo. You can see it on classic edge, some gold and tortoise scales. I will add some pictures later....

So, had some less than stellar shaves (5-6) after receiving this "professionally" honed, from a website not affiliated with anyone here that I am aware of, I decided to hone this bad boy myself. It has been honed twice (once from classic edge and once "professionally") now there is some serious hone wear in the toe and heel. They also decided to ruin the nice round heel, flattening it out. The toe seems to have a whole lot more bevel. At least the middle is flat, let's see what we can do. So, tape 'er up to prevent more wear and lett'er ride. I planned to do my 5,8,12 naniwa then vermio progression. Since those are all I have and it worked well for my other razors. One side, got some nice even bevel. Can see the 5k stria, nice and even. Patted myself on the back. Flipped it over, and I cursed. A lot. New stria on heel and toe sections, but tapers away towards the bevel. :banghead:

So I set it down and contemplated. I have no faith in what the second person did and now the GF feels like crap, knowing how much I like the two razors she sent out. It originally came from classic edge sharp enough to split atoms. I could spend a year honing it down on both sides till the one is even. It will take a while, will probably end up losing a bunch of steel. Hmmm. But it doesn't frown.

I would prefer not to get this professionally honed. I would like to do it myself. Contemplating a 1k specialty stone to speed up the process...

However, I realize more experienced honers might have a better plan.

Grateful for any help,

John

Hi John, without seeing the razor its hard to make a call.
A bevel set on the 5k is doable. Tape the spine and ink the bevel, do a few light laps on the 5k so you can see where the edge is in contact with the hone. If the ink is removed all along the edge your good if not your going to have to do different strokes. 45°heel leading x strokes works wonders on a lot of problem razors.
Uneven bevels on new Dovos are not unusual.

^^^^^ Exactly what Mark said

The only difference I would recommend is to start with 2 layers of tape, this will lessen the effect of the possible wonky spine, and give you an idea of where the bevel can end up

Speeding up at this point is actually counterproductive, go slow and learn the gymnastics that it takes to correct the bevel, then getting a 1k later will help after you know the moves...


JMHO

It may take a while to get a bevel set on the 5K, however it is not certain that you need a bevel set. Have you got a loupe? I always try to remember to look before I leap. My best weapon in my honking arsenal is my loupe. By looking first and checking some of the pictures in some of the threads here you can see what the issue is. Here is a good thread with some good pictures.
http://straightrazorpalace.com/honin...estions-3.html

If you ever have the occasion to venture west, I'm in Rochester and RandyDance is in St Paul. Some one on one time in person might be helpful for you.

Other than that I agree with Glen's agreement with Mark.

Over lunch I threw on 2 pcs of 3M 33+ (I think that's the one it is, whichever is thinner between 33 & 88) electrical tape, did a few 45 degree heel leading strokes and within 10 strokes could start to see the middle getting contact. Going to continue with 2 layers on 5k later today, probably replace them a couple times along the way.

Attachment 229115
For reference, this is the razor's picture from Classic Edge. When I received it, the condition was identical to the one pictures. Notice bevel at the toe and the shape of the heel.

Attachment 229109
Here you can see the toe wear, almost surprised the whole round point wasn't sharpened....

Attachment 229110
spine wear on opposite side

Attachment 229112
Uneven spine wear, lines perpindicular to bevel on the spine are scratches from "pro" honing

Attachment 229113
2 pieces of tape after 3 passes each side, can see marker lines where bevel not hitting the stone.

@Rezdog: I have a 5x loupe (workhorse) and a 60-120 microscope(for fun). There were some small chips out of the edge, barely visible w/ 5x. Strop is new from SRD, treated with some face oil (wash my hands frequently and little to no oil) and I check it for contaminants (maybe stropped with it 30 times). From the first shave it just didn't feel right, figured I'd give it a chance with few shaves and strop session, with a few passes on crox for good measure. It didn't get any better. At this point I'm more of the "I want this edge to be all mine." Probably due to my stubbornness...

@Utopian: I will definitely keep that in mind, pretty packed life right now. Have to take a vacation or lose it in the next 9 months, so might do a razor roadtrip....

Have you checked it for a frown? I've seen a few newer Dovo's with frowns over the last 5 years

I checked it a few times, particularly on the side that wasn't wearing evenly on the hone. My thinking was that maybe the grinding process or the grinder itself got a little wonky in production and that was worked around in the original honing. It does not have a frown though.

As long as you can hold it perpendicular (edge down) on a known flat stone and see no light coming through underneath, you should be ok

That much spine wear from a single honing, I think would remove any claim to the title of "pro". I find that upsetting and it's not even my razor. Luckily, you have some actual experts here to help.

I almost freaked out when I opened it up. She was so excited then saw the look on my face. I feel kinda bad for her, since it was her money and should could saved some sending it out to just about anyone else.

I am enormously grateful for this site and all the real professionals on here!

Update: For your sake and since I'm probably the 3rd most forgetful person without alzheimer's in the country....

Returned from the grocery store, made some dinner and back to work. Replaced tape (2 layers) and continued my work. Lapped my 5k, seems to me the heel and toe on problem side are depositing onto this stone like crazy during lunch session (eliminating variables, getting puckered about dishing). Checking edge with TPT and microscope ever 10 or so laps on 5k. Eventually, it almost felt like I wasn't improving the edge. Bevel is still not even on the one side, in fact it is probably .5 mm wide in the middle or smaller. The other side is absolutely friggen gorgeous. 5x loupe shows a nice straight edge. At this point, I'm talking to my razors and how it should be jealous of the even bevel, with her perfect proportions. So, I move up to the 8k. Happily honing away, alternating 45 degree heel leads (~10) then some circles (~10) and repeat a few times. Roll up to my 12k, just being gentle and smooth. Heel leads (5) then straight strokes (5) and repeat. Moved onto vermio, really liked the finish it gave on the Case razor. However, I think I could sharpen that Case on a pile of aggregate and it would still be smooth. I did some other razors with slurry that were waiting to finish up, got them down to water only and did the three on water. Shave tested my Dovo (Whole Face).

Conclusions:
1) Primarily, it was a fantastic success. The Dovo is an order of magnitude sharper than before. It could be sharper, but sharp enough for now and not too harsh. Harshness may have resulted from my tendency to shave faster as I go. Dunno why, it's involuntary for me to go fast in all things. Will work on other razors, get more comfortable and return once I'm better.

2) Shouldn't have save tested last night. My face is not very happy about not being bearded (past 4 years) and much less so on days of subsequent shaving. Particularly the jawline. Will do some stropping tonight and try again tomorrow or Friday. Don't shave Tues/Thurs since those are handball nights and I shower at the club, not risking unnecessary razor transits.

3) Based on how much I used the 5k, I rushed the 8k a touch and definitely the 12k. For some reason the 12k makes me uncomfortable and makes me just want to get through it. Will investigate to see if I have any substantial reason for this.

You could drop the 12K for now and concentrate on getting a nice smooth shave at the 8K level. If you are thinking about a razor holiday, keep your eye on the meets. They are a great place to learn. Most of them have a substantial amount of honing instruction going on at all levels. A few have concentrated on other aspects, but honing is a big one at most meets. You might want to consider upping the power of your loupe. Not that you need more power with a microscope near by, I'm just thinking a bit more power on your loupe would be more handy to use. Most of the edge on a razor comes from the lower grit hones. I really don't think too much about the overall shape of my bevel on the blade or shoulder of the bevel. That part is not involved in shaving. I use it to see the striations to help me decide when to move up, but ultimately it is the edge of the bevel that shaves. If it is a wonky shape on the shoulder that is purely aesthetics.

Great to hear you made improvements!!
Once you can hone a "problem" razor, the others will seem very easy

That's a good idea. Just do my own 5/8 Nanimarch? hahaha

I've been keeping my ear to the ground on the meets. The only problem is my schedule is up in the air from april-may at the nearest. I may have more time for a meet when I'm in Germany for training! :rofl2:

Razors don't look too bad. Still have many shaves to go.

I live in 49824 Laar, Germany. You're most welcome to visit us and bring your razors and hones.

That would be awesome, but I'll be 30 min south of Ulm

That's a few of hours by car. Fortunately there's no speed limit on many of Germany's motroways. Nice part of the country

It is gorgeous. Was able to see BMW museum, mercedes museum and Neuschwanstein. When I was driving to the BMW museum, I was passed by an F40 Ferrari like I was standing still... I was going ~230 kph! Of course, I arrived after Oktober Fest and too early for my favorite food, Sauerbraten... :cry:

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Originally Posted by Uzi

That much spine wear from a single honing, I think would remove any claim to the title of "pro". I find that upsetting and it's not even my razor. Luckily, you have some actual experts here to help.

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This I find quite interesting. Whole heartedly agree with you. It's unfortunate that some razors get honed that way. I'm glad the OP figured it out and got his razor going again.

A little update from a honing session last night. I put the Dovo through some paces on the 8k and it definitely improved. Did what is kinda starting to be my habit of 10/10/10 of circles, 45 deg heel leading then x-strokes. Put marker on the bevel and checked. The "wonky" side has definitely improved and gave her a test shave, skipping the test shave. It was a nice shave. Surprisingly not harsh and sharp, considering my experience. Going to keep it where it is and see how the edge lasts the next few shaves.

Thank you all for the advice and encouragement.

Finally gave the dovo my true test last night. 48 hours of growth is pretty heavy (unless I use my W&B Glen honed up for me, that thing is -expletive- magic). Still haven't used CrOx on my honing, avoiding using it to get a better feel for my stones, plus my skin is pretty hardy with the exception of my whirl location and the bermuda triangle that is next to my right chin. Had some weepers on the shave from the 2-29 shave, but this was easily a result from my overzealous 2.5 pass shave, gotta stick with 2. The Dovo came alive last night, just cruising through my face-fur like butter. I think this is because I am zeroing in on perfection with my new-ish SRD strop. Stropping with the W&B really refined my technique in some fashion. Dunno why, but now my blades just seem magnetically attached to the strop with zero pressure. So nice of a shave the GF asked "If faceturbating is when you rub your face, what is it called when I do it?" She never wanted me to lose the beard, but changed her mind in the last 2 weeks ;)

Glad its all working out well for you mate