Honing a Wedge/Near Wedge

Hi Ya'll

Been straight shaving for about five years now, but still very much a beginner. I have two razor that have been kicking my tuchus. One is a Wade and Butcher wedge and the other is a Joesph Elliot near wedge(I can provide pictures when I make it back to homebase). I can get a decent edge on the 3k stone. The arm hair's pop off when testing;however, when I go to the 5k stone I feel like it is getting duller. I have tried many attempts at getting a shaving edge, but I always get frustrated and move on to more co-operative razors. Any advice for wedge razor honing.

Many thanks, and Happy Holidays

The first question I would ask is "How big/wide is the bevel ??? Next How much hone wear is on the spine ???

Near wedges can be a bear, I am just getting an understanding of what I need to do in order to get a shave edge on one. I have a w&b fine India steel wedge that the edge keeps crumbling. No visible issue, just keep mounting the edge and starting again. I have found that once I get my bevel darn near set on 1k I move to my 2k and finish setting my bevel, then progress on through. I'm thinking my 1k might be too aggressive and causing me issues. Just my theory.
Secondly I'm wondering the same as Glen, how wide are your bevel and spine wear? Are you using tape or No? Wedges still perplex me, I work on them as I have time, when frustrated I move on.

Watching this one as i have a touch time with them thick blades too. I keep hoping it just time needed to get there but...

I’m watching this one closely as well.

This might help: Google 'gssixgun honing a smiling wedge videos' and watch all three parts, its how I learned to hone a wedge.

In my early days of honing the first wedge that I tried to hone was a Frederick Reynolds 'Princes Own' near wedge (got disgusted and sold the razor to a collector friend) which I spent roughly 6 hours with no success just trying to set the bevel, I no doubt had no idea what I was doing. Later when I acquired another near wedge, I believe a W&B, I sat down and watched those three videos several times. I then would watch part of one video, apply what I learned, watch some more of the video and apply what I learned, then go to the next video and did the same thing, I think you get the picture, and ended up with a very fine shaving razor. I later traded the razor and the new owner told me that I put one fine edge on it.

A few years later I traded for that same FR near wedge and applied what I had learned from those videos and in 30 minutes had that same 'Princes Own' razor shaving like a dream, still have it in my rotation and is one of my better shavers.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gssixgun

The first question I would ask is "How big/wide is the bevel ??? Next How much hone wear is on the spine ???

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This is a very important factor. A lot of them have a huge amount of wear which changes the angle.

Maybe a pic will help?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DoughBoy68

This might help: Google 'gssixgun honing a smiling wedge videos' and watch all three parts, its how I learned to hone a wedge.

In my early days of honing the first wedge that I tried to hone was a Frederick Reynolds 'Princes Own' near wedge (got disgusted and sold the razor to a collector friend) which I spent roughly 6 hours with no success just trying to set the bevel, I no doubt had no idea what I was doing. Later when I acquired another near wedge, I believe a W&B, I sat down and watched those three videos several times. I then would watch part of one video, apply what I learned, watch some more of the video and apply what I learned, then go to the next video and did the same thing, I think you get the picture, and ended up with a very fine shaving razor. I later traded the razor and the new owner told me that I put one fine edge on it.

A few years later I traded for that same FR near wedge and applied what I had learned from those videos and in 30 minutes had that same 'Princes Own' razor shaving like a dream, still have it in my rotation and is one of my better shavers.

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Just curious, would one follow a similar process for a slightly smiling microtome as a smiling wedge? i honestly thought this one razor i have was a wedge, i havent looked at it in about 2 years, as it always would shave but never as comfortable as i like, so i decided to have a look at it today and the geometry looks closer to a kamisori than a wedge (almost flat on one side and wedge on the other)so im guessing it would be classed as a microtome.

One thing I learned the hard way...Tape the spine and assure that the tape is the same distance from the edge along the whole blade! That I find to take two pieces of tape, one on each side to assure the correct angle.
Reason?
The tape edge is actually the angle setter on a worn wedge or near wedge.
Think about it!:thinking:
JME
~Richard
Of course there may be other ways to assure that distance but the idea gives you a starting point!

If it is one of your nicer razors save yourself some trouble and send it to Glen (gssixgun) for honing. I try to save money on that type of stuff, but having him hone a wedge and hollow ground for me and it gave me a standard to go by until I got more confident in my ability to judge an edge.

I noticed when I was honing on a 1k that I couldn't get it to shave my arm really well. Of course after I went to 6k it would. I started doing like so many had suggested in other threads and using clear water and less pressure before going to the next stone in my progression. Huge difference. Arm hairs were coming off with no problem off the 1k. This had been bothering me because if you can get a pocket knife to shave off a coarser stone shouldn't I be able to get a shaving edge off a 1,000 grit stone which is finer by knife standards? Anyway, make sure you aren't using too much pressure on the higher grits?

Are you shaving off a 5k? What is your progression?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Geezer

One thing I learned the hard way...Tape the spine and assure that the tape is the same distance from the edge along the whole blade! That I find to take two pieces of tape, one on each side to assure the correct angle.
Reason?
The tape edge is actually the angle setter on a worn wedge or near wedge.
Think about it!:thinking:
JME
~Richard
Of course there may be other ways to assure that distance but the idea gives you a starting point!

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That is interesting. One strip of tape on each blade face near spine? Full or half strip? Does that make it harder to run parallel to the edge without going over the spine?
I ask Richard because I have a wedge I want to hone but I'm more timid after what I did to a bevel a few years ago on one. Thanks as always R.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JP5

If it is one of your nicer razors save yourself some trouble and send it to Glen (gssixgun) for honing. I try to save money on that type of stuff, but having him hone a wedge and hollow ground for me and it gave me a standard to go by until I got more confident in my ability to judge an edge.

I noticed when I was honing on a 1k that I couldn't get it to shave my arm really well. Of course after I went to 6k it would. I started doing like so many had suggested in other threads and using clear water and less pressure before going to the next stone in my progression. Huge difference. Arm hairs were coming off with no problem off the 1k. This had been bothering me because if you can get a pocket knife to shave off a coarser stone shouldn't I be able to get a shaving edge off a 1,000 grit stone which is finer by knife standards? Anyway, make sure you aren't using too much pressure on the higher grits?

Are you shaving off a 5k? What is your progression?

That is interesting. One strip of tape on each blade face near spine? Full or half strip? Does that make it harder to run parallel to the edge without going over the spine?
I ask Richard because I have a wedge I want to hone but I'm more timid after what I did to a bevel a few years ago on one. Thanks as always R.

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I mark a line on each side of the blade exactly parallel to the edge curve and close to the spine. a super-fine felt pen works well. Then I take electrical tape and follow that line with the tape side toward the edge. doing both sides in turn.
What it does, is to make a surface that follows the edge rather than the previous honings. The only time I use this is on a blade whose grind is almost flat. A couple layers may be needed but the first layer is the one to check with. A felt pen...marksalot type along the edge will tell where the hone strikes the bevel. That should give an idea of how many layers of tape will be required to create a realistic bevel. Oh yes, get the marksalot that is a transparent color, there are some tht are closer to a paint, it will not chip off and allows a better view and water/ swarf flow along the edge...
All one can do is the best one can at the time.
These are just my experiences and do not constitute a "dogma!"
~Richard

Hey guys, disregard my previous post, i have been doing a bit of reading, the razor? i was referring to may actually be a microtome, one side is flat but the other is not hollow ground, its a wedge, strange thing is... the barbers notch, what sadistic person put a barbers notch on it!!

"Barbers' notches" are at the end of the blade. A" Fuller is a groove along the spine of the blade.
~Richard

I am aware of that Geezer, and my statement stands, the only reason i can think is so that in pictures it looks more like a razor.

When a bevel is at or over 2mm, I always go to 2 layers of tape. On a true wedge, I even use 3 layers. Never more than 3 though for me.