Honing a warped blade

I purchased a Theirs Issard straight razor (H11-6/8-188-A) and it has shaved great with the factory edge and regular stropping, despite having recieved it with a very microscopic nick in the edge. Now upon re-honing, I can see that the blade is actually warped or bent in the middle, the result being that the middle portion of the blade will create a large bevel on one side and the other side barely contacts the waterstone. More X strokes can somewhat compensate, but the blade is clearly warped and future honing will only cause the line of the blade edge to change as it wears more on the convex area.

So, I am wondering if I tape the spine and rehone to a steeper bevel, that will allow more of the blade to contact the stone or will it just wear more of a wiggle into the edge? As I suggested, more X strokes should work better since keeping the entirety of the blade on the stone will hold the concave portion off the stone, but is this also leading to the same place where the edge will wear away into a wiggle?

I have never had this issue on other razors. When I got started with straight razors, I picked up some vintage razors from a friend to play around with for feel. One was a Covalt & Smith #122 5/8 (Solingen steel) and the other was a George Wostenholm & Sons IXL 6/8 (Sheffield steel). First thing I had to do was learn how to hone them. I already have Japanese waterstones for honing my chisels and planer blades, although it was a bit of a learning curve working on an SR. I used a shavette as a point of comparison (those are retardely lethal!) until I could achieve a satisfactory edge. I am sure I there is room for improvement, but I think I 'get it.' Knowing you can achieve roughly 3 different grits on the same stone by adjusting pressure and water helps and likewise I am quite gentle with a strop.

I typically hone thru:
#800 Suehiro
#1200 Suehiro
#8000 King
Imperia LaRocca

Lemme see if I can figure out how to post some pics here. I can't capture the fine shadow of the concave area laid flat on the stone, but you can see the shine of the bevel in the light.

Links to pics:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Hk5...w?usp=drivesdk

https://drive.google.com/file/d/11Mf...w?usp=drivesdk

I'm sorry for not being of much help, but I've had the same problems and it's a big PITA.

I assume the geometry at one place of the razor is not the same than on another place, ergo the blade and edge doesn't make good contact along the entire edge.
I always use a marker on the edge when I'm honing, mostly bevel setting, it's an easy visual to get a lot of information.

I had to grind off spine material with my DMT a couple of times. The razor is not symmetric, so once you start fixing the problem, visually it will look all weird and asymmetrical.

I usually found my problem areas to be the heel area and I'm as well still figuring out, searching the forum on the best way to address this problem, doing crazy x-strokes weren't able to fix it either, seemed like grinding was the only solution at times.

I haven't done this often enough, nor am I knowledgable enough to give other people advice on how to fix the problem. So don't take MY advice on it.

Warped blades and a nick in the edge on a newly purchased TI is unacceptable, I've noticed it on vintage blades a couple of times as well. Some brands I avoid because of it, others are always perfectly crafted. For me it's a sign of poor attention to detail, quality and craftsmanship.

Perhaps this link might be of some help. :shrug:

http://straightrazorpalace.com/hones...than-mile.html

You are correct in your assumption that taping the blade will result in more action towards the edge. And with a decorated spine like that, I'd be inclined to tape it by default when honing. Seems like the bent spine issue rears its head in these precincts almost every day, and recent Thiers-Issard production is notorious for exceeding Dovo in this regard. One thing to bear in mind is that these manufacturers may or may not be anticipating subsequent "rehoning" or touching-up with narrow pasted strops, instead of broad bench hones. I'm a big fan of the Suehiro 1000/3000 blue/white combo stone, but I'm unfamiliar with the 800 and the 1200; but one way to deal with a bent spine in this case might be to use the narrower sides of these stones instead of the main face. Not that the 800 or 1200 would be needed for a touch-up, but maybe the King would do the trick if it's not bonded to a support. Another option would be to invest in a narrow Solingen pasted loom strop.

Here is an article that would be helpful in understanding what you're dealing with and some tips on how to go about it. Sure tape will alter the angle but if the warp is bad enough then it can still be a pain in the ass to hone.

I know there's guys here who will argue that using a small section of a 3" stone is the same as using a thinner hone but I generally find it easier to hone all blades but especially warped blades on thinner hones. To each there own. Some guys blast the warp straight by heavily removing steel. Id prefer to get a thinner hone and work with what's there.

Use the sharpie marker trick and develop a stroke that hits the entire edge.

I.e. some razors need a flat x on one side and a roll on the other.

@ Brontosaurus

All very interesting. The spine seems to be straight though. If you look at the pics, the wear on the spine is even, but the bevel on the blade shows the warp. TI does put a strange bevel on at the factory since it fattened at the heel and toe a bit right out of the box. Not sure what their manufacturing process is.

@ Everyone

Thanks for the quick responses. Based on what I am reading here, seems like its an 1" X stroke thats gonna do it more so the taping the spine. The CAD drawings in the link from cudarunner basically illustrate that (though that assumes it is evenly warped whereas my TI has a straight spine.)

Guess I will have some playing around to do and just call it a learning experience.

I know zhe thread is old, but to make the topic more complete here is a link where DrMat tells how he is dealing with warped razor blades while bevel setting:

https://youtu.be/pP4cP-aY-Wk

Regards

Philipp

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Philipp78

I know zhe thread is old, but to make the topic more complete here is a link where DrMat tells how he is dealing with warped razor blades while bevel setting:

https://youtu.be/pP4cP-aY-Wk

Regards

Philipp

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There is a video showing how he actually corrects for a warp/twisted blade. It almost makes me physically ill to watch it. There is no doubt that his way will deal with it but there are more, shall we say less destructive, ways of doing the job. Personally, I really would not recommend his vids on honing to anyone.


Bob

I wouldn't let Dr. Matt work on my garden hoe! Just my honest opinion.

Nearly all full-hollow blades have at least a little bit of warping, but your TI appears to have more than most. I normally do not like using tape when I hone, but with your worked spine, I would suggest you use at least one layer of tape, may be more.

You indicated that the spine appears straight. I am not surprised. The spine is thick so it is far more stable than the thin edge.

If your hones are a minimum of 3/4" thick, one thing you can do is use the edge of the one as the honing surface rather than the wider top surface. This will allow you to better control the pressure in those areas that need greater effort. When you hone on the full width, you might not be doing any work at all on some parts of the edge.

There are some people who use hones that have been lapped to make them convex from side to side rather than flat. This insures that all parts of the blade can be honed, even if the blade is warped. I know that Dovo uses Coticules shaped in this manner.

If you do not feel you have the skill to deal with a warped blade, I suggest you send it out to one of of the experienced "honemeisters" on the forum. Once the blade is honed properly, maintaining it should be less of an issue.

Dr.Matt is a complete hack, when it comes to honing. And his videos should be destroyed like he does razors.

Garden tools, Roy. I wouldn't let him sharpen a pencil.

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Originally Posted by outback

Dr.Matt is a complete hack, when it comes to honing. And his videos should be destroyed like he does razors.

Garden tools, Roy. I wouldn't let him sharpen a pencil.

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Did you check to see if the pencil passes the "wobble test". Lol.

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Originally Posted by Bill31521

Did you check to see if the pencil passes the "wobble test". Lol.

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:roflmao......