Coti Newbie question

Hello fella's... Hope everyone is having a good day.. A couple of questions.. So i got this stone a short time ago and posted some pics on here for identifacation and since i am new to natural stones some advice.. I received a # of responses with most saying it is a natural coti but some saying it is a manmade stone.. I am still not sure and hoping some more pics i posted might give a 100% answer... More important really is ive become pretty good with this piece and it seems to put on a good but different edge than my ss 12000... It gives a smoother feeling but does not feel quite as sharp.. Still a fine shave but wondering if that is normal per se comparing the 2 finishing stones?.. Thanks as always, Scott W (SMW)Attachment 303038Attachment 303040Attachment 303041Attachment 303042Attachment 303043

Looks like a real coticule to me.

You are describing a typical coticule edge - keen to around what an 8K synthetic might provide, but feels buttery smooth.

Some folks advocate taking the edge as far as you can with a synthetic and then calming it down with a coticule.

There is a lot of recent discussion in two fora about coticules and Belgian Blue Wetstones you might want to take a look at.

Thanks David... I will give the synthetic final strokes a try and see how that does. I do see a lot of discussion like you stated about Coti's and Belgian Blues... Good thing i like to read and put what i read to practice because it appears there is a lot of info for sure.. Thank you, Scott

I would agree that this sounds exactly like something one might expect from a coti. You can do a few things to tweak the final edge and in my experience some of these tweaks work better with one coticule while others work better with another coticule.

For your final stroke you're going to want very very light, almost no pressure. To finish at the very least you should be using clear, clean, fresh water but you can also try to put your finishing strokes on under running water.

Another approach is to let your coti dry completely and finish with it directly on the dry stone, some people (so I've read, I haven't tried this myself) even finish with talc on their stone.

As David pointed out above, some people will progress to something like a 12k ss and then pull the edge back with their coti to increase the smoothness of the edge; others, though, will then go to pastes after their coti to add keenness to the edge without sacrificing too much of said smoothness.

It's a really fun thing to just play around with and, in my opinion, is part of the straight shaving-honing adventure.

Paul

EDIT: I meant add, that is a nice looking stone!

TristanLudlow reports getting exceptional edges finishing on his coticule with oil.

Cotis are non-porous, so the stone won’t absorb the oil and you can wash it off with dish detergent afterwards. I have used WD40 and he has used Ballistol. It does seem to improve theedge.

As Paul mentioned, finishing on clear or running water also works.

As he also observed,every coticule is different and finding what works best with your stone can be an adventure.

Have fun.

If you don't like the edges from oil, try honing on a dry Coticule.

I have a few that are unbeatable used dry, I know this is controversial to some, but for me it works like a charm. If all else fails, it's certainly worth a shot.
I experienced both a smoother and keener edge on a few of my coticules when I use them dry, strop well and try shaving.

I have also found that stropping on balsa infused with CrOx after honing on a coticule gives a keener edge without sacrificing too much comfort.

Yes, looks like a “newer” coticule, backed with slate, not Belgian Blue. Coticules are all over the map in terms of finish ability and generally thought to be a smoother, less keen edge that some folks love.

A lot depends on the steel and the technique of the honer. Slurry is a large variable, and as seen in a recent post by Philipp78, (Coticule edges (dilucot) under microscope 160x) can cause edge impact damage. Here thinning your slurry, reducing pressures and speed, and honing under running water can improve an edge.

Check out the running water pics Page 5 post 18.

Manmade, ground and poured Coticules have a distinct line where the pour and the base stone meet, much like a Frictionite. They also have a very uniform color.

I have a couple old boxed Record, manmade Coticules. I will dig them out and post some pictures later today.

Definitely a Coti, and explained to the T, Scott.

They give me a great shave, as how my skin feels afterwards. But feel like I'm shaving with a dulling edge, with a bit of resistance compared to other hones.

Hope all works out, and ya find that edge so many of us search for.

I will remain in the minority and still say that it’s synthetic. You could always send a few good pics over to Maurice at Ardennes and see what he thinks about it. He’s seen a Coticule or two in his day.

I had one that looked identical to yours, but I gifted it to Sebastian. Maybe he will chime in

But the most important thing is that you are getting along well with the stone and that’s all that matters.

Yes Dcaddo1 you are correct.. It does not matter if it is natural or man made.. I am having a good time with this stone and learning a lot about slurry to water ratio's equaling better shaves.. If i cant work the razor i have this stone to shave ready i can go to the SS 12000 to get a good edge... I certainly like using this type of stone though... Like a lot of people have said.. There is something really satisfying about using a slurry stone to get a razor smooth edge and a great shave... Thanks again for all the help guys.. Scott (SMW)

OP here are the stones that I’m referring to. This is what I believe you have. As you can see most of these guys really like them.

https://sharprazorpalace.com/hones/1...ule-right.html

Put vinegar or clr on it and you'll know if it's man made or not. It will bubble if it's man made.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Disburden

Put vinegar or clr on it and you'll know if it's man made or not. It will bubble if it's man made.

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Just tried this with white vinegar on one of mine. It did bubble but not very much. I’ve had better luck doing this with something like CLR. One thing to note-unlike Coticules these stones are absorbent. I let those drops of vinegar sit on the stone for a minute or so and they lingered for over 10 minutes after I washed them off.

I don’t know the properties of manmade Coticules but here are some general indications of a natural stone IMHO:
- naturals (especially coties) does often produce very natural earthy, clayish or similar smell while honing on especially on slurry
- naturals are dense and heavy; even porous naturals (e.g. some arkansas, Zulu Grey etc) still look&feel dense and heavy
- naturals are not perfect, carefully observed you will almost always find some inclusions, dots, lines, different colorations etc. in their surface

Hope that helps
Philipp

Thanks Phillip... Just with my limited knowledge of coti's one of the first things i noticed when making slurry with this stone is the smell.. Like you stated it is very natural smelling.. But if what dcaddo said is right i am going to put some drops of water on it and check back in awhile... Thanks fella's

The smell of coticule is awesome... yes, I love the smell of slurry in the morning... really, it's great. Like mud, only clean mud.

Nice reference.. That was on a few weeks back and one of those movies that no matter what part you might catch it in you get sucked in to the end... Btw, Been 25min and water still beaded on top of stone..