Bevel setting meet up with 'Bejay' and my hard steel razors!

So our meet up began with a lot of clarifying info about bevel setting. Mostly what I was not doing and what I was doing wrong. I didn't mind being wrong, I was excited about learning how to correct those mistakes.

Here is a list of things I thought and did wrong. (I know I still have a lot to learn and these points are not going to cover everything about bevel setting but they are indeed for me major reasons why I was not experiencing great shaves or an enjoyable honing experience)

1. I was using zero torque (edge down to stone like turning a screwdriver as Glen put it)
There must be a present level of torque used depending on the razor of course throughout the honing progression especially at the bevel set stage. I used two hands to help me guide the blade so I don't roll the blade over and have to start all over again.

2. Hard steels need harder or more pressure....false
We used just about medium if not under medium downward and torquing pressure to a light set of strokes to finish the 1k off. I learned to let the stone do the work! Which I embarrassingly I have to admit I was using much much much more pressure previously
:gaah:

3. Doing 20 plus one sided knife strokes with no follow up passes to even out the sides.
I never did a set of downward count or diminishing stroke count to even out both sides of the bevel. Which is a major deal and part of bevel setting. I always ended up with a false edge at the edge of my honing or one side would shave better than the other.

Examples:
Do X strokes after some metal removing circles until the edge is passing bevel setting test. Not one or two X strokes like I was doing :gaah:

Do diminishing stroke count after some metal removing circles of course 10-10, 9-9, 8-8, 7-7, 6-6, 5-5, 4-4, 3-3, 2-2, and 1-1.

4. Setting a bevel takes a lot of time....false....(on a mostly correct geometry and overall decent razor condition)
Other than the lots of questions and talking the bevel setting on my PRC razor 61+HRC took under 10min and was actually enjoyable. We used a sharpie marker to visually see the progress we were making setting the bevel. Which was really cool to see.

5. Bevel setting test TNT, TPT, AHT, sharpie test and visual are learned easily...false
They all take time to learn and understand what they are telling me about the edge and that is okay lol

Chosera 1k bevel setting stone, Shapton glass 4k, 8k and 16k fabric strop and leather went home ate dinner and shaved after a shower. Results were exactly as they should be, close and smooth. When I applied aftershave with alcohol and alum in it there was zero 'Home Alone' action, it went on with an almost non existent sting!

I cannot say enough about 'Bejay' and his willingness to help me pull back the drapes and let the light in on how to set a bevel first and a bonus how to continue the rest of the progression to finishing the razor for a shave!!! :p

Nice report. Could you please clarify point 3 a bit further? I couldn't understand what you were doing there.

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Originally Posted by strangedata

Nice report. Could you please clarify point 3 a bit further? I couldn't understand what you were doing there.

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Sure and please this is what I learned I am not an expert so if any of you pros what to chime in please do!

I was doing 20 back and forth strokes on one side and 20 on the other attempting to remove metal over and over again. For me this would create a bur or wire edge in the end or an uneven bevel because it is really hard for me to do 20 passes perfectly with the same stroke technique and pressure so there is no telling what could go wrong there. Just like so many videos show it is so important to do X strokes or a diminishing stroke count to even out the sides and bring the bevel into a perfect V shape.

Do X strokes after circles until the edge is passing bevel setting test. Not one or two X strokes like I was doing :gaah:

Do diminishing stroke count after some metal removing circles of course 10-10, 9-9, 8-8, 7-7, 6-6, 5-5, 4-4, 3-3, 2-2, and 1-1. If the bevel is not set do another round of these with a refreshed surface on the stone or just continue with the stone as long as it is still cutting. Again until the edge is passing bevel setting test.

This is what I learned it just makes sense to me and I shaved with this edge last night with wonderful results and I am sure there are many other ways to get the bevel set.

As long as it makes sense to you, and works. When learning, these tricks and tests do help. Eventually you can pretty much get a bevel set based on feel and visual inspection.

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Originally Posted by prodigy

As long as it makes sense to you, and works. When learning, these tricks and tests do help. Eventually you can pretty much get a bevel set based on feel and visual inspection.

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Looking forward to that day! Thank you

Ah, interesting! I've never considered doing repeated strokes on just one side and then flipping.

The few times I honed I did circles and X strokes.

On these one sided strokes do you go forward and backward (I.e. go with edge leading and come back with spine leading) or do you just move forward?

What difference does it do comparing to circles and X strokes?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by strangedata

Ah, interesting! I've never considered doing repeated strokes on just one side and then flipping.

The few times I honed I did circles and X strokes.

On these one sided strokes do you go forward and backward (I.e. go with edge leading and come back with spine leading) or do you just move forward?

What difference does it do comparing to circles and X strokes?

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The actual stroke is a forward stroke with a reload technically, I am not going back with any added pressure...sort of for rhythm and I don't want to lift the blade off the stone to bring it back to start another strike again. A lot of bad things can happen there at noob status.

Nice to be able to sit with someone more knowledgeable. Best way to learn. :cool:

It was a very productive session! It was great to spend some time hitting the stones with dehaves.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by strangedata

Ah, interesting! I've never considered doing repeated strokes on just one side and then flipping.

The few times I honed I did circles and X strokes.

On these one sided strokes do you go forward and backward (I.e. go with edge leading and come back with spine leading) or do you just move forward?

What difference does it do comparing to circles and X strokes?

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It's know as doing half strokes or Japanese strokes. They're used in the same way as circles at the bevel setting stage. It's a way to remove steel a little faster without adding pressure. When the bevel starts to come in you'll want to stick with regular straight or x strokes.

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Originally Posted by sharptonn

Nice to be able to sit with someone more knowledgeable. Best way to learn. :cool:

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I can't agree more, that one session cleared up about a year of misunderstandings not to mention a couple of ruined razors....